Torn between two firearms

[Kasumi]

What im saying by that is, your talking about neutralising your threat and such things, the person who broke in you house is 9 times out of 10 going to be scared shitless to find you awake and armed with anything and will most undoubtdly run and if theyre not that they will be high looking for a fix and no real threat to you anyway. So you should be looking to scare them off not kill them. I hate the fact you treat it as some sort of oppertunity, the law says im allowed to kill him why waste the oppertunity just scaring them away.

It seems like you push your laws to the limits, owning a gun is not enough, you want more guns, bigger, more powerful for some reason other than recreation, self protection like you live in a war zone, better yet you can now carry them hidden so you must do that. I understand shooting for recreation, i do that, if someone broke into my house i would if time allowed choose to get the shotgun out of the safe as its better than a bedside lamp. But i don't own the shotgun to protect myself, and i certinally would not kill anyone who broke into my home unless they were endangering my family, and by that i don't count breaking in my window as hurting them who are all upstairs in their bedrooms, i will scare them away or aprehend them, if they try hurt me then i will hurt them. And hope it never comes to that.


Nad Jserio, thats what i was saying about a shotgun over a handgun, in panics people miss, you all must have heard the story of the fugitive who was being put in the back of a police car and he broke loose knocking one of the cops down and getting his gun, he was on one side of the car the cops partner on the other, both guns drawn. They were both so shocked of their situation that neither of them could hit each other with a full clip in each gun. They kept missing being only 4 foot from each other on two sides of car. Thats why you want to scare someone away and if it comes down to killing someone you want to make sure that your very unlikely to miss. You could be a jittering wreck and still at least glance someone with a shotgun blast.

[yamahonkawazuki]

perhaps kas, perhaps not. ( reading your post). but i agree a shotty would be ideal for home defense. if you end up missing at point blank range with a shotty, youve no need to be anywhere around a gun

[jserio]

i like the idea of having my bat by the bed. no need to train the wife. 

[yamahonkawazuki]

kinda hard to do anyway. Eh?

[makenzie71]

Kas, there are people out there who do look forward to opportunity to use a gun on another person, but don't get us wrong here.  The majority of the gun owners here in the states think that the best home defense weapon is one that has never been used for its purpose.

That being said, you're right.  If someone breaks into my home and finds me awake they're going to be scared, and they have good reason to be.  Lets look at how things could work here.  Say I just scare him off.  He flees.  Tomorrow, he breaks into someone else's home.  Lets say, after I scare him off with my own firearm, he decides to arm himself...just in case?  There's a possibility that because I let him escape without harm or punishment that he'll harm his next victim.  Then there's the other side of the scale...what if he's already armed?  What if he finds me awake and decides that the possibility for capture and conviction is too great and that it's easier for him to just shoot me?

There's possibilities on every side and the only way to make 100% sure that the person will never be a threat to an innocent victim again is to end them all together.  They know the risks when they break into a house, they should be willing to pay the consequences.

[jserio]

well said mak....    

[Susuki_Jah]

check out the springfield XD's

http://www.springfield-armory.com/xd.php

one of my hand guns is a XD9 full service model with a titanium slide and tritium night sights, I also purchased a laser sight for it and have a black hawk and a leather holster for it. even though it is a full service model it fits nice when concealing. I also have an under the arm holster and you can tell its on with a jacket on. you can also look at the taurus subcompacts. for the money you cant go wrong, my brother owns a few of those. the springfields cost a good bit but never jam and are very very accurate!

[bettingpython]

And again Kas you make an incorrect assumption, most home invasion incidents are carried out by people who are not afraid of whats behind the door, in many cases they don't even care that people have guns they look at it as an opputunity to steal them, invariably they have done it before and depend on swiftness and shock to gain them the advantage. Home invasion robberies are classified by criminals who come through the door knowing someone is home. We have had literally dozens of them here in tulsa in the last 2 months they're up almost 200% from a year ago, these are people who don't scare easily, especially considering we live in one of the most pro 2nd ammendment states in the U.S. I don't live in fear. Train train and more training. My wife is stunned with my reaction times from a dead sleep. Plus to be honest I like the training, we have a world class training center in tulsa that is open to civillians and teaches tactical handgun, rifle and knife combat to LE and Military spec ops from around the world, I have trianed side by side with tactical operators from 2 different swat teams and a couple of counter insurgency operators from the military. Training is fun and it involves lotsa shooting. Could I handle myself in the event it were real, I am willing to bet yes because I have gone the extra mile to place myself in high stress situations, confidence and the ability to act are bred from training.

I had an attempt made on my house the saturday night following christmas, they tried to kick in the front door the dogs barked and I was up and out with a rifle in time to see them fleeing, leaglly I couldn't shhot but I would have dearly loved to but a mag load of .223 through the rear window of the vehicle speeding away from my house, a guy in my same general vicintiy on a shooters forum here had the same thing happen a week later. The police think they got the 3 guys who tried my house and the other house all of them gang bangers all with crimanal records and violent offenders. What sucks is we both live in fairly quiet sedate neighborhood, crime statistic mapping data played a key part in my decision to buy where I did. 

I was involved in a home invasion in 1989 in California and drove 6" of combat fighting knife into a guys thigh as he literally stepped on me climbing in my bedroom window. I sleeep very well at night and don't live in fear.

I am going to retake some classes I have already done as the wife has really gotten into shooting recently she just took her state required course for her CCW permit. When I was younger maybe I was motivated by fear but now it's just a matter of pacticality, theres bad people in this world and I choose not to be a victim.

[yamahonkawazuki]

same here i live in an area where one can keep their doors unlocked. which is needed at my home because of my mother who is bedridden atm. so if med help or home health needs to get in they can. but a home invasion style thing recently has happened not 200 ft on the other sid of the property line.. ( adjoining my place. i may be buying and teaching her to shoot. so if needed she can was htnkin xd40 or somethign like that

[jserio]

it's sad really. that there are people out there like that. but, i'm sorry, if it's my life or yours, i'm not man enough to let you live if you see it that way. i may not have a charmed life but i don't want to die any sooner than  have to. bp has it correct, if you choose to invade someones home, be prepared to answer all consequenses.

[Kasumi]

Ive come to realise through all this that its impossible for us to agree. Certinally (in this area) our countries are completely different. We live in two totally different worlds, the fact that you have guns so readily available and laws allowing you to use them means you've grown up learning and living a different behaviour. Over here we don't and thus learn something different too. Both work but theyre such opposite ends of the scale i dont think its possible to agree on anything.

[jserio]

don't take it personally kasumi. we are not bad-mouthing you, your country or your laws. as you've stated, you grew up differently than we have over here. that's fine. doesn't make one of us more right or wrong than the other. now, maybe subject we can agree on.... E-beers for everyone!!!   

[bettingpython]

So did you go with the Glock or the Shotty?

[spc]

What ya want for home defense is a nice Mare's Leg in something mean like .45 gubmint.  Loaded with modern powders and projectiles, that'll make a serious impression...

Kaz, I'm not afraid of much (except for Jillian Michaels, she's scary as he!!)  I got stopped for a minor traffic infraction the other day and, being a CWP holder (this part is blatantly unconstitutional it makes my head spin), I'm required to inform the officer of firearms inside the car.  I had a Kel Tec in the glove box, a revolver in the center console, my HK on my hip and a mossberg and my Winnie in the trunk (I had been out shooting a the range)  The officer asked me what I was running from.  I replied, not a god dam thing.
See, despite how it has been bastardized, this is where our laws differed the most upon this great country's inception.  Y'all retained the 'Duty to retreat' and we turned that into 'Stand your ground'.  By the way, you're welcome for bailing your a55 out of WWI and WWII.  My grandpa and his father paid for that in blood and some seriously nasty illnesses late in life, think of that next time you're not speaking German...

[Elijafir]

My argument (and reason I'm glad I have a gun (S&W .40)):
My friend was the victim of a home invasion.  3 People kicked in his door with the intent to rob and kill him and anyone else in his house (his family.)  Him and his 9 year old daughter were shot to death. His other daughter was at a sleep-over.  His wife made it to the gun in time to shoot back.  Even though she was shot, she managed to wound one of the assailants and chase them away.  She lived to be able to take care of their other daughter.   Two days later the man she shot couldn't take the pain anymore and went to a hospital several hundred miles away.  When you show up at a hospital with a gun shot wound.. so do the police.  Because she was able to wound one of the three assailants, all three of them were apprehended. 
I really do wish we all could live in a world where everyone's needs were met and crime didn't exist.  But, the fact of the matter is that we don't. And, at any given time most of the world is involved in varying degrees of "war."  Like someone said earlier:  A gun is a tool.  Like most of my tools, I would rather have them and not need to use them versus needing them and not have them.  What would I do if someone kicked in my door?  I would wait until they were in my sights and shoot twice at their core.  Still moving?  Two more shots.  That means I get 7 attempts to "immobilize" them before I have to switch mags.  (Yeah, 14 round mag.)  The last thing I would want to do on this Earth is take the life of another human being.  But, Just like my friend (and his wife) I will protect my family with my life to the bitter end.
I don't know about where any of you live.. But, there is two things that will get you put away for a long, long time in a "home invasion" scenario:  a)  Shooting (at) someone that is trying to run away. (A.K.A. shooting someone in the back.)  b)  "Apprehending," "Detaining," "Holding," basically anything preventing them from fleeing, short of wounding them so badly that they can't.  At which point you immediately call law enforcement.  Here, you are not allowed to "threaten" them and hope they run away.  You are not allowed to "point" your gun at them and hope they run away.  You got your gun out?  You better be shooting them in the chest.
And, to the guy with the baseball bat:  What's the point?  Does it help you sleep better?  Do you think you can strike a critical blow before those crazy ass, more than likely drugged out of their mind, don't care that you're home and probably "armed" yourself, career criminals, take that bat away from you and beat you to death with it?  (No offense, but seriously... a bat?  At least get some pepper spray or a taser.)
Get a gun. Get training. Practice. Breath. Stay Calm. Stay Safe.
*end of rant*

[yamahonkawazuki]

Aye a taser or pepper spray, id be inclined to say taser. BUT a bat, well it would work, BUT it puts you pretty much within touching range of th offender