To begin, I know on forums it is a big annoyance to have the same post time and time again when old ones are archived and can be searched. So I will keep this as short as possible and reference other posts when possible.
2007 GS500F
The problem:
Highway riding, 6th gear, 70-85 mph, bike will begin bucking and sputtering until it finally decides it has had enough. Dies. Left on side of road for a few minutes until things situate and I can start it again. Runs fine until the speed range is hit again. Rinse and repeat.
The fun part:
Riding through Dallas (HMU if you're in the metroplex) when the issue happened several times back to back while attempting to get to work. Pulled over for the final time and my fuel line running to prime burst. Roadkill...
The plan:
Tuesday (Posting on Saturday) I will going and rerunning all new fuel lines (possibly vacuum lines), while the tank is off I am going to inspect it and do a spotty cleaning job, at least a thorough rinse through. This will at least get the bike running again so I can get it home. (Currently parked in a garage at work)
The Misc:
The actual fuel starving issue has been happening for a few months on and off. For a while I thought it was low fuel but that's out of the question now. The day before the line breaking incident I made the same 150 mile trip without fault. However several months before I noticed some rust coloring and debree in an in line fuel filter on the bike. I replaced the filter with a simple one from Autozone and it seemed to have fixed the problem but again I was wrong. It is worth noting the filter in question was on the prime line (I guess same as reserve?) However it is worth noting the ON line has a pretty severe kink/folding in it right by the petcock. Optimistically I am hoping bad lines are the culprit and running new ones will solve all my problems. Oh happy day!
Pictures will be posted of the old lines Monday prior to running new ones.
Realistically, I know from extensive reading that petcocks or their internals can cause this problem as well as, poor venting, clogged gas cap, carb problems (dirty out of sync etc.) So as I attempt to solve this problem all these will be kept in mind during the process.
While I am not technically inept I am diving into uncharted territory with this fix so guidance and kind words will go a long way! :D
Again side note, I'm not entirely convinced the petcock is the factory one... Again pictures to follow on Monday.
Whatever happens over the case of this trial I will be sure to document the process from beginning to end and close this topic out when the issue is solved so any future riders with same problem might get some resolution from reading this. I will be checking actively until this entire topic is closed! Thanks for any responses to come.
Don't know if I'll be much help, but I'm subscribed and officially wishing you good luck! :cheers:
Debris seems kind of concerning to me. Have you tried anything like Seafoam to clean things out? I've never tried Seafoam in my bike so I'm not recommending it, definitely search on that one, just a thought. :)
Something to consider, I tried to rejet my bike. The factory main is 122 I went to 127.5 and my bike wa bogging 3000-6000rpms. So I had to jump back to what the PO had on it 125. Have you checked the air filter?
Seafoam doesn't seem like a bad idea, the thought has crossed my mind. Definitely will do some research and consider it once the new fuel lines are run.
Checking the Jets and airbox are also at the top of the list when I tear down the carb to inspect it. That will have to come at a later date however (still soon though, will be my first time working on a carb). Airbox might come off on Tuesday given it isn't too deeply entrenched into the bike. I'd assume with the tank off it wont take anything to get the airbox off and inspect that while I am at it though. To be determined in the coming days!
If your valve clearance is out of spec it can cause symptoms like this. Valve issues can get worse when the engine heats up and then subside after allowing to cool.
You should check your valve clearance as part of your maintenance anyway. this is the opposite of correct
That said it could be a fuel thing, but it also could be related to spark. I have heard other people on this forum say that their CDI box wouldn't deliver sparks when hot. I guess the heat makes an electrical connection separate in the box? Or something.
In theory you could carry an extra spark plug or spark plug wrench, pull your plugs/wires while the bike is refusing to start and visually confirm you are getting sparks to both cylinders.
Quote from: hillcountrycruisin on May 14, 2016, 09:23:57 PMI replaced the filter with a simple one from Autozone and it seemed to have fixed the problem but again I was wrong.
Is this filter an automotive filter? :mad:
Quote from: lucas on May 15, 2016, 03:50:01 PM
In theory you could carry an extra spark plug or spark plug wrench, pull your plugs/wires while the bike is refusing to start and visually confirm you are getting sparks to both cylinders.
The issue isn't that it won't start it's that it won't maintain speed or continue to run at highway speeds.
