Trouble starting

[vancouverrider]

Hey everybody,

I'm having trouble getting my bike going. When I hit the ignition switch, I hear (what I think is) the starter motor whirring, and a loud clack sound, but the engine doesn't ignite.

I'm riding a 2007 GS500 at 5800Km. Motorcycle was purchased new. I dropped it once when the kickstand wasn't fully engaged, and I managed to let it down partially until it dropped onto the left side, resting partially on a dirt embankment and also contacting the engine block on the left bottom. The engine was flooded when I got it back up, but once I let it dry, started no problem. I rode for another three weeks or so, but then one afternoon after I'd ridden in the morning, I had trouble starting up. The engine just wouldn't catch and ignite. I found though if I rolled back and forward a bit, the engine would start again for a little bit. So I got it started and revved up for a few minutes, and then rode no problem for half an hour. I started it up again and rode back home a few hours later. But, I haven't been able to start it since.

Here's what I've checked:

--Battery. I took it out, plugged it into a trickle charge for two days until the status light on the charger no longer indicated that it was actively charging, then put it back in my bike.

--Wiring. Every wire I can get at without removing the gas tank, I've checked. Also the fuse looks fine. No evidence of frayed wires, broken connections, anything.

--Spark plugs. The overhanging metal bit looks a little white, and there's a black burnt mark on the white porcelain in about the same place on both plugs. I can't get a spark when I press the ignition switch with the spark plugs out. BUT--do I need to have them grounded in order to get a spark? I just had them out and plugged into the caps.


So, I'm wondering if my battery just doesn't have enough charge? Can I check the battery with a multimeter, or do I have to check the specific gravity of each of the cells?

Any help would be great.

[Rickyz80]

You know it may not be the case seeing as how much you tended to the battery, but did you try checking the fluid level.  Batteries have liquid in them and a drain out hole to get rid of excess fluid out the bottom of the bike.  You can try checking the level and add water to fill it up to the upper line.  Chances are this isn't the problem, but minds as well eliminate teh stupid things. 
One more thing you can check is if the float in the carburator is stuck, and I heard tapping on the carb with a screwdriver will loosen it up.  But you may want to check on that one before hitting stuff.  It sounds like a fuel problem to me and shaking the bike may give it a bit of fuel to just try to start.  If fuel is not be getting to the engine, check the petcocks and lines for any problems or clogs. 
Engines need three things to start: Fuel, Spark, Compression.  So go from there-Good luck!

[beRto]

Hey everybody,

I'm having trouble getting my bike going. When I hit the ignition switch, I hear (what I think is) the starter motor whirring, and a loud clack sound, but the engine doesn't ignite.

Welcome to the forums! I live in Vancouver too. 

I'm riding a 2007 GS500 at 5800Km. Motorcycle was purchased new. I dropped it once when the kickstand wasn't fully engaged, and I managed to let it down partially until it dropped onto the left side, resting partially on a dirt embankment and also contacting the engine block on the left bottom. The engine was flooded when I got it back up, but once I let it dry, started no problem. I rode for another three weeks or so, but then one afternoon after I'd ridden in the morning, I had trouble starting up. The engine just wouldn't catch and ignite. I found though if I rolled back and forward a bit, the engine would start again for a little bit. So I got it started and revved up for a few minutes, and then rode no problem for half an hour. I started it up again and rode back home a few hours later. But, I haven't been able to start it since.

Here's what I've checked:

--Battery. I took it out, plugged it into a trickle charge for two days until the status light on the charger no longer indicated that it was actively charging, then put it back in my bike.

Are the fluid levels in the battery full? How was the battery stored last winter?
Based on your description above, I suspect the problem is with the battery. I would suggest taking the battery to a shop and having it load tested (this is often free because they want to sell you a battery if yours fails).

--Wiring. Every wire I can get at without removing the gas tank, I've checked. Also the fuse looks fine. No evidence of frayed wires, broken connections, anything.

Keep looking in this direction only after the battery is tested and confirmed to be good.

--Spark plugs. The overhanging metal bit looks a little white, and there's a black burnt mark on the white porcelain in about the same place on both plugs. I can't get a spark when I press the ignition switch with the spark plugs out. BUT--do I need to have them grounded in order to get a spark? I just had them out and plugged into the caps.

The spark plugs must be grounded in order to produce a spark. This is normally accomplished when the spark plug is screwed into the engine block. You can achieve a similar effect by holding the plug against the engine block while you press the starter. Be careful. There is the potential to shock yourself if you touch the conductive part of the plug. You may want to use a pair of insulated pliers and only handle by the rubber parts.

So, I'm wondering if my battery just doesn't have enough charge? Can I check the battery with a multimeter, or do I have to check the specific gravity of each of the cells?

Any help would be great.

I think it's the battery. If you have a multimeter, you can use Kerry's how to to check the charging system, but this won't tell you if the battery itself is in good shape or not:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=38480.0

Good luck. And keep us updated on progress! 

[vancouverrider]

Thanks for the advice! I took my battery out and sure enough, two of the cells are below the fill line. I'll pick up some distilled water soon and bring the levels up to where they should be.

Last winter I stored the battery inside hooked up to a trickle charger/battery mender, but I guess I should have checked the levels once or twice during the summer. I was riding about 45km every weekday to and from work since April or so, and I guess maybe the heat during the summer and the constant riding made the battery levels drop.

I'm learning lots by making dumb mistakes--good way to get to know my bike!

[vancouverrider]

Update--my progress is slow because I've got no time

I've taken out the battery and two of the cells were below the min line. I refilled them with steam distilled water and left the battery hooked up to a battery tender for about a week, then tried it out. No dice. I tried testing the battery with a hydrometer but the only one I could find was this dinky little motomaster thing that I couldn't really get a clear reading from. I'm pretty sure that one of the cells I tested was completely dead (no floaty balls) and another was at 1/4 or 1/2 charge. The next seemed like it was at 3/4 or full! I don't get it. Shouldn't they all be around the same, given they were discharging at the same rate while I operated the motorcycle?

Now, if the battery was just low, wouldn't it still get the engine cranking a little bit? All I hear is a single clack, and at the same time something (from the engine block, right where the starter motor is) spinning. Just like a little remote control car.

I just tried jumping her with a car battery, and no difference. I'm not sure I did it right though--I hooked the negative and positive clamps to the car battery terminals and then the positive clamp to the motorcycle battery, screwed into the motorcycle as it should be, and grounded the negative cable on the motorcycle frame. Should I just take the battery out altogether and use the jumper cables to hook up the car battery to the motorcycle? I'm a little clueless when it comes to electric stuff like this.

I'm trying to decide if I should tow her out to the dealership and just let them figure it out. That, or take a risk and buy a new battery. What do you guys think?

[vancouverrider]

Okay, I just found this answer to a question about starter problems:

The larger terminals on the solenoid are tested by listening for the "click" sound when starter button is pressed while starting engine. What's happening when you hear the click is the solenoid is an electro-magnet. When the starter button is depressed, battery voltage through the small wire creates a magnet effect inside the solenoid. This attracts the high current contact (a spring loaded T-shaped contact inside the solenoid) to travel upwards and connect with the two large exterior terminals on top of solenoid (heavy cable leads 10 gauge wire). When this connection is completed, current flows to the starter motor for starting engine.

Now, I'm guessing the clack I hear is the solenoid. And it's allowing the current to flow to the starter motor. Maybe not enough current though, and that's why the engine isn't cranking?

[ke7syv]

Okay, I just found this answer to a question about starter problems:

The larger terminals on the solenoid are tested by listening for the "click" sound when starter button is pressed while starting engine. What's happening when you hear the click is the solenoid is an electro-magnet. When the starter button is depressed, battery voltage through the small wire creates a magnet effect inside the solenoid. This attracts the high current contact (a spring loaded T-shaped contact inside the solenoid) to travel upwards and connect with the two large exterior terminals on top of solenoid (heavy cable leads 10 gauge wire). When this connection is completed, current flows to the starter motor for starting engine.

Now, I'm guessing the clack I hear is the solenoid. And it's allowing the current to flow to the starter motor. Maybe not enough current though, and that's why the engine isn't cranking?

If that was your only problem you should have been able to jump the bike with your car battery.

[ke7syv]

Update--my progress is slow because I've got no time

Now, if the battery was just low, wouldn't it still get the engine cranking a little bit? All I hear is a single clack, and at the same time something (from the engine block, right where the starter motor is) spinning. Just like a little remote control car.

I just tried jumping her with a car battery, and no difference. I'm not sure I did it right though--I hooked the negative and positive clamps to the car battery terminals and then the positive clamp to the motorcycle battery, screwed into the motorcycle as it should be, and grounded the negative cable on the motorcycle frame. Should I just take the battery out altogether and use the jumper cables to hook up the car battery to the motorcycle? I'm a little clueless when it comes to electric stuff like this.

The spinning is the starter motor, it's spinning quickly because it's not engaged. When you jump your bike make sure the negative cable is touching bare metal on the frame otherwise it won't ground.

[vancouverrider]

Okay. Sounds like I've got more than a dead battery issue, huh? Thanks for the help again. I'm going to start looking into what I can do (myself) about my starter motor.

[beRto]

Okay. Sounds like I've got more than a dead battery issue, huh? Thanks for the help again. I'm going to start looking into what I can do (myself) about my starter motor.

Maybe try to jump start it again? This time, connect the negative cable to the negative battery terminal. If it starts, it's still a battery issue.

[ke7syv]

Okay. Sounds like I've got more than a dead battery issue, huh? Thanks for the help again. I'm going to start looking into what I can do (myself) about my starter motor.

Maybe try to jump start it again? This time, connect the negative cable to the negative battery terminal. If it starts, it's still a battery issue.

Keep the sparks to a minimum!

[beRto]

Okay. Sounds like I've got more than a dead battery issue, huh? Thanks for the help again. I'm going to start looking into what I can do (myself) about my starter motor.

Maybe try to jump start it again? This time, connect the negative cable to the negative battery terminal. If it starts, it's still a battery issue.

Keep the sparks to a minimum!

If it starts with a boost, there is a problem with the bike's battery. I agree, sparks are generally not good

Ideally, this whole trouble could be avoided by taking the battery to a shop for a load test. Vancouverrider, I'm sure you could find a place that would do this for free. PM me if you need some local suggestions. I'd offer to bring my battery over, but I just sold my bike yesterday 

[DoD#i]

See if this helps. Sounds like you are spinning the starter motor, but not much else. "Clutch dogs" not working? missing gear teeth? Don't know - but if you hear a "whirring" from the motor area, it's probably not the battery or solenoid.

http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=14008.0

There may be another thread or 10 that goes into this, but the one above will get you started on the mechanical route. Here's two more. Search on starter clutch for even more.

http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=40232.0
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=4280.0

[vancouverrider]

BeRto, I appreciate the offer. Very cool. I'm only a few blocks away from a shop at 33rd and MacKenzie, so I'll give them a ring and see if I can bring my battery in. Maybe Canadian Tire would do it too.

At first I thought it'd be fun to figure this out myself. It was until I started getting rained out! I swear Vancouver has been drenched 29 out the past 30 days.

I'll definitely get my battery load tested and then start worrying about my starter clutch, motor, and gears! (hopefully not  )

DoD#i, thanks for those links. I'd been searching "starter motor" and had chased all those leads down