Does anyone have any tips for how to remove the shims?
I had no problem using the Motion Pro tool to compress the bucket. The shims spin freely. I could see 1/8"+ between the shim and the cam.
No matter what I did, they would not pop up. I tried prying with a screwdriver, a mechanic pick, and the point of a utility knife. I tried using a magnet.
I ended up giving up for the night as it was late and I was frustrated.
I'm thinking the problem is the surface tension of the oil. Maybe using compressed air to blow the oil out? I also read that using a dental pick can help.
Does anyone have some tried and true techniques for getting these out?
Make sure the edge of the tool is not slightly overlapping the shim.
1. Rotate the bucket to have access to the notch on the lip, then use a small pick to try to pry the shim up
2. Use a magnet of grab the shim
Quote from: HPP8140 on May 24, 2022, 06:59:30 AM
1. Rotate the bucket to have access to the notch on the lip
I didn't know about the notch. Thanks!
Yeah rotate the bucket to access the notch and then use a pick or small screwdriver in the notch to pop the shim up and then use tweezers to remove the shim. Don't use a magnet unless nothing else will work because you risk magnetizing the shim or other engine parts.
Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 24, 2022, 10:09:37 AM
Yeah rotate the bucket to access the notch and then use a pick or small screwdriver in the notch to pop the shim up and then use tweezers to remove the shim. Don't use a magnet unless nothing else will work because you risk magnetizing the shim or other engine parts.
My exhaust buckets might not be rotate freely. There is <0.04mm (my smallest gauge) of clearance in the exhaust valves. If they don't, would the best thing to do be loosen the camshaft bolts a bit?
I have some tweezers I can use. I'd never considered the effects of magnetizing an engine. I'll have to pay attention to that.
Thanks for the info!
The shim is hardened steel, it wont be easily magnetized. I've used magnets on them before without a problem.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: Roofaloof on May 24, 2022, 09:57:02 PM
Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 24, 2022, 10:09:37 AM
Yeah rotate the bucket to access the notch and then use a pick or small screwdriver in the notch to pop the shim up and then use tweezers to remove the shim. Don't use a magnet unless nothing else will work because you risk magnetizing the shim or other engine parts.
My exhaust buckets might not be rotate freely. There is <0.04mm (my smallest gauge) of clearance in the exhaust valves. If they don't, would the best thing to do be loosen the camshaft bolts a bit?
I have some tweezers I can use. I'd never considered the effects of magnetizing an engine. I'll have to pay attention to that.
Thanks for the info!
If you can't rotate them with your fingers, see if you can use a flathead screwdriver in the slot for more leverage and turn it that way.
If you are going to loosen the cam caps I think you have to remove the cam chain tensioner first and make sure you know how to double check the timing when you are done.
Quote from: The Buddha on May 25, 2022, 05:01:12 AM
The shim is hardened steel, it wont be easily magnetized. I've used magnets on them before without a problem.
Cool.
Buddha.
I've used a magnet too when a shim ended up in a weird spot but I still wouldn't recommend it unless necessary. A pick and tweezers works great most of the time.
Quote from: Roofaloof on May 24, 2022, 09:57:02 PM
Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 24, 2022, 10:09:37 AM
Yeah rotate the bucket to access the notch and then use a pick or small screwdriver in the notch to pop the shim up and then use tweezers to remove the shim. Don't use a magnet unless nothing else will work because you risk magnetizing the shim or other engine parts.
My exhaust buckets might not be rotate freely. There is <0.04mm (my smallest gauge) of clearance in the exhaust valves. If they don't, would the best thing to do be loosen the camshaft bolts a bit?
I have some tweezers I can use. I'd never considered the effects of magnetizing an engine. I'll have to pay attention to that.
Thanks for the info!
I've had this issue with a couple GS500s where the previous owner did not maintain the valve clearance and usually the left exhaust suffers, no longer freely rotates when cold, and that ex valve will continue to lose clearance faster than the others. I'm not sure why my current 2002 GS500 with 85K mi still runs well with a 190 shim (ordered from precision shims in Australia) in the left exhaust.
It's annying, but I've been able to tackle it from the front of the bike instead...try to find the notch and see of you can get a screwdriver in to rotate, as previously mentioned. If that doesn't work, I have just used a pick to pry the shim up from the front view as well.
Thanks all for the help! I was able to get them out easily with the notch. I used a mechanic pick and small magnet, they came right out.
Fortunately, I was able to rotate the exhaust buckets around to access the notch.
I ordered some shims from Dime City Cycles tonight. I already have a new valve cover gasket. Now to wait so I can get back on the road!
There were some defective shims sold by K&L about 10-12 yrs ago - make sure you dont have one of those POS's. They were cast instead of hardened steel. They would break in a few miles and cause lots of grief.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: The Buddha on May 26, 2022, 07:36:11 AM
There were some defective shims sold by K&L about 10-12 yrs ago - make sure you dont have one of those POS's. They were cast instead of hardened steel. They would break in a few miles and cause lots of grief.
Cool.
Buddha.
Yikes. What's a good way to check?
Quote from: Roofaloof on May 26, 2022, 11:05:53 AM
Quote from: The Buddha on May 26, 2022, 07:36:11 AM
There were some defective shims sold by K&L about 10-12 yrs ago - make sure you dont have one of those POS's. They were cast instead of hardened steel. They would break in a few miles and cause lots of grief.
Cool.
Buddha.
Yikes. What's a good way to check?
I wouldn't worry about it too much. The Buddha just likes to bring it up. The easiest way to be sure is to only buy shims that are new in package. It was a short time period a long time ago that K&L made those defective shims. I wouldn't hesitate to buy them today. I've continued to run K&L shims in my bikes because they are 1/3 the cost of Suzuki shims. If you are buying used shims, the steel in the K&L shims is usually lighter in color than Suzuki shims and the shim size font is a little different.
Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 26, 2022, 11:53:28 AM
Quote from: Roofaloof on May 26, 2022, 11:05:53 AM
Quote from: The Buddha on May 26, 2022, 07:36:11 AM
There were some defective shims sold by K&L about 10-12 yrs ago - make sure you dont have one of those POS's. They were cast instead of hardened steel. They would break in a few miles and cause lots of grief.
Cool.
Buddha.
Yikes. What's a good way to check?
I wouldn't worry about it too much. The Buddha just likes to bring it up. The easiest way to be sure is to only buy shims that are new in package. It was a short time period a long time ago that K&L made those defective shims. I wouldn't hesitate to buy them today. I've continued to run K&L shims in my bikes because they are 1/3 the cost of Suzuki shims. If you are buying used shims, the steel in the K&L shims is usually lighter in color than Suzuki shims and the shim size font is a little different.
Gotcha, that all makes sense. I bought them new. The price difference was why I went with the K&L ones.
Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 24, 2022, 10:09:37 AM
...Don't use a magnet unless nothing else will work because you risk magnetizing the shim or other engine parts.
What is the drawback to magnetized engine parts? If that could ever happen from taking shims out with a magnet as Buddha mentions.
How about magnetic engine oil? :whisper:
https://www.wrt-parts.com/product.php?id=3297&t=/Car-Tuning-Parts/Oils-and-fluids/Castrol-oil/CASTROL-10W40-Magnetic-Engine-Oil-CAS-10W40 (https://www.wrt-parts.com/product.php?id=3297&t=/Car-Tuning-Parts/Oils-and-fluids/Castrol-oil/CASTROL-10W40-Magnetic-Engine-Oil-CAS-10W40)
Quote from: SK Racing on May 27, 2022, 06:25:46 AM
Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 24, 2022, 10:09:37 AM
...Don't use a magnet unless nothing else will work because you risk magnetizing the shim or other engine parts.
What is the drawback to magnetized engine parts? If that could ever happen from taking shims out with a magnet as Buddha mentions.
The risk is that the shim will hold on to any ferrous metal it comes in contact with and will introduce it to your engine the next time the shim is used. If you keep your garage as clean as a semiconductor fabrication plant then you probably have nothing to worry about.
Or say, you ever have to drill out a snapped off cam cover bolt, you are going to have a much harder time keeping metal shavings out of your engine.
Have you ever used those magnets that instantly magnetize any screwdriver? The screw driver eventually ends up covered in tiny metal particles. It could be like a magnetic drain plug that does dual duty as being part of the engine.
Its not a huge concern because its not guaranteed to happen and usually you are taking the shim out for replacement, but since the procedure can be done just as easily with tweezers, that's how I choose to do it.
Makes sense, thanks. :thumb:
Someone had better let BMW know! (http://someone%20had%20better%20let%20bmw%20know!) :D
Quote from: sledge on May 29, 2022, 12:25:49 PM
Someone had better let BMW know! (http://someone%20had%20better%20let%20bmw%20know!) :D
That'll be Bayerishen Magneten Werken.
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: Roofaloof on May 26, 2022, 11:05:53 AM
Quote from: The Buddha on May 26, 2022, 07:36:11 AM
There were some defective shims sold by K&L about 10-12 yrs ago - make sure you dont have one of those POS's. They were cast instead of hardened steel. They would break in a few miles and cause lots of grief.
Cool.
Buddha.
Yikes. What's a good way to check?
They had numbers that was in a different font - OMG - how the EFFF can you tell that ? Anyway I am glad mine are in spec. (and I have an old stash from the time frame before it)
Cool.
Buddha.