On another note, I'll be sure to look at the valve clearance when I check out the carbs. Again, this will be a first for me.
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on May 15, 2016, 03:55:38 PM
Quote from: hillcountrycruisin on May 14, 2016, 09:23:57 PMI replaced the filter with a simple one from Autozone and it seemed to have fixed the problem but again I was wrong.
Is this filter an automotive filter? :mad:
Sacrilege I know... But it was on the line running to Prime not On. So I couldn't see it being the issue when the bike has the problem in any fuel selection?
Quote from: hillcountrycruisin on May 16, 2016, 12:00:01 PM
Sacrilege I know... But it was on the line running to Prime not On. So I couldn't see it being the issue when the bike has the problem in any fuel selection?
That's all good as long as your hoses aren't inverted
Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on May 16, 2016, 01:18:23 PM
Quote from: hillcountrycruisin on May 16, 2016, 12:00:01 PM
Sacrilege I know... But it was on the line running to Prime not On. So I couldn't see it being the issue when the bike has the problem in any fuel selection?
That's all good as long as your hoses aren't inverted
What do you mean by inverted?
Also, tomorrow I'll be running new lines. Does anybody know what length I should buy? Any tips on the process? And any recommendations on what kind of hose? Or will any fuel line work?
I use the yellow tygon fuel lines and I love them. No hose clamps they just hang on tight and only need mild persuasion to come off.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00FEYMHKS/ref=ya_aw_od_pi?ie=UTF8&psc=1
By inverted he means that the On and reserve hoses might be flipped. There are two nipples on the bottom of the tank and two on the petcock. There is one right way and one wrong way (I could probably come up with a couple more) to attach the hoses. If the hoses were inverted then you would be in reserve when you thought you were in On, and On when you thought you were in reserve. That'll leave you stranded with an empty tank every time.
Alright so it's been a few weeks and life has take a complete 180. New job. Animals getting sick. All the fun stuff.
Here's the deal on the bike..
I went to rerun the lines, of which I only changed the ones running from the tank to the peacock, none others.
After piecing everything back together the bike ran but like dogshit. Pardon the language. It was sitting below 1000 RPM with choke all the way on. Tried riding it to see if that would get things moving but I got nowhere. Left there for the night.
I went back it a couple days later after having an epiphany that I forgot to tighten the airbox back down. Too lean of a mixture, no wonder it's RPMs are so low and the throttle is sticking. Got back at it, tightened the airbox up and ran some zipties for hose clamps temporarily. When I started it without the tank on it fired like new. But after putting the tank on it wouldn't start. After some trial and error I noticed the inline filter after carb was empty and checked all the lines from tank down for flow. Everything was getting through the petcock but the line running from there to the carbs was blocked. I just blew through the hose until it cleared and when I cranked it the bike ran fine. Rode it to fill it up and then rode it 60 miles to a coworkers house to store it for the night. (I was working 80 miles+ from home at the time). During the ride it did the fuel starvation thing twice on the highway but got there just fine all in all. At this point I'm thinking it actually is fuel starvation and not anything else since I know for a fact the line was clogged when I cleared it.
When i went back a few days later to get it I got on, fired it up and it was idling pretty low. I got it going for a couple of miles back home and it died in 4th going about 45. After that the 18 miles left were hell. The bike was dying every mile regardless of how fast I went or what gear it was in. I ended up crawling the last 10 miles home between 1st and 2nd going no more than 20 MPH. Thankfully my girlfriend was following with the hazards on. But the bike would start running for a short period then choke, stall, and die. After a few minutes of waiting it would start and repeat.
Since that event the bike has been sitting without me having any time to get to it. This weekend I am taking it to an uncle of mine's place who has been working on bikes for decades. (No import experience however.) Hopefully we can finish running all the lines and cleaning the tank (small amounts of black and brown flakes throughout the tank), check the carbs and that will be all. I would like to be hopeful and assume it's still just a fuel issue but at this point who knows.
Later tonight when I get a chance (granted I remember to) I'll post photos I took during the process.
I might be perpetuating rumors, but I think that some people here have had problems with stalling after only a minute or two of operation due to bad ignition coils. They would heat up and some broken wire would separate as the metal expanded and break the circuit.
