I made my first attempt at removing my float bowls to clean the carb jets last night, but I was vanquished by the buttery-soft steel of the screws, which also happened to be tightened by Hercules himself at the factory. :mad:
I tried one screw with a normal driver, and barely any pressure starts it stripping so I quit. I then went out and bought one small and one large impact screwdriver at Harbor Freight (and I mostly resisted grabbing other tools I found a need for when I saw the price). This let me remove this black plastic thing they have screwed on to one of the float bowls with a bracket (some emissions device I'm guessing) and I got ONE of the eight screws on the bowls loose. I'm guessing the bracket screws (same type) are not torqued down as much at the factory.
I suppose tonight I'm going to have to go out and buy an extractor bit. Any suggestions on my best options here? Being mechanically ignorant has left me with some gaps in my tool knowledge. Would I use an extractor with the impact screwdriver or just with a manual driver? If I can use the impact, just how hard do you think I can get away with hitting the carbs?
My other plan is to buy a real dremel (cheap POS I was given probably couldn't even cut wood) and cut a larger groove so I can use the flathead bit on my big impact driver.
Also, any suggestions on what to replace them with?
Thanks in advance.
The reason they strip so easy is you are using the wrong type of screw driver. The "phillip head" screws on the bowl and other places on our japanese machenise are a "JIS" head which is slightly different than american phillips head, leading to very easy stripping. Most people replace the old JIS screws with allen heads for the bowls. Or get new suzuki screws and invest in a set of JIS screw drivers. You will use them on other areas of the bike/any other japanese bike.
Quote from: Lobby350 on June 17, 2014, 07:05:20 AM
The reason they strip so easy is you are using the wrong type of screw driver. The "phillip head" screws on the bowl and other places on our japanese machenise are a "JIS" head which is slightly different than american phillips head, leading to very easy stripping. Most people replace the old JIS screws with allen heads for the bowls. Or get new suzuki screws and invest in a set of JIS screw drivers. You will use them on other areas of the bike/any other japanese bike.
Well that makes a lot more sense now. I'll have to stop and grab some bits on the way home, then.
I'll definitely have to replace them now.
Hand impact driver took care of these very easily for me.
Quote from: CndnMax on June 17, 2014, 07:32:13 AM
Hand impact driver took care of these very easily for me.
Hmm, maybe I'm just being a wimp and I need to hit it harder, then. Looks like no local stores carry JIS drivers, so I'll be ripping them out and replacing them with socket head screws. I'll order a set before the next time I work on something.
EDIT: I ended up getting a set off Amazon and paying for the one day shipping (only $11 on a $50-ish order). They look high quality with good reviews, and may just save my screws.
The weather looks rainy the rest of the week, so my sense of urgency is slightly lowered. I have exhaust to work on, and new valve shims have yet to arrive.
(http://home.comcast.net/~stykers/screw.jpg)
After I stripped three even using JIS screwdrivers, I skipped straight to cutting a slot in the heads with a dremel, and using a flathead impact. Replaced with stainless allen heads that came in Buddha's jet kit.
- Bboy
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on June 17, 2014, 08:39:28 AM
(http://home.comcast.net/~stykers/screw.jpg)
Ah, now why didn't I think of that? I even bought a few pairs of the cheap ones they had at Harbor Freight when I got the impact drivers. Talk about right under your nose. Now it depends if I got what I paid for.
I usually can get them out and have never replaced one. Get the right tip the first time take a small punch and a hammer and use the punch to tap the side of the screw head to break the corrosion bond. if that doesn't get them to turn, use a sharp flat tipped chisel and whack it on the side of the head at an angle in the direction to loosen them up.
If you've buggered up the heads take a flat tipped punch and use your hammer to peen the chewed up female portion of the phillips head back where it belongs.
The key is the right tip but you are past that point. My method was originally develped to get steering column locks off of cars where the head is broken off when the bolt is tightened. I've just reveresed to process to tighten them back up and reused the screws that did not have any "head" left for any tool to work on.
Worked fine on a 40 year old Honda CB350. Never replaced a screw, also on ancient firearms where replacement screws are unobtanium.
regards
Mech
Quote from: DoktoroKiu on June 17, 2014, 09:49:29 AMAh, now why didn't I think of that? I even bought a few pairs of the cheap ones they had at Harbor Freight when I got the impact drivers. Talk about right under your nose. Now it depends if I got what I paid for.
