I installed progressive springs on the GS. WOW!

[bigburma]

Kerry, you still lurking here? Or anyone else who has recently been into their forks? I am in the middle of trying to change out my fork seals. Been leaking way too long. Have one leg off the bike, broke the damper rod bolt loose with an impact driver, removed the top cap, removed the, apparently, Progressive spring, poured what was left of the old black oil out, and now cannot get the damper rod bolt to back out anymore. Everything inside keeps turning. I put the spring back in with the top cap in place and all my weight on it to bottom it out and have my son turn the bolt with a ratchet but still same results. Everything still turns, even the tube sometimes, but the bolt just won't back off. Any ideas? By the way if these are Progressive springs (long, variable pitch windings, and very short- 3/4 to 1"- spacer) I can't imagine what stock springs would be like. These are still too soft. Of course most of the oil is gone by now and I am going to use 15wt when I reassemble, if I ever get that far. I also now weight around 190 lbs. and have put 38,000 miles on it in 31 months of ownership. That is what bikes are for right? To ride!!!

[Kerry]

Hey Burm!

Sounds like you need to make yourself a special tool. 

Check out the 7th and 11th posts in THIS OLD THREAD.

[RichDesmond]

Kerry, you still lurking here? Or anyone else who has recently been into their forks? I am in the middle of trying to change out my fork seals. Been leaking way too long. Have one leg off the bike, broke the damper rod bolt loose with an impact driver, removed the top cap, removed the, apparently, Progressive spring, poured what was left of the old black oil out, and now cannot get the damper rod bolt to back out anymore. Everything inside keeps turning. I put the spring back in with the top cap in place and all my weight on it to bottom it out and have my son turn the bolt with a ratchet but still same results. Everything still turns, even the tube sometimes, but the bolt just won't back off. Any ideas? By the way if these are Progressive springs (long, variable pitch windings, and very short- 3/4 to 1"- spacer) I can't imagine what stock springs would be like. These are still too soft. Of course most of the oil is gone by now and I am going to use 15wt when I reassemble, if I ever get that far. I also now weight around 190 lbs. and have put 38,000 miles on it in 31 months of ownership. That is what bikes are for right? To ride!!!

Try pulling the tube apart while spinning the bolt out. At the shop I'll put the slider in the fork clamp, upside down. Then pull down on the fork tube with one hand and use a butterfly impact (which seems to spin a little faster than the regular impact) to sping the bolt out. Be a little harder without the fork clamp, but if you hold the slider in one hand and have your son pull down on the tube that should work. Put some cardboard or something down on the floor, the damper rod is going to drop right out.
If you decide you need stiffer springs we have a number of rates available for the GS.

[kml.krk]

the link I gave to eBay is the same company although by some strange reason the shipping is cheaper through eBay....

[Kerry]

My bad ... I never even checked the eBay link! 

It looks like the eBay Buy It Now price is the same ($52.95) and UPS shipping is $9.18 ... making a total of $62.13.  I guess when you said "$65 shipped" you were simply rounding up?

Good job on the cheaper shipping! 

[tussey]

How do you know what springs you have? My gs has been my first bike and I know everyone says the suspension is too soft but I've NEVER bottomed out and I've had some hard brakes, the PO did some modifications to the bike (bigger mains, air/fuel mixture screw) so it's possible he might have added Progressives. If I pull them out will it be plainly obvious?

Also, what kind of suspension do you want for the track? For street riding?

Also, is fork oil special oil? or is it regular oil I can pick at autozone?

[kml.krk]

for racing you propably want to go with Race Tech straight rate springs or Sonic also straight rate. As far as I know Progressives are good for commuting and everyday riding. But may be too soft for racing.

[tussey]

so would race tech be too hard for daily driver?

[Kerry]

How do you know what springs you have? [...]  If I pull them out will it be plainly obvious?

If you have stock springs, yes.  It will be pretty obvious.  

is fork oil special oil? or is it regular oil I can pick at autozone?

I doubt AutoZone will have what you need.  You'll find fork oil in the Fluids or Chemicals areas of bike dealer shops or bike catalogs (printed or online).  Some brand names:

     Suzuki
      Pro Honda
      YamaLube
      Bel-Ray
      Maxima
      Spectro
     Motorex
     Motul

Standard weight is 10W.  5W is thinner (less stiff suspension) ... 15W is thicker.

[kml.krk]

so would race tech be too hard for daily driver?

it depends.... they have different rates. there are softer and harder. check this website: http://www.racetech.com/evalving/SpringRateCalculation/dirtspring.asp?brand=Suzuki&yr=04-07&ml=GS500&formuse=form1&SpringType=Fork

also official RaceTech web: http://www.racetech.com/

[RichDesmond]

How do you know what springs you have? My gs has been my first bike and I know everyone says the suspension is too soft but I've NEVER bottomed out and I've had some hard brakes, the PO did some modifications to the bike (bigger mains, air/fuel mixture screw) so it's possible he might have added Progressives. If I pull them out will it be plainly obvious?

