Progressive Springs- need clarification (PIC)

[ATLRIDER]

Hey guys,

I've removed the forks to do some maintenance. I'll be flushing them out and refilling them with 15w Belray.  This is my first time doing this on the bike and could use some advice to be sure it goes back right.

When I pulled the caps off I found the white PVC spacers. They're 1.625" long.  The oil level was checked with the tubes compressed and were 7 1/8" from the top of the tubes (drained out approx. 275cc's).  The springs are approx. 19 3/4" long.   



So the questions are:
1-Aren't the spacers supposed to be shorter? Like 3/4"
2-How many inches from the top should the oil be?   
3-Does the tightly wound side of the springs go towards the bottom?
4-Any way to tell what brand they are.


Thanks for any feedback.

EDITED: added pic

[AyeKay]

Yes the spacers are supposed to be at 3/4 with progressives as far as I know maybe somebody put them longer for personal settings.

I'm not sure but I use a measuring cup and fill it with the correct amount. (378ml?) I'm not positive do a little bit of a search.

It does not matter what side of the spring is on the bottom or top it will work both ways.

Aas far as i know only progressive is the only brand that makes them.

[ATLRIDER]

Thanks for the reply.  I found some additional info at this link:  http://www.progressivesuspension.com/pdfs/forkSprings/3055.pdf

Decided to cut down spacers to 1" and fill to 5.5" from the top.  I weigh 180# without gear so hopefully this will work. 

[The Buddha]

You cant drain completely through the top. ... There is tins of fluid in the top part of the lower tube which is stuck there when you invert it.
Split and clean it and dry it. That is why it needs 350cc+ ... when dry ... bone dry.
Re use that spacer. 3/4 is just a rough guide. The springs can sag a bit with use/break in, and you got 1/2 inch extra ... it can be reused, I wont strictly go by 3/4.
Cool.
Buddha.

[ATLRIDER]

What I did to flush out as much of the old oil as possible was to use Dexron ATF.  Dumped out the old oil and filled the tubes with 5-6 oz of ATF and pumped them about 20x.  Dumped the ATF and repeated until mostlty red came out.  Left the forks sitting upside down overnight and quite a bit drained out into the pan. This method will get get most of that nasty crud out.  I agree disassembling the forks is the most thorough way.  Eventually I'll take them apart when time permits.

Thanks for feedback.

[beRto]

What I did to flush out as much of the old oil as possible was to use Dexron ATF.  Dumped out the old oil and filled the tubes with 5-6 oz of ATF and pumped them about 20x.  Dumped the ATF and repeated until mostlty red came out.  Left the forks sitting upside down overnight and quite a bit drained out into the pan. This method will get get most of that nasty crud out.  I agree disassembling the forks is the most thorough way.  Eventually I'll take them apart when time permits.

Thanks for feedback.

That sounds pretty thorough. Some people just use a syringe to suck out the old fluid; I think this is what Buddha assumed you were doing.

As for oil level, you can't use the stock oil volume measure because the volume of the Progressive spring itself is much higher than the stock spring. Just follow the Progressive directions. Make sure you take the measurement with the fork fully compressed and the spring removed.

Good luck! 

[The Buddha]

Yea inverting it usually isn't very thorough. Syringe is not what I was thinking of either. I anyway split and take it apart, I never try to tip it and drain it. You're doing 90% of the work, just do the seals and be done with it. And a washing agent, gasoline works better than most anything else ...but you definetly dont want any gas sitting in the thing at reassembly, it gotta be bone dry. You're better off with dexron I guess ... its high detergent 10wt or somehting like that, which literally is the same as suspension fluid. Just toss in 30wt motor oil I guess if the 15 wt dont do it.
Cool.
Buddha.

[Chuck]

I'm a lazy bastard.

I use a shop vac, and get about 60% of the oil out (which is about all you can get with the forks upright).  Then I fill the forks with new oil, and work the forks to mix it up real good.  Then suck out the top 60% again.  Now the bottom of the forks have 40% crap oil, and make up 40% of my oil volume.  I fill the fork back up with new fresh oil, and now the fork has 60% fresh oil, and 40% of the mix which is 40% crap.  That's a total of 16% crap.  84% of my fork oil is fresh and new, which is good enough for me.

I've wasted about a quart of fork oil, to not have to take out and invert my forks or disassemble them, which makes the whole job faster.  Less than an hour to lift the bike up, pop off the caps, vacuum out the oil, fill, pump the forks, vacuum, fill, and reassemble.

Next year, I'll do the same thing, which means 16% of the crap oil will remain, so less than 3% of the oil will be two years old, about 13% of the oil will be 1 year old, and 84% of the oil will be new again.

