What do you think about the 500F as a first bike?
I've been checking out this GS 500 F 2004 (30k kilometers) What should I check/ ask from the seller when I go see the bike?
He's asking 2000€, if I get him down to 1700/1800€ am I paying too much? From what I gather its a pretty decent price. :icon_confused:
Thanks for the advice in advance!
(https://i.imgur.com/XgTqkzg.jpg)
GS500 is a really good beginner bike. Not so much power as to be intimidating or punishing, not so little power as to be outgrown in 6 months, and relatively easy to maintain. Plus you have this forum as a resource.
I'm not in Europe so I don't know local value trends but I'd say it's priced a little high. In my area right now is a 2005 with ~5000 miles for $2200 (about the same price as your seller's) with a bunch of aftermarket stuff + factory take-offs and it's super clean.
Your seller couldn't even be bothered to wash the mud off the bike. Says a lot for how well he might have cared for the rest of it.
Things to look for are the typical used vehicle stuff. Make sure it cold starts, no corrosion/rust, look for evidence of oil leaks, and don't be afraid to get your hands dirty. Look under the seat and at the underside of the chassis for hidden damage.
Chain is a good way to judge overall maintenance as well. Chain maintenance is a simple job that a lot of owners will simply neglect to do. Aside from the look of it (dry/wet, rusted/clean, kinked/straight) put it up on the center stand and make sure it spins with no kinks, then on the side stand lift the chain and press it down with your foot to see the slack. It should move about 20-25mm, if it is super tight or really loose it hasn't been set correctly.
Also check the tires. There should be a date code on the side wall of the tires. After a string of numbers and digits the last 4 should be in an oval window, that's the week and year of manufacture. If they're 5 years old or close to that could be dangerous and is definitely a haggling point.
Every little thing is a haggling point.
If it was me there I'd walk around it, find something to complain about, then offer 1500€.
For an unwarranted private sale its a fair price for its age and miles, least where I am. However 'JCB Yellow' is not everyone first choice of colour.
Disappointing that the owner hasn't bothered to clean it and that in itself says something. Any history with it? Ask him outright why he is offloading it, does he sound convincing?
I agree with the above find a reason to low ball him and see how he responds, dirty/black oil is always a good reason along with rust in the swingarm crotch, play in the front and rear suspension and headstock, tyre and chain/sprocket condition and leaks around the cylinder base
2000 euros for an abused-looking 04 F with 30k km? No way!
I got my 07 F with 5000 miles (~8000 km) on it, nice and clean, with brand new Pirelli Sport Demons on front and back for £1200 (~1400 euros), and the seller said he didn't think it would even be that high (it was sold at auction). That wasn't even after loads of bargain hunting, I just needed a new bike, popped onto eBay, found the auction ending in an hour and placed a bid.
I would say he's asking way over the odds, but that's here in the UK so I don't know what the market's like where you are. Here, that much money will get you an SV in that condition.
Quote from: Kookas on May 13, 2018, 11:16:38 AM
2000 euros for an abused-looking 04 F with 30k km? No way!
I got my 07 F with 5000 miles (~8000 km) on it, nice and clean, with brand new Pirelli Sport Demons on front and back for £1200 (~1400 euros), and the seller said he didn't think it would even be that high (it was sold at auction). That wasn't even after loads of bargain hunting, I just needed a new bike, popped onto eBay, found the auction ending in an hour and placed a bid.
I would say he's asking way over the odds, but that's here in the UK so I don't know what the market's like where you are. Here, that much money will get you an SV in that condition.
Isn't the SV against your communist laws for "allowed" "beginner bikes" lol to much BHP assuming OP is from a similar country with similar laws.
Not so sure its legit 'JCB Yellow' but I quite like GS500 yellow.
€2000 does seem high though.
I *believe* in the glorious precinct Engerland of the Great European Soviet Union you can have whatever you want as a beginner bike as long as it conforms to the ideals (and perfection's own) of no more than 33kw output. On the basis you did an A1 test and are over 21. Otherwise as a peon of the state you must make do with 11kw until you have proved yourself worthy of a state endorsed machine OF NO FIXED POWER OUTPUT.