If the Vice Grips want to pop off the screw when you squeeze them, have a helper with a pair of Channel Locks hold the VG's down onto the screw until the VG's have a good bite.
Quote from: Old Mechanic on June 17, 2014, 11:16:45 AM
I usually can get them out and have never replaced one. Get the right tip the first time take a small punch and a hammer and use the punch to tap the side of the screw head to break the corrosion bond. if that doesn't get them to turn, use a sharp flat tipped chisel and whack it on the side of the head at an angle in the direction to loosen them up.
If you've buggered up the heads take a flat tipped punch and use your hammer to peen the chewed up female portion of the phillips head back where it belongs.
The key is the right tip but you are past that point. My method was originally develped to get steering column locks off of cars where the head is broken off when the bolt is tightened. I've just reveresed to process to tighten them back up and reused the screws that did not have any "head" left for any tool to work on.
Worked fine on a 40 year old Honda CB350. Never replaced a screw, also on ancient firearms where replacement screws are unobtanium.
regards
Mech
Thanks for the advice, Mech. This reminds me of the time I took the wheels off of my Jetta. Steel and Aluminum just don't want to be separated.
QuoteThanks for the advice, Mech. This reminds me of the time I took the wheels off of my Jetta. Steel and Aluminum just don't want to be separated.
Ahh I've been there with a jetta I had, usually loosening the bolts and a slow lap around the block worked great for me. I coated mine with anti seize and it worked great.
Got another two screws off with one of my Harbor Freight vise grips, which are barely worth the $3 I paid for them. Might pick up an additional quality pair if my JIS drivers are unable to finish the job.
Quote from: BockinBboy on June 17, 2014, 08:46:58 AM
After I stripped three even using JIS screwdrivers, I skipped straight to cutting a slot in the heads with a dremel, and using a flathead impact. Replaced with stainless allen heads that came in Buddha's jet kit.
- Bboy
I use a hacksaw blade, then a big flat head, and talk alot of smack about resistance is futile puny carbs!
Ah yes, come to think of it... it probably wasn't the cutting or the impact screwdriver that got them off... I cursed the mess out of them... works every time.
- Bboy
Quote from: cbrfxr67 on June 18, 2014, 07:33:22 AM
Quote from: BockinBboy on June 17, 2014, 08:46:58 AM
After I stripped three even using JIS screwdrivers, I skipped straight to cutting a slot in the heads with a dremel, and using a flathead impact. Replaced with stainless allen heads that came in Buddha's jet kit.
- Bboy
I use a hacksaw blade, then a big flat head, and talk alot of smack about resistance is futile puny carbs!
Perhaps they actually wanted to be assimilated (to your bike).
Mine have so many extra thingamajigs for emissions that they look like the Borg have already assimilated them. :D
I have never been a fan of making grinding grit/sparks/saw chips around carburators. That's why I go right to the Vice Grips
Finally, after buying some "real" vise grips I was able to get her down to 2 stubborn screws. Went back out and picked up the liquid wrench I forgot and got another one off after much cursing and smashing of metal. (Note to self: rage is a great tool when using vise grips, it gives you 50% more hand strength and 1000% more determination)
Despite my best efforts I couldn't budge the screw on the outside of one of the carbs by the long rod-thingy that the fuel line from the petcock leads to (with the T-shaped intersection). I ended up trying it so many times that the head was smashed to where I couldn't grip it any more. Out came the hacksaw, and the impact screwdriver took it right off.
Took me all of 10-15 minutes to soak and spray out both sets of jets and button it back up with some allen head screws (put liquid wrench on all of them just in case). Turns out my carbs were pretty immaculate except for a bit of carbon on what I believe is the idling jet (the long one with several holes on the outside of it). It took me 5 times as long to figure out how to re-install the carbs with the PAIR system and all the other add-on crap that many of the great instructional videos don't have.
I think that is the main jet emulsion tube, the one the needle moves up and down inside.
regards
Mech
Quote from: Old Mechanic on June 19, 2014, 12:48:47 PM
I think that is the main jet emulsion tube, the one the needle moves up and down inside.
regards
Mech
Ah, just checked my pics to make sure I wasn't misremembering. The thing I'm talking about is just behind the tube with the T-connector and hose, it isn't connected to it, but it looks like it from some angles.
This thing is on the airbox side extending the entire width of the carbs just below the air intakes.