The news stories you dont want mom to read.

[bargovic]

This kid was 20 years old, and lived in south williamsport, PA.  By far the craziest accident story i've heard yet, and it right in my town.

http://www.sungazette.com/news/articles.asp?articleID=5629

[annguyen1981]

That really sucks

[Ripper]

Sad, sad story.  Makes me wonder if the van used its turn signal or not.  Seen lots of wrecks where a vehicle is turning left and MC hits it.

[ajgs500]

People come on here slow the F&*@ down!!!!

[Alphamazing]

Sad, sad story.  Makes me wonder if the van used its turn signal or not.  Seen lots of wrecks where a vehicle is turning left and MC hits it.

In the story, it also said the motorcyclist was traveling at a very high rate of speed. When the van began to turn, the bike was probably half a mile away, a perfectly safe distance for someone to turn.

[NightRyder]

It's because of Violence in Video Games !!

Seriously though, that guy got what he was gonna get. Although, it is ridiculously sad he took out an entire family. I would hope more modern vehicles would stand up to that better. I mean, if it was a car doing 100 then what? It ends up killing 2 familys?

[Kasumi]

I was amazed the bike toppled the van expecially with a whole family inside. Nasty smash, i think it could have been avoided had they been going slower and or paying more attention. Im a firm believer motorcycles can travel at higher speeds than cars safley so long as the rider has a high ability. From half a mile away if he was paying attention he could have slowed in that time enough to change lanes out of the path of the van. Which makes me think he either wasn't paying attention or really was weaving through traffic and misjudged the vans intentions.


ps. That news report was awful, as in gramatically and the way it was written. police said, police said, said the police, police said. I think i prefer english news 

[blue05twin]

Ok whoevery wrote that story need to head back to gramer school.  Prayers out to both the family that died and the motorcyclist.   I don't think it's right to condem ( spelling? ) the rider
Before making a left hand turn across a highway you need to be able to jude the distance the other vechile is and  the speed it is  going, and how fast can your vechile turn.   Distance alone doesnt mean squat.  If your racing at a high rate of speed wouldnt you be paying even more attention than normal?

Like most accidents this could have been avoided by either the Rider or the driver.

[bargovic]

Our local news paper is known for its bad writting, it is def poorly written.

Later reports mentioned that he was on a kawasaki ninja doing 140+. That was what the other rider he was racing told police.  It hit the van like a missle and blew up.

You cant blame the van for not using a turn signal, thats rediculous.  The driver could have looked left, and no one was there, then when he pulled out, two bikes goin 140+ were coming at him.

Sad story, bad road to race on. On that highway, there are no on ramps, just roads that turn on from the left and right.

[3imo]

The saddest part is bikers from this forum siding with the dumbass biker before bargovic states he was doing 140+

The witnesses in the article said he was racing and speeding. The cops said there were no skid marks.

this @$$hole was being reckless/careless and killed 4 people.  May he rot in hell.

----------

these are the bikers that will eventually strip us all of the "privilege"  of riding our bikes.  Wether by outlawing bikes or raising our insurance rates so high, most won't be able to afford to ride.

[Jeff P]

Like most accidents this could have been avoided by either the Rider or the driver.

I think you're being too easy on this kid.  He was the one who decided to use the highway as his own personal racetrack.  He was going very fast, supposedly well over 100 mph, the car driver couldn't have adequately judged the distance and closing speed.  This was 100% his fault, hopefully God has mercy on his soul for killing those poor people.

jeff

[EMTkid]

I hate to play devils advocate when so many have absolutely condemned the biker, but I think it is a bit extreme to say that hell is the right place for a biker who made a bad decision. In the picture from the story there was a long sweeping stretch of road that was the perfect view for a driver trying to make a left there to see and judge oncoming speed. It wasn't like the motorcyclist was innocent by any stretch, but it also wasn't as though the van was looking down a 20 ft length to a blind corner or some flat stretch where judging speed would have been impossible. I think the fact that there were no skid marks doesn't make the cyclist more at fault but rather the opposite. The van (going back to the photo) was coming out of a lane blocked by vegetation and more than likely surprised the hell out of the cyclist. I will not excuse the excessive speed, but I also can't simply say "Oh that poor family caught unawares by that demon motorcycle."