I seem to recall in France you can have a scooter contraption that can ride on the pavements or road aged 14. Definitely the Netherlands allows 2-stroke scooters on the pavements in some form or another.
He had it cleaned before but lives at the end of a dirt road so it gets muddy. The pics he had on the listing were clean and nice, this is a pic I took when I met with the guy. He's selling it becouse he got his license upgraded(A2-> A) and wants a bigger bike.
He seemed genuine and the price is on the low side I feel like. Other similiar bikes are being sold for 2000-2500€. At least here in Finland, A2 class bikes are generally a little bit higher priced.
I don't have a license yet so Im having my friend test ride it.(im getting a bike before license becouse I get the license way cheaper if I do the riding lessons etc. on my own bike.)
The GS500 is a great beginner bike. Mine is my first street legal bike and I've had it for 2 years now and it's been great. Like Watcher said, enough power to not be outgrown too quickly (or even at all for some people) but not powerful enough that you're likely to get into a situation where the bike feels out of control. Power delivery is pretty linear and predictable, which is great for beginners. Plus, the bike is relatively easy to repair and maintain, so as long as you're willing to learn and do a bit of research, you can probably resolve 90% of issues you may encounter on your own. This forum can be a great resource for any questions you may have as well.
As for the bike you posted, price seems okay to me. Maybe slightly high but not outrageous. Like others have suggested, maybe give a bit of a lowball and see what the reply is.
Thanks everyone for the replies! Awesome advise. I kind of want to get the bike just to be part of this forum :D (jk) I will update on wednesday if I buy it or not :)
FWIW I think a GS is not only a great "first bike" or "beginner motorcycle" but perfectly adequate for any rider of any experience level. It is not underpowered etc., as some would have you think. It's right in the middle of the bell curve for performance of a standard; the 650-twin class of sporty standards (SV, Monster, MT-07 etc) have more power and the 250/300cc class (MT-03, CBR300, etc.) have less. There's not really a correlation between horsepower and rider experience level. Most of the old guys I know who have been riding forever choose far heavier bikes with similar or less power than a GS500.
Quote from: J_Walker on May 13, 2018, 01:59:49 PM
Quote from: Kookas on May 13, 2018, 11:16:38 AM
2000 euros for an abused-looking 04 F with 30k km? No way!
I got my 07 F with 5000 miles (~8000 km) on it, nice and clean, with brand new Pirelli Sport Demons on front and back for £1200 (~1400 euros), and the seller said he didn't think it would even be that high (it was sold at auction). That wasn't even after loads of bargain hunting, I just needed a new bike, popped onto eBay, found the auction ending in an hour and placed a bid.
I would say he's asking way over the odds, but that's here in the UK so I don't know what the market's like where you are. Here, that much money will get you an SV in that condition.
Isn't the SV against your communist laws for "allowed" "beginner bikes" lol to much BHP assuming OP is from a similar country with similar laws.
"Everything I disagree with is communist, because I've been indoctrinated to instantly associate 'communist' with 'bad' and 'bad' with 'communist'."
In the US, you spend a day doing a piss-easy course and go out and buy a litre bike whilst not even understanding basic things like clutch control and low-speed manoeuvres, as we can see all over YouTube.
European licence tiering laws aren't at all perfect, but that they could be improved doesn't mean they would be better off just letting clueless riders all over the roads on bikes way too big for their skillset, giving bikers an even worse name than we already have. To be honest, the only thing I would change is making it so you auto-upgrade to the next tier when eligible rather than having to do the same test again.
Quote from: Kookas on May 14, 2018, 08:28:16 AM
In the US, you spend a day doing a piss-easy course and go out and buy a litre bike whilst not even understanding basic things like clutch control and low-speed manoeuvres, as we can see all over YouTube.
It's neither piss-easy nor one day, but I get your rhetoric. The bigger issue is that in most US states it's not necessary to be licensed, and ever bigger an issue I'd wager a safe bet that 30% of riders on the road in the US don't even HAVE endorsements.
I pass many students who I can honestly say are going to be fine on the road. I pass many students who while they will be licensed have no business on public roads without more training. I fail many students as well.