Problem solved?!?!
Well it has been over a year and ashamedly I finally mustered together the time and money to dedicate myself to the bike. Only after missing an entire riding season and coming into this one late! >:(
However, hopefully this will give some other riders the peace of mind needed if they start having similar issues. So without further delay, let's get down to it.
Day 1:
The bike has been sitting a year, first step, tear it all apart. Working from top to bottom the tank had some bad varnish in it. Took a rag and ran a chain through it, dropped it in the tank and filled it with some acetone. With the help of a very generous friend we took turns over the next few hours agitating it and shaking the tank to break everything up. Made some significant progress in getting the inside cleaned up.
The carbs along with all of the fuel and vacuum lines came off. Upon disconnecting everything it looked like some of the vacuum connections had been ignored and blocked off the last time the previous owner "worked" on the bike. Not many but one or two that may have been paramount.
At this point I am going to mention that YES the fuel line ON/RES were inverted. This didn't seem to be the problem as the bike was having issues even with a full tank.
The carb had also been previously taken apart and the float bowls were reinstalled backwards. So that got a very quick cleaning. No major tear down. Continued doing a general inspection and checking the state of everything to see what would be needed for Day 2 and left things there for the afternoon.
Day 2:
I ordered a new frame mounted petcock and tank petcock from Babbit's Online Suzuki Partshouse. This was the lowest price I could find on new OEM parts and they were incredible! I received the parts nearly a week before the estimated shipping date, thanks Babbit's!
http://www.suzukipartshouse.com/oemparts/l/suz/506b325ff870022ba8af9a77/2007-gs500f-parts (Link to 2007 parts page)
The first step was the reassemble the carbs. Used some new screws on the bowls as they were stripped, the replacements use allen heads so hopefully that will prevent further stripping. Got the carbs reinstalled and began to mock route lines. Using various diagrams and exploded parts views I replaced EVERY single vacuum hose and ensured it was rerouted correctly (as best i could interpret the diagrams).
ALSO worth mentioning, the tank petcock that was on the bike did not have the filter on it anymore. Again something the previous owner probably thought was a smart upgrade. Given their "fixes" to the bike involved inline filters and an aftermarket 3rd on/off valve this doesn't surprise me.
This is where I really began to have some questions however. Upon beginning to run the fuel lines I noticed the nipples coming off the tank valve are 5/16 and the frame mounted is 3/8. Has anybody else noticed this? What is your solution? I simply fit the houses on the tank valve and FORCED them with some grease onto the oversize frame valve connections. They seem to fit alright and are holding for now. However I am uncomfortable knowing this misfit exists. Still looking for a better solution. The nipples on the tank valve are also annoyingly close and make it impossible to fit the hoses PLUS clamps. Poor design IMO. Again thinking of another long term solution there.
With all of the lines routed and cut it was time to reassemble. God if things aren't a tight squeeze in this thing, especially with that massive and bulky airbox it runs. I was optimistic that all of my problems were solved and the bike was about to crank and sing me a lovely song. But in all the excitement we turned only to realize... The battery had been sitting for over a year on the ground... Sigh...
Day 3
We tested the battery and tried charging it but the lights on the bike wouldn't even come on it was so dead. Got a new battery charged it and went back with a trailer for a last visit to my uncles. Today was the day that the bike either rode home or got trailered back to my place in Fort Worth so it is easier to find time to work on. (It was staying on the far opposite end of the DFW metroplex).
Battery in, key on, VROOOOM!!!! It was so quick to fire I couldn't even get excited or smile! Simply hopped on it for a quick mile test ride and threw it on the trailer as to not ride through Dallas traffic (in the event it still was having troubles). Got the bike home and went to take it for a quick ride, it bogged a little but I had also only put a gallon in the tank and was running it ON. So after a quick fill up that disappeared. Rode it for about 5-6 miles and by the time I got home it refusing to go below 3k RPM, adjusted the idle down.
Yesterday I got back on it and rode it for another 5-6 miles and the bike seems to be running fine. No sticky idle or anything like that. Have not felt the bike bog in and out again like it was.
At this point I am feeling like it needs a top to bottom tune up. It has taken some coercing to start when cold but runs fine after a moment. Spark plugs, oil change, fresh air filter. Maybe she will run like new? She still needs a lot of TLC at this point. Tires are dry rotting and low, brakes need attention as well as the forks, on and on.
