I have placed the order for the shim tools but it takes 3,4 weeks to get here. When I was browsing the internet I found this method (http://gsarchive.bwringer.com/bikecliff/images/valve_tool_zip_tie.pdf). The idea is to place the cable tie into the engine through the sparkplug, and stop the valve from closing, therefore creating a gap between the camshaft and the bucket and let me pull the shim out.
I am looking for opinions on this method and whether this would do damage to the valves as it is likely only jammed open from one side of the valve.
Eff no, someone here bent a valve doing this.
If you're really impatient take out the cams and then retime it and put it back.
Cool.
Buddha.
It is a fine way to do the job, if you don't pull the crank too far while rotating the cams and then the piston hits the valve and you are in for a rebuild.
Yes it was me.
The resistance of a valve to bending, as felt through the wrench on the crank bolt, is not much. Far less than compression of a cylinder with the spark plug installed.
The Suzuki valve depressor tool is finicky and almost useless but after 100 tries, you get the hang of it and it works. Best of you have three hands and very long fingers.
If you proceed with the tie wrap, do not use the head of the wrap. Instead fold in half and insert the folded end in. You want the minimum lift. So, insert the thin way.
The motion pro tool is a dream compared to the yamaha tool. BTW I got it on the first try, but then I have the real deal motion pro tool from the mid 90's and not the kluge clone someone here made. The tool has to have a step in it, not a ramp where it presses down on the bucket.
Cool.
Buddha.
Thanks for all your replies, I might sit this one out or try the screw driver method. It's my first bike and I have only took it out three times. As much as I love repairing it and working on it, I don't want another major damage resulting me not getting to ride it this season.
Ended up staying home and had nothing to do for today so I decided to take Buddha's advice and look into loosen the camshaft. 3 things I have learned:
1) if I don't take off the camshaft cap, by loosening it for about 5mm, I am able to lift the camshaft and access the shim without messing with the timing.
2) ALWAYS, ALWAYS PUT THE RAG IN THE MIDDLE TO STOP THE SHIM FROM DISAPPEARING INTO THE ABYSS. I happened to have one of those useless drain clog remover in hand, they turn out to be very useful in this case. if I wasn't lucky and the shim is somewhere I can't see, it will be a nightmare.
(https://i.imgur.com/YoZhHKdh.jpg)
3)I guess you can sort of estimate the gap by inspecting the scratch marks on the shims. I will confirm this when the feeler gauge actually arrives on Wednesday. But just by looking at it, the bottom right shims look really clean, and it is likely that the shim has enough gap. the top right shim has a very scratched circle. this to me indicates the camshaft lobes touching the shim all this time, and therefore my right exhaust port is likely never totally shut when the engine is running. and by measuring the shim I know the shim didn't get thinner than it was specified. even without knowing the actual gap, i can just order one size down. this particular shim is 2.72mm, so by going to 2.65, if the gap is at 0, I would get a 0.07mm gap which is in spec, if it's 0.03mm I would get 0.10 which is preferred for the exhaust. if it's larger than 0.03mm I don't have to change it, but I will need to change it soon so it's good to have a spare part laying around.
(https://i.imgur.com/5LBh3fyh.jpg)
I hope this helps someone in the future. Thank you Buddha for planting that idea in my head haha.
Feeler gauges are an autoparts store item. And you're supposed to measure the clearance before taking it all apart.
Now you have to put it all back and measure and calculate it from there.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: The Buddha on August 14, 2021, 06:35:33 AM
The motion pro tool is a dream compared to the yamaha tool. BTW I got it on the first try, but then I have the real deal motion pro tool from the mid 90's and not the kluge clone someone here made. The tool has to have a step in it, not a ramp where it presses down on the bucket.
Cool.
Buddha.
Mine has the ramp.
So can you point me both read deal motion pro tool.
I'm sure you have this one -
https://www.amazon.com/Motion-Pro-08-0017-Suzuki-Yamaha/dp/B000UKIN8Q/ref=asc_df_B000UKIN8Q/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312034016842&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5178971711125994608&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1025580&hvtargid=pla-571772565577&psc=1
That is the right one with the step. Some yrs ago there was a bunch of those where instead of that step to the center rib, it was a ramp like they hand ground it. That one was a terrible tool.
The caution with this tool is that it will rotate the bucket as it open it, its a little calculation you do to get the slot where you can access it.
Cool.
Buddha.
Once you get the hang of that tool it works really well. You can get all the shims out in a couple minutes.
Agree...just need to hold tool straight wile pushing down
Just an update... All valve clearance are out of spec, the smallest feeler gauge I have is 0.03mm and it won't go through any of them... And the shim I need 255 is on back order from dealer....
When the cam is pointing away can you turn the bucket by hand. If it spins, its not negative.
But you measured before you pulled them ? Or after ... you sure you got the shims back in the same bucket.
And the buckets fill with oil and shims float, I wouldn't trust you're getting the right number.
Start and ride it and then let it cool and measure.
More importantly, a valve going tight just as it gets close to 0, not even get negative will start fine when full cold, but will want to stall as it warms up. If you kept the choke on and revved it to 4-5k for 5 mins or so, till it got to temp, it will run great till you shut it off and it starts to cool.
If you have that symptom, your valves are needing adjustment for sure, else you're OK, just ride it now that its back together and wait till all this stuff shows up.
Cool.
Buddha.
I totally forgot there will be oil under the shim, you were right.
I pulled the shims out, put it back, torqued it to spec then measure.
The bike was stalling when warms up, and I had just turned up the idle to fix that. but now I know the valve can do that too I will keep an eye out.
Thanks for the information.