I think the safety course should be necessary to be licensed in all states. I think the "Basic Rider Course" that I teach should be permit issuing and the much more challenging "Advanced Rider Course" should be licensing. Or at least I think the scoring for the BRC should be stricter. There should be a chance to totally fail on each of the 5 evaluations, as is you can only get enough points to fail on the tight-turn + U-turn evaluation.
Quote from: Kookas on May 14, 2018, 08:28:16 AM
"Everything I disagree with is communist, because I've been indoctrinated to instantly associate 'communist' with 'bad' and 'bad' with 'communist'."
In the US, you spend a day doing a piss-easy course and go out and buy a litre bike whilst not even understanding basic things like clutch control and low-speed manoeuvres, as we can see all over YouTube.
European licence tiering laws aren't at all perfect, but that they could be improved doesn't mean they would be better off just letting clueless riders all over the roads on bikes way too big for their skillset, giving bikers an even worse name than we already have. To be honest, the only thing I would change is making it so you auto-upgrade to the next tier when eligible rather than having to do the same test again.
Pretty sure J_walker was just joking around. No need to get that defensive lol.
That said, I agree with Watcher. I think BRC being for your permit and ARC being the full license would be great. In PA the BRC is free, not sure about the ARC.
Quote from: qcbaker on May 14, 2018, 09:33:28 AM
Quote from: Kookas on May 14, 2018, 08:28:16 AM
"Everything I disagree with is communist, because I've been indoctrinated to instantly associate 'communist' with 'bad' and 'bad' with 'communist'."
In the US, you spend a day doing a piss-easy course and go out and buy a litre bike whilst not even understanding basic things like clutch control and low-speed manoeuvres, as we can see all over YouTube.
European licence tiering laws aren't at all perfect, but that they could be improved doesn't mean they would be better off just letting clueless riders all over the roads on bikes way too big for their skillset, giving bikers an even worse name than we already have. To be honest, the only thing I would change is making it so you auto-upgrade to the next tier when eligible rather than having to do the same test again.
Pretty sure J_walker was just joking around. No need to get that defensive lol.
That said, I agree with Watcher. I think BRC should being for your permit and ARC being the full license would be great. In PA the BRC is free, not sure about the ARC.
Yeah, you're right. I've just seen the anti-European sentiment echoed too much both from other people here in the UK and also others from outside the EU when really I don't think our European model is fundamentally that bad. The biggest problem really is how expensive it is. I bet if you started with the amount it costs to get an EU licence in the the US, you could get the licence and tons of advanced rider training, and still have extra cash left over at the end. I mean, I spent almost as much on my licence as my first bike, gear and insurance combined (granted I got all that on the cheap!). That's why I want auto-upgrading across tiers, because if you've already passed and been riding for two years, retaking the test is easy and unneeded, it's just money down the drain. I also think it's a little disproportionate compared to cars, I mean you can drive a Veyron for no training at all and about £80 (not including the car of course!) if you've got L plates and a 'driver with 3 years or more of experience' in the passenger seat.
I think everything about driving and riding o'er is more expensive though? The insurance system in the UK (and possible the EU) is wonky compared to the States (I can only drive one car at once, why do I insure the car and not the person driving it?) Running and maintaining costs are higher through more stringent, and regular checks, more expensive fuel. Parts appear to be significantly more expensive. Road-tax is a joke too, £60 for a bike that causes negligable wear to the road and contributes no congestion? Why stop at learning :( especially when they are young and have no money!
That said, I think the european model is better at everything else; safety (especially for pedestrians, NCAP standards and all that)), emissions (not filthy dervs mind), progressive improvements.
Except driving on the wrong side of the road, everyone fails at that except the UK, Australia and Japan (and maybe South Africa, I forget) :)
I bought the bike!
I haggled him down to 1850€. My friend did a test drive and it seemed to run fine. Can't wait to drive it around :icon_mrgreen:
Thanks everyone for the advice :)
(https://i.imgur.com/1L2PQZN.jpg)
:cheers:
Congratulations! Now that you have a bike you'll have to participate in the GS500 Picture Game (http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=45412.5560)!
It's been slow this year, but it's a fun game once it gets going. Rules are on page one.
Congrats on the purchase!! My GS was/is my first bike too. I bought it January 2012 and I'm still very very happy. :cheers:
You gotta take that thing to a garden-hose, pronto!