It's not the right way, but it works.

[The Buddha]

Unless you count in gravity, the bottom 10% has 90% of the crap ... oh yea ... there I have messed with your head ... now go back and calculate.
Cool.
Buddha.

[Chuck]

Okay, now I'm gonna need some square roots.

The crap I got in my catch jar sure was crapulous.  I shudder to think if it was only 10%.  With luck, the remainder is compressed into obsidian at the bottom of the fork when I hit pot holes.  I can dig it out later and use it for concrete aggregate.

If I didn't do it this way, I would do nothing.  Like I said, I'm lazy.  Given those two options, I think I went with the right one.

Eventually, I'll need to replace the seals, at which point I'll dismantle and do it the right way.

[The Buddha]

BTW ATLRIDER - why are you futzing with the progressive BS. Throw that katana on there ... the progressive springs its a waste of $$ when you sell it ... no one is gonna pay you the cost of putting it on ...
A good kat FE will pay you back 2-3X what you got in it. I sold one for $1700 in under 2 days with no ad, I had an ad for the nighthawk, and sold both bikes to the first 2 that showed up ... without that FE $1300 max for something in that condition and would have been harder to sell.
Its common to have kat FE bikes go for 500-700 more than comparable stock FE bikes. Progressive who cares. You cant see it, its not there. Like putting new tires on it ... it costs a ton of $$ and no one even looks at it, clueless newb's.
Cool.
Buddha.

[The Buddha]

Okay, now I'm gonna need some square roots.

The crap I got in my catch jar sure was crapulous.  I shudder to think if it was only 10%.  With luck, the remainder is compressed into obsidian at the bottom of the fork when I hit pot holes.  I can dig it out later and use it for concrete aggregate.

If I didn't do it this way, I would do nothing.  Like I said, I'm lazy.  Given those two options, I think I went with the right one.

Eventually, I'll need to replace the seals, at which point I'll dismantle and do it the right way.

Oh ... you could open the drain screw on the bottom, then run gasoline through it and clean it, and wait for it to dry up, then blow it clean with air, then fill it with clean fluid ... What ... you dont have drain screw ... why you still running the stock GS FE ... man some people never get out of the 17 century ...  yikes ...
There how is that now.
Cool.
Buddha.

[Chuck]

A drain screw would rock.  Maybe I'll add one. 

[The Buddha]

Oh yea ... since the bottom fitting on the damping rod is plastic ... the drain screw if its about 3/4 inch long will punch clean though that ...  with no effort required.
Cool.
Buddha.

[bombadillo]

You can get a brake speed bleeder with a long hose that will take out probably 97% of the fluid in the bottom.  I did it with mine on the centerstand and it worked great.  Got new fluid which is way too much money, and new springs.

[The Buddha]

Bombadillo - you ruining all my fun ... come on.
Cool.
Buddha.

[ATLRIDER]

BTW ATLRIDER - why are you futzing with the progressive BS. Throw that katana on there ... the progressive springs its a waste of $$ when you sell it ... no one is gonna pay you the cost of putting it on ...
A good kat FE will pay you back 2-3X what you got in it. I sold one for $1700 in under 2 days with no ad, I had an ad for the nighthawk, and sold both bikes to the first 2 that showed up ... without that FE $1300 max for something in that condition and would have been harder to sell.
Its common to have kat FE bikes go for 500-700 more than comparable stock FE bikes. Progressive who cares. You cant see it, its not there. Like putting new tires on it ... it costs a ton of $$ and no one even looks at it, clueless newb's.
Cool.
Buddha.

Totally agree but I already had the progressives when I bought Gino's bike.  Also this was more of a learning experience on how to flush out and service the forks. 
Next I'd like to install the Kat FE.  My concern is the riding position with the clip-ons.  Don't want to be hunched over for a long time.
-Is it really agressive?
-OK position for long rides?
-Can I use the bars I already have? 

[The Buddha]

Its pretty nicely bent over ... but its natural angle for your hands and wrists unlike the stock bars of the 90-09 GS.
And no ... you cant use GS bars, you cant really use the katana bars either, the brake banjo will hit the dash and on a kat FE, its a lot. I used to make longer bars for that purpose ... maybe I may do it again in a few weeks.
Cool.
Buddha.

[ATLRIDER]

Buddha,

Sent ya a PM.

[the mole]

Come on Chuck! Pulling the forks off is a really easy job, take you maybe 1/2 hour more than all your draining and filling, less oil used and better job. Do the whole thing in 2hrs, no rush, time for coffee break!