Killing time... Paint Project Thread

[BaltimoreGS]

My recent unscheduled employment gap has left me with a lot of free time so I killed some time today prepping an old Honda Shadow for a repaint.  The bike had already been repainted once before so there were multiple layers of paint.  I decided to chemically strip the tank to bare metal and start from scratch.  That also revealed a dent that had been bondo-ed.  Here'e some pics of today's progress.

-Jessie


The stripped and sanded tank



The dented spot.  I will be digging out the old bondo and redoing it at a later date



Basic auto store primer to hold back the rust



Painting in my typical less than ideal circumstances




It's a bit cold out so I brought it inside to dry over night

[ver4]

Looks good so far.  What color?

[PaviSays]

Lookin' good!  I can't wait to see how it turns out.

[tt_four]

Hmm.... not that I don't like a good tank repaint, but I've gotta say I was disappointed when I opened this thread after reading the title. I initially read it as if it was "killing time", not as if you were killing time. Kinda like "dinner time" is time for dinner, "killing time" is time for killing. Right?

[BaltimoreGS]

TT_four- Sorry to disappoint you...       There, I shot afro man for you   

Pavi- Thanks, I'll post pics as the project progresses

ver4- No idea on color yet, that's Kay's department since she'll be riding it.  Matte uranium like a Honda 919 would have been my choice but she shot that color down.  We're going to swing by that Sherwin Williams store by your gym and check out the chip charts one day next week.  As long as it doesn't have any ghey pink graphics....    Have you put any thoughts into repainting your bike?

-Jessie 

[Adfalchius]

As long as it doesn't have any ghey pink graphics.... 
-Jessie 

Now you just forced me to chime in- you're ridiculous.  Let me remind you- the last bike we painted was originally a SPARKLE pink that you couldn't resist to ride around Baltimore.  You were even sorry that I wanted to change the color.  So ver4- if you do decide to paint 'ghey pink', by all means, do so.  Just know that I won't be the one asking to ride it.

[tt_four]

Actually, I don't know why I didn't browse through the whole thing last time, as I am actually pretty interested in painting bikes. Haven't done much beyond spray painting the GS, but I'm looking to get a decent enough first spray gun over winter so I can try to do some nicer paint jobs. When I say decent, I'm hoping to not spend more than $100, and am just compairing the quality to the $35-45 ones they have at home depot. I know $100 really isn't all that great for a paint gun. 

Unfortunately now that I'm looking through this again, I'm at work and can't actually get the pictures to load, so I'll check it out better when I'm at home, but how are you actually going to paint it? Do you have a paint gun, or are you just picking up spray paint at sherwin williams that happens to be nicer than what they have at home depot?

I asked some questions on another board I'm on where people do a lot of custom work to bikes, and even though I'm just looking to get started, I got attacked with people telling me I need 3 seperate spray guns and all kinds of other things that were over my head, bringing me up to at least a couple hundred more than I wanted to spend. Since you say you're painting in your "typical less than ideal circumstances", I'm much more curious what you're doing, as opposed to all those guys with dedicated painting spaces and really nice equipment."

[ver4]

Kay, I do not plan on painting my bike a ghey pink. lol

Jessie, I need to figure out how much money I have for a project.  I have a client who went on vacation and I don't get paid when he's on vacation and that's going to take a big chunk out of the pay. However, if I do paint it, I want to keep it a red color.

[BaltimoreGS]

tt_four-  We are using decent equipment in less than ideal circumstances.  The prep work on this will be done with bondo for the big dent and some dings, glazing putty for small imperfections, and rattle can primer.  The first coat of primer is a rust inhibitor because I (edit: with the help of Kay   ) stripped to bare metal, from this point on I will use a high build sandable primer.  In the past I have used House of Colors Y2K Urethane primer in a real paint spray gun.  For convenience/cost I will be using rattle can primer on this project.  The base coat/clear coat will be sprayed with a gun.  On a bike like this (tank and small fenders) I should be able to easily get away with only 1/2 a quart of each and still have a little left over.  If you don't have multiple layers of paint you can get away with just scuffing up the original paint.  Some people paint right over that but I prefer to prime it to get a uniform base color.  This bike had already been repainted once over top of the original paint.  If you already have spray painted yours once I would sand back down (or chemically strip for the metal tank, not the plastic fairings!!) before recoating.  If you get too many layers of paint it will look like a cracked M&M if you ding it.

A good paint job is 90% prep work.  The more effort you put into the prep, the better your end results will be.  Depending on your starting point and the end result you are looking for there can be many hours involved with priming, sanding and glazing to get a nice smooth surface.  It is the labor time involved that makes paint work at a shop expensive, the materials are relatively cheap in comparison.

You can get a decent paint gun for around $100 if you shop around.  You will also need a pressure regulator, a decent air compressor and a "last chance" inline filter.  I like the filters that change color when they are worn out.  Check out Eastwood Automotive for some ideas of what's available:  http://www.eastwood.com/paint-equipment/paint-guns.html?order=price&dir=asc   The biggest challenge with any spray gun no matter the price is getting the spray pattern dailed in.  Even a top quality gun will give a horrible blotchy finish if you don't have it adjusted corectly.  You don't need to have multiple guns but you will need different tips for spraying different paints.  Primers are generally thicker than clears which are general thicker than base coats...

Then your next consideration is what type of paint you will be using.  The cheapest and easiest paint to spray is acrylic enamel.  We call it "playground paint" because that is what is used on playground equipment and industrial equipment.  It covers well with minimal coats and is pretty durable once cured.  If sprayed correctly it can give you a decently nice end result.  The industry standard now is urethane base coat/clear coat.  That will give you the best quality results but becuase it takes multiple coats of paint (typically 3 color coats & 2 clear coats) there are more chances to get dirt/debris in the paint.  Most small imperfections lift to the top of the paint and can be sanded out.  You also have more chances for runs if you spray too heavy but they can be minimized with sanding too.  There are also things called tack rags you use to wipe the parts down before spraying and between color coats.  And simple things like wetting the floor can help keep dust from kicking up.  Check out TCP Global for painting supplies: http://www.tcpglobal.com/  For Kay's bike she got a special paint color from Sherwin Williams that sprayed really nice.  That is the first time using their paint so I can't attest to durability yet.  Check this thread for more info on that paint project:  http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=50627.0

Kay- I was referring to the faded tank graphic on Victor's bike, it looks pink.  And yes, I did enjoy rocking the Barbie GS.  Pig noticed me riding around on that before he even knew it was me on it.  I still had the long hair at the time so I just looked like an ugly fat woman  

Victor- I'm with you on the funds shortage thing, that's why this is a rattle can project so far.  I need to strike a balance between broke and boredom at the moment.  Check out that TCP site for different production color reds and see if any are in your price range.

Well that's all the babble I have to spew at the moment, time to go bondo...

-Jessie

Edit:
tt_four- Had an after thought after writing the above.  Since this would be your first time using a spray gun it would probably be a good idea for you to use a canned primer like the Y2K so you could get used to the dynamics of a spray gun before spraying the top coats.

[BaltimoreGS]

Some more boredom averted and time killed......

-Jessie

Going back a step, here's the stripper I used for the tank which is available at any hardware store.  Dab on a heavy coat in one section with a paint brush, wait for it to do it's magic, scrape away the loose paint with a putty knife, repeat many times over until it's pretty much all gone.  WEAR GLOVES, that stuff is nasty.  Once done, give it a good scrubbing with soap and water to remove all the stripper.  I use regular old dish soap and a brush.  Don't worry about getting water in the tank, once you are done you can flush the tank out with rubbing alcohol to evaporate the water. Buy the highest concentration of alcohol you can find.  Rubbing alcohol is also a cheap alternative for wiping the tank down before painting and during sanding.  There will still be some paint left so give the tank a good sanding and wipe down before priming.  Prime soon afterward to prevent surface rust from forming.  I don't bother stripping the bottom of the tank since that will not be visible once installed.



My original intent was to remove all the old bondo in case it has absorbed the paint stripper but that proved to be more trouble than it was worth.  I chipped away with a screwdriver for a while but made little progress.  Since the bondo was still holding tight and the primer seemed to adhere to it ok I decided just to coat over top of what remained.




There was also a shallow dent in the top of the tank that needed a little attention. It was only visible when looking at the tank from an angle.  For being 26 years old the tank is stil in pretty good shape.  There is some surface rust in the channels but I don't think I want to bother with coating the inside of the tank.  If you are planning on coating your tank, do it before you start doing the prep work because inevitably the tank will get dinged, smudged or spilled on during that process.



Gallon of Bondo body filler, about $25 at Home Depot.  You can also buy it in quarts for about $10 but Kay's old Geo is getting some cancer around the wheel wells so I have a use for the rest of the can.



Body filler spreaders, gloves and sand paper are other necessary items.



Bondo is a 2 part system.  The red paste is a hardener and the gray stuff is the plastic body filler.  A piece of cardboard makes a nice disposable palette.



When mixed correctly you get a pink color, make sure you knead it thoroughly.  I have a bad habit of using too much hardener.



Apply a nice smooth coat over the area you are filing.  Go larger than the problem area so you can feather in the body lines while sanding.  Since it's cold out here that will take a while to dry before sanding.  Repeat the process as necessary to get the desired result.  Small imperfections can be filled with glazing putty later.  If you are inexperienced at sanding use a sanding block to prevent unwanted lines.  That's all 4 now folks...

[BaltimoreGS]

I decided to tackle the top of the tank first since it will be the easiest.  Recreating the curves on the front dent will take a lot more effort.

-Jessie

Top dent sanded



Tank rubbed down with alcohol prior to priming



After priming you can really see how good (or bad) of a job you did.  Ideally you shouldn't be able to tell where the repair was.  If you look closely you can still see the outline of the bondo, that will require some  more sanding to smooth it out and then some glazing putty to blend it in.  A project for another day....

[tt_four]

tt_four-  We are using decent equipment in less than ideal circumstances.  The prep work on this will be done with bondo for the big dent and some dings, glazing putty for small imperfections, and rattle can primer.

Hey, thanks a lot for all the info any pictures. That was my initial plan, to get one gun and try different tips, but people said not to. I'll probably go that route anyway. Just to get the hang of it I may go to home depot or harbor freight and spend $35-40 on a gun just to play with, paint some random metal scraps and whatever else and get the hang of it. Then once I'm used to it I could pick up a nicer one, and just use the cheap one for primer. I'll probably use spray primer for a little while, or at most just some rustoleum as it's pretty cheap for a small container of it.

I already have a decent compressor with an inline filter(planning ahead for painting). The compressor has a regulator on it, but I'll get another one just for the gun. Pretty much I'll just have to get a gun and some paint and I'll be good to go.

Ooh, one other question.... How do you store your paint? I've used a lot of rustoleum in the past, just brushed on, but every time I open the can I have to pull out the 1/8th inch skin from the top. Are there any better ways to store paint? I was thinking of saving some jars from random kitchen condiments, I figure they'll seal better than the paint can, but I wasn't sure if there were any good painters secrets for that one.

[BaltimoreGS]

No problem man, I hope others can learn from my experiences/mistakes     I have some older spray guns I rarely use you can borrow if you want to experiment. You can get decent results from lower end equipment if you have a good set up/technique.  I used those guns with acrylic enamel.  Someone borrowed my old school pre-HVLP gun that worked great and didn't clean it afterward, it's pretty much useless now.  Zylene is a nasty chemical but works great for cleaning.  Just don't spill it in your crotch in a garage with no running water, ask me how I know.... 

Paint will always go bad if stored too long, you can only hope to prolong the process.  A cheap and easy way to seal a paint can better is to put a plastic grocery store bag over the opening before you hammer the lid back on.  The "last chance" filter I'm referring to is a small inline filter that mounts on the spray gun just prior to the regulator, it helps catch anything your normal compressor water separator misses.  And make sure if you have an inline oiler for air tools that you remove that prior to running a paint gun.  I'll post more pics/tips etc. as they come to mind.  Have a good weekend.

-Jessie

[ver4]

I looked at the list of paints about two hours ago and they all kind of look the same.  At least the reds did. 

[BaltimoreGS]

Yea Victor,

it is hard to look at colors on a monitor, it's best to get a chip chart.  That's why we are heading to Sherwin Williams next week.  Another way to go is to find a car color that you like and get a paint code for it, then a paint store can match it.  A lot of cheap Korean cars have really nice paint colors IMHO (Hyundais/Kias).

-Jessie

[Adfalchius]

I looked at the list of paints about two hours ago and they all kind of look the same.  At least the reds did. 

I found that looking online at paint chips is a horrible way to choose paint.  Unless, that is, you really don't care about what color you get.  Ver4, go to the Sherwin Williams store by the gym and check out the colors.  Take the chip charts outside in the sun- that's when you'll really see the color.  And of course- I don't mind if you paint your bike the same as mine- it really is a nice color.

[ver4]

I found that looking online at paint chips is a horrible way to choose paint.  Unless, that is, you really don't care about what color you get.  Ver4, go to the Sherwin Williams store by the gym and check out the colors.  Take the chip charts outside in the sun- that's when you'll really see the color.  And of course- I don't mind if you paint your bike the same as mine- it really is a nice color.

Kay, I agree.  You guys did a real good job with the last paint job.

[BaltimoreGS]

Found a picture of the "Barbie GS" (or "Pink Panther" as Kay called it).



That tank and those plastics have been repainted now.  We are planning a rebuild/modification of Kay's bike over the winter, those parts will go back on once that is done.



Her bike is currently riding around with the beat up black tank and plastics from my '89 GS.



One day when I get a burr up my as I'll repaint the old Nighthawk.  It has led a rough life (started out as a MSF training bike) and is still the most reliable thing I ever owned.  The only problem is I still use it to teach friends how to ride since it is already beat up, can't do that once it has a nice finish on it   



-Jessie

[ver4]

Kay should have kept the pink.

[ver4]

Completely off topic, but I thought I was tearing up those turns in Loch Raven today.  Probably th fastest I've went through them without thinking about applying the brake. 

Someone has taught me well.