I guess I would just like to see a little less hyperbole when there were mistakes on both sides. I don't think any of us can say 100% anyones fault without being a little unfair. Cars should look better, cycles should drive within safe speed limits, and if either of these cardinal rules is broken, death and/or hell shouldn't be the deserved punishment.

[Jeff P]

If this kid was really travelling at over 100+ mph, he was acting with what I believe lawyers call "reckless disregard" for the safety of those around him.  Dismissing such actions as "a bad decision" understates what he was doing.   That poor family was "caught unawares by that demon motorcycle."  To assign any blame at all to them is absurd. 

jeff

[ajgs500]

This is completely the riders fault.  140 mph+ is just f***ing stupid unless you are on a racetrack.  The vans driver probably didnt even see the bike because it was going sooo fast.  While some accidents cant be avoided this one could have, slow the f*** down.  The best advice I ever got was ride like everyone is out to kill you.  Once again Darwin wins out, it is too bad that asshat had to take a family with him.

[blue05twin]

I don't approve of road racing at any lvl .. thats what tracks are for.   I'll re-read the article but I don't see where it said they were doing over 140 mpg just said the cagers said they were going really fast.  Yeah really fast = ? MPH?.  Cagers saying a bike was going really fast. . compared to what?  I was just basing my oppions on that article.  
Seems to be kind of hypocritical for any biker to say that speeding on the streets should not be tolerated.  How many of us go to the local twisties and do the actual speed limit?.  And just because someone makes a bad jugement call they should goto hell?  Glad god is more forgiving than we humans are.
Was the biker right for what he did . . .no
Should the driver of the van be attentive. . .yes
My sympathies to the surviving members of both families.

Speeding 20 mpg over the speed limit is rekless driving. . is that the same as reckless disreguard?  If so half the drivers in Atl need to have their license revoked average speed on highways around here is 90mpg

[ajgs500]

This wasnt a bad judgement call this was a no judgement call equaling 5 people dying.  Stupid, pointless, and wasteful.  It is hard for to feel sorry for anyone but the family in the van.  Whatever the speed it was too fast and it is completely a mute idea to compare speeds on a straight stretch of roads to speeds in the twisties. 

[Chuck]

I gotta agree with the "demon motorcycle" angle.  There's no excuse.

More to Nick's original point, it makes it harder to explain to loved ones that we ride.  It makes us all look bad by association.  I'll leave the reward/punishment stuff to God or The Devil, but it sure does make it harder for us, and I'll say "shame on him" for that at least.

[blue05twin]

Speeding is speeding. .  . go around a blind corner while speeding.  To wide hit a car kill driver and passanger but senes it's in the twisties it's ok?
Not saying what they were doing is right just saying that it's hypocritical for people to pass judemnent on something that they do also.

[EMTkid]

Demon motorcyclist....deserves to be in hell - Who are we? And who here is allowed to be throwing those kinds of stones (read: is completely innocent)?

This type of issue is never simply black and white and to treat it as such is to marginalize the real lives involved. Lets not be so bold as to assume any of us is in a position to "comdemn to hell" or even know the real circumstances that led up to this tragedy. We've all been cut off by some stupid cage not paying attention and we've all sped (some to see the limits of the little gs, others because we thought the road was safe; ie sunny clear relatively straight).

[Jason]

"The impact knocked the van on its side and sparked a huge explosion, witnesses said"
Just think about that. I'm not the smartest man alive, but if a 390 lb motorcycle hits a 5,500 lb van and knocks it onto it's side we are spliting hairs arguing over how fast the motorcycle was going. I think common sence tells us it was a "high" rate of speed. 140 mph ? It would have to be in the ball park.