I had read in a post previously one member state that "Replacing everything at once does not identify and solve the problem." However after all that was done I can positively say that the problem WAS fuel related and I have taken all the steps that my uncle (a wealth of knowledge) and myself can think of. From tank to carbs everything is cleaned and/or new.
This was my first true venture into working on any motorcycle of any kind. And while it took forever to get to it, every decision made once I got to fixing the bike seemed to be the right one (for the time being) and got us back to the bike I had before these problems (albeit she still isn't the healthiest GS500 on the road I would bet.)
Which is where I bring out my conclusion! Thank you so greatly to all of the members of this community for your continued help and experience! Between this thread and the countless others that I have rifled through over the past year I found all the information I needed to diagnose the problem and fix it! In February of this year i found out that my Fiance and I are expecting our first born child (we are having a little baby girl due November!) I am not certain if keeping the bike will be in the families best interest or if I should hold on to it and make it a running project, leaning more towards the latter. Again, she needs plenty of TLC so I will be continually returning to the forum and searching for the next steps to take until she is in tip top shape! Any advice or direction from here would be GREATLY appreciated! As well I hope that this serves as a point for future members to refer to when they experience this issue as so many others have.
As a final note, the fairings will most likely be coming off the bike soon and be for sale as I convert it back to a GS500E eventually. Keep an eye out for that if you are in the market.
CASE CLOSE : PROBLEM RESOLVED
Interesting. It is good that you were able to solve the problem. I have never had problems with fuel lines that are too tight. By the way, I wonder why you are going to take the fairings off if you want to sell the bike. The fairing was a big buying point for me--I had ridden naked bikes for 55 years and wanted to get out of the wind and weather a little.
Quote from: ajensen on July 16, 2017, 12:04:35 PM
Interesting. It is good that you were able to solve the problem. I have never had problems with fuel lines that are too tight. By the way, I wonder why you are going to take the fairings off if you want to sell the bike. The fairing was a big buying point for me--I had ridden naked bikes for 55 years and wanted to get out of the wind and weather a little.
It was interesting indeed but I have put about 80 miles on the bike so far without any problems :woohoo:
The fuel lines are a different case the fittings from the tank to the frame mounted petcock are 100% different sizes. Going to have to call the parts supplier on that one I think.
As far as taking the fairings off... Unfortunately some ding bats have knocked the bike over in parking lots a few times along with a few storms. So they are definitely off centered from the bike now. Not noticeably if you aren't really looking but I know. As well the lower part where the end connects to the bike is broken clean across from unloading it from truck ramps that were far to steep. I am sure there will be a buyer for them somewhere. But I am not sold on selling the entire bike yet. Now she may turn into a project bike over time if I decide to keep it, and with my commute being so short the wind resistance isn't a huge factor. Plus Texas. All the wind I can get is appreciated! :thumb: Don't deal with severe weather too often and if it is that bad... I'm just not riding.
OEM fuel lines are most certainly the way to go IMO (even for this thrifty gal lol!) I've done them different ways in the past but this last change, I forked over the extra $$ for OEM lines and clamps and it was smooth sailing :D No leaks, they look nice and were easy-peasy to put on.
I have a 2007 GS500F and the fuel lines were roached after so long OEM are the only way to go the outlet on the tank it's a different diameter than the inlet on the frame pet chicken OEM hose has two different sized openings you're only asking for problems if you use Auto Parts fuel lines
Good to know! I'll look at ordering OEM
This morning I noticed while riding I came to a stop about 7 miles in and the left carb was draining randomly. Smelt gas pretty bad. After I got rolling and finished the next mile I got to work and it had stopped. Any ideas?
A tiny piece of trash or dirt can get between the float needle and the needle seat and cause the overflow. Sometimes it washes away on its own and does not usually hurt anything by lying on the bottom of the float bowl.
Quote from: ajensen on July 20, 2017, 08:25:46 PM
A tiny piece of trash or dirt can get between the float needle and the needle seat and cause the overflow. Sometimes it washes away on its own and does not usually hurt anything by lying on the bottom of the float bowl.
The drain screw was loose... :icon_mrgreen:
All seems well still! Next step, new shoes for her!