My Electrical Gremlin - aka starter problems

[jake42]

So here's one for the resident electrical gurus.
I thought I had a bad starter. It would occasionally miss and eventually started to get worse towards the end of last season.  Earlier this spring I could get it to turn over once in a great while. 

So to make a long story short here's what I've replaced.
Starter... no change
Starter relay ... no love
Whole right side control thinking it might have a short... no luck.

Tonight I got really frustrated and thought maybe the battery was just crap (less than a year old). Tried to jump it with no success.

Here's the thing. The starter relay will buzz and buzz, the cable off the positive terminal to the battery to the starter will get hot and even the cable from the relay to the starter motor started to feel warm to the touch, but no go.

The bike will start and run fine if I bump start it, so I'm kind of at a loss as to where the problem is in the starting circuit.

My neighbor thinks it's because my battery is completely fried, so to prove him wrong I disconnected the cable from the positive terminal and hooked it straight to my jumper cables (spare me the lectures, I was grasping for straws at that point) and still no start.

At this point I'm really frustrated and any useful suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

thanks

Jake

[werase643]

if you still get a buzzing sound..from the relay
High resistance connections are probably the problem

did you test the new starter with the jump box....
did you attach the jump box to the starter side of the relay?

other things to check...for continuity if you are not getting a signal to the relay
ignition switch
engine stop switch
neutral switch
clutch switch
starter button

also check the side stand relay

pm/call me if you want a walk thru checking stuff

[jake42]

if you still get a buzzing sound..from the relay
High resistance connections are probably the problem

did you test the new starter with the jump box....
did you attach the jump box to the starter side of the relay?
I did not try that yet? I took the positive cable off the battery and hooked it straight to the jump box with no luck. Can I just hook the jump box straight to the cable coming from the starter?
I also tried the old trick of using a screwdriver to jump striaght across the relay and that didnt' work either

other things to check...for continuity if you are not getting a signal to the relay
ignition switch -
engine stop switch
neutral switch
clutch switch
starter button
also check the side stand relay

I did replace the right side controls with an extra one that I had and i'm getting a good connectiion.

I will check the starter today with the jump box to see if it will even crank.

thanks Ken,

jake

pm/call me if you want a walk thru checking stuff

[werase643]

just hook the jump box to ground and starter side of the relay
if that don't work  hook the + clamp to the starter directly
if that don't work....another starter...
and test it with the jump box before you install it

side note....

if the starter operates when sitting on the ground....you might have a bad starter clutch inside the left side of the engine

[jake42]

thanks.  I'll check the starter today.  I checked the old one last night by hooking it to the battery and it seemed fine. I'll kick my own ass if the starter I put in is bad.

Jake

[jake42]

begin kicking myself now. 
Just hooked the jumpbox directly to the starter and nada, zip...

The worst part. I've now got to take the tank and airbox off because I have a sheared bolt going into the starter. So it has to come out before the dead starter can.

Jake

[werase643]

the kicking begins when...if.... you accidently re installed your old starter.....

[jake42]

nope it's definitely the new one. I checked with Jughead and he said it started the bike fine when he took it off, but at this point I'm wondering if I somehow f-ed it up when i was putting it in. Time to break out the bicycle.

Jake

[jake42]

Ken,
Problem solved. Finally tore the tank and carbs off today and managed to get the sheared screw out whilst breaking the mounts on the starter, but that's okay because the starter was trashed.  So was my starter switch for some reason, so I swapped in my old starter and put on the new switch and was back in business.  Now that I've got the bike all apart though I'm gonna do a quick and dirty paint job (spray bombs) for the summer and maybe rejet and put the stock pipes back on for a change and some extra gas mileage.

Thanks for the help.  Got any starter mounting bolts laying around?

Jake