Also, what kind of suspension do you want for the track? For street riding?

Also, is fork oil special oil? or is it regular oil I can pick at autozone?

Fork oil is different than regular oil, you'll need to buy it at a motorcycle shop.
There really isn't a big difference in the suspension required for the track or the street. In either case you're wanting to make full use of the available travel, but without bottoming, with a nice linear action throughout the travel.  For the forks, the trick is to have springs that don't bottom even under maximum braking, and still have a little bit a travel left to deal with bumps and ripples. At both ends you're trying to absorb the energy from the bumps without upsetting the chassis and while maintaining as constant a tire pressure on the road surface as possible. For a track bike, because the suspension loading is a little higher you run slighter stiffer springs. For example, my race SVs use 0.90 fork springs, and my street one uses 0.85s. That's with the street bike being 40lbs heavier than the race bike. On the rear, it's an 11.8 spring for racing and an 11.0 for the street. The total weight/spring rate ratio ends up being about 10% stiffer on the race bikes, which really isn't that much.
Damping needs to be matched to the spring rates and weight of the bike, and linearized relative to velocity (suspension velocity, not bike speed. ) as much as possible.

[RichDesmond]

so would race tech be too hard for daily driver?

Not at all. IMO, good straight rate springs are always superior to progressively wound ones. We have a write-up on our website explaining what at:

http://www.sonicsprings.com/catalog/straight_vs_prog_tech_article.php

That said, ANY aftermarket spring will be a big improvement over stock.

[crispy5]

My bad ... I never even checked the eBay link! 

It looks like the eBay Buy It Now price is the same ($52.95) and UPS shipping is $9.18 ... making a total of $62.13.  I guess when you said "$65 shipped" you were simply rounding up?

Good job on the cheaper shipping! 

Could it get any less?  Yes!  It's even cheaper when you buy from MAW via underbid.com.  $51.36 for the springs plus $9.37 for shipping for a total of $60.73.

Still would have been cheaper if I bought them when I was contemplating the change years ago...

[kml.krk]

I got my springs yesterday. They look great! (long and thick)  I don't know how my stock springs look like cause I did not take them out yet (college is eating up my free time)
What I like is fact that MAW except springs supplied PCV pipe and spacers. So I don't even need to go to the hardware store to get the PCV piep to make spacers. GREAT job MAW.
hopefully I'll install them on saturday.


let me ask a qucik question:  how necessary is it for me to change the fork oil?? is it a MUST?? I have 04 with 1500 miles on it...
thanks

[Kerry]

how necessary is it for me to change the fork oil?? is it a MUST?? I have 04 with 1500 miles on it...

The "1500 miles" figure doesn't trigger a definite "YES" ... but the '04 model year almost does.

Fork oil is a little pricey (especially for a starving college student ) so I'd say it's up to you.  Theoretically you should change the oil every couple of years, but your bike won't fall apart if you put it off a while longer.

One advantange of changing the oil out is that you would have a documented baseline for future oil changes.  (You do keep maintenance records, right? )

Here's a question: How are your fork seals doing?  Any leaks?  The best time to change the oil may be when you do your seals.

[kml.krk]

Here's a question: How are your fork seals doing?  Any leaks?  The best time to change the oil may be when you do your seals.

no leaks at all - so I guess I'll be fine untill next season 

thanks for the information.

I will change the springs on Saturday and take my bike for a spin. I hope for the best.

[elric8467]

I 'd like to know what you guys think about spacers? I just put in a set of spacers, probably 2 1/2 inches and the difference is huge. Very stiff front forks, super responsive, if a little twitchy. Any one else done it?

[Kerry]

I will change the springs on Saturday and take my bike for a spin. I hope for the best.

One other thing.  You didn't mention which method you were going to use ... I assume you're going to do the "lazy man's method" from the top?  (Remove handlebar, remove cap, pull old spacer and spring out, put new spring and spacer in.)  If so, don't forget to do one side at a time.   

Even with this method, the fork oil coming off the old spring will look probably dirty enough that you'll ask yourself, "Maybe leaving that stuff in there isn't such a good idea?"  Like I said, it may not be the best option, but your bike won't fall apart right away or anything.

[Kerry]

I just put in a set of spacers, probably 2 1/2 inches and the difference is huge.

I assume that you still have the stock springs?  (I don't think it would be possible to get the cap back on if you tried to use a 2 1/2" spacer with a set of Progressives.)

Any one else done it?

He only used 1.5" inch spacers, but yes -- Marc Malagelada Duch went this route way back when the board was just getting started.  Check out [his pioneering page on the subject] (from the "Modications" link on the main gstwin.com page).

[elric8467]

I guess my real question was to those who have done it, how they like and so forth.