Rant: Just my GS, or are all bikes going to be this much of a PITA ?

[gs500e]

The problem i see with EFI is that the components are often proprietary (or perhaps always).
(i realize there are some non-oem components shared between OEM's. [but i bet those are in bed with the OEM's])

Carburetors were rarely made by the vehicle manufacturer.
I think carb manufacturers really missed the money-train by not standardizing and running the EFI game.

And... there is no excuse for us not being able to plug in our droid, or apple, phones to get/set/tune anything we could want to.  Or some $50 handheld bike specific gizmo at the least.
The only reason we can't is because of greed (oh, and consumers as usual, buying whatever garbage is available).

If i could buy a gs500 with a mikuni EFI system, or a mikuni carb system... i would choose EFI for more money.
Carb vs EFI is currently more of a 'home grown' vs 'big corporate' discussion, imo.
I would tend towards the home grown, tried and true system (and beat myself up when i can't fix it) than buy into a large corporations proprietary system (but in the end i would still go efi if given the choice... because most everything works well when it is brand new).

[rayshon]

And make sure u have a laptop when that FI bike strands u on the side of the highway so u can plug in and do a little computerized troubleshooting. Because the ECU wants to tell u exactly how to fix , what to fix ... or how to kludge temporary to at least make it to the next town...  ?

yeah because everyone carries around a spare set of carbs and can swap them easily in the middle of a ride right?

[Dr.McNinja]

The problem i see with EFI is that the components are often proprietary (or perhaps always).
(i realize there are some non-oem components shared between OEM's. [but i bet those are in bed with the OEM's])

Carburetors were rarely made by the vehicle manufacturer.
I think carb manufacturers really missed the money-train by not standardizing and running the EFI game.

And... there is no excuse for us not being able to plug in our droid, or apple, phones to get/set/tune anything we could want to.  Or some $50 handheld bike specific gizmo at the least.
The only reason we can't is because of greed (oh, and consumers as usual, buying whatever garbage is available).

If i could buy a gs500 with a mikuni EFI system, or a mikuni carb system... i would choose EFI for more money.
Carb vs EFI is currently more of a 'home grown' vs 'big corporate' discussion, imo.
I would tend towards the home grown, tried and true system (and beat myself up when i can't fix it) than buy into a large corporations proprietary system (but in the end i would still go efi if given the choice... because most everything works well when it is brand new).

The bulk of it isn't proprietary. They're pretty much standardized and communicate using the same protocol. It's hardly a corporate vs. grassroots thing. It's a old-imperfect-technology vs. accurate-new-powerful technology argument.

Arguing people being stupid as a reason to keep an inferior technology is ignorant. Carbs are anything but simple. If you want simplicity you'd have an EFI system. Reliability is judged in points of failure and let's face it - EFI has very few points of failure when sat up against a carb. Of course they are both compromised by varnish but arguing varnish as a reason to not move to a superior technology would also be foolish.

100% of problems are caused by the thing between the handlebars and the exhaust pipe. Arguing any of them as a reason to stay with a inferior technology is foolish. Economics, price, maintainability, and power are all reasons to go to EFI. If carbs were so awesome why would all the new model bikes have EFI? It's both emissions friendly and race friendly. If you have a laptop and a power commander you can work on an EFI bike just as easily as a carb bike. There really is no argument here.

Your first misconception is assuming that I am arguing (three times), or ignorant (once), neither am I foolish (twice) or a fool, this is a discussion forum and we are discussing bikes/carbs/EFI. You obviously have never had a group ride come to a grinding halt from a fuel pump failure?  After 45 years of dealing with carbs on bikes..I have yet to be stranded on the side of the road by one.

Never answered my question. What's the reason all new bikes have EFI? The wiki article makes it pretty clear. Carbs are an amazing piece of technology. What people did to get things done before computers is mind blowing to me. I enjoy taking apart a carb more than I do EFI (I've only ever done work on some EFI in cars).

I group ride with EFI bikes all the time and before I ended up cleaning out my carbs and replacing all my lines I was usually the reason we never were on time to our destination. My bike would sputter and die when it tried to hold an idle. Since then it hasn't done that. The point is here everyone has anecdotes. You and I can't look at anecdotes as the answer.

[Suzuki Stevo]

I am actually Pro EFI, I also understand the preventive measures one has to take with a carburated bike to keep them running. I have 6 bikes in my garage right now and all are 100% turn key. Some are EFI, some have carbs, the EFI bikes are no more reliable than the ones with carbs.

[gtscott]

i like efi to, not from a reliablilty point of view as i never seem to have problems with carbys on cars yet run into so many stupid headache issues with injected cars for the number of sensors these cars use, yet from a easy of tuning and retaining fuel ecconomy point of view, i can add extra fuel in exactly where it is needed for whatever setup i need with an aftermarket ecu, with a set of carbs i can make it richer or leaner over a much wider rpm range, so not the ideal setup for a performance engine, expecial when you start talking efi

[rayshon]

I have 6 bikes in my garage right now and all are 100% turn key.

holy cow 

[Suzuki Stevo]

holy cow 

Last month before I sold the GS the number was 7, like in the photo...can you find all 7? 

[BaltimoreGS]

Is that the new Ninja 250 in the foreground?  If so, how do you like it?  I've been thinking of replacing my trusty Nighthawk 250 with something a little more modern (disc brakes would be a nice change  ).  I had been looking at the TU250 until Suzuki jacked the MSRP $1,000.  I had also considered the new CBR250, both of which are fuel injected.

-Jessie

[Suzuki Stevo]

Is that the new Ninja 250 in the foreground?  If so, how do you like it?  I've been thinking of replacing my trusty Nighthawk 250 with something a little more modern (disc brakes would be a nice change  ).  I had been looking at the TU250 until Suzuki jacked the MSRP $1,000.  I had also considered the new CBR250, both of which are fuel injected.

-Jessie

It's allot of fun, more nimble than the GS, has the same lean out of the box configuration the GS has. Just like the GS, I left it stock and went up a size on the pilots and the mains. Mileage is actually worse than the GS, 55 Mpg open road. Went up one tooth on the counter shaft sprocket (just like I did on the GS) . You need to wind it up a bit more, but that should be expected with a 13,000 Rpm redline. It tops out just over 90 Mph (100 indicated) It's my new Lightweight Solo Touring bike 
Bottom Line...I have no regret's, I would do it again, the Ninja stayed and the GS500F left.



My GS500F in Lightweight Solo Touring configuration

[mister]

holy cow 

Last month before I sold the GS the number was 7, like in the photo...can you find all 7? 

1 - Front left - GSX650
2 - Front - Ninja
3 - far right, GS500F
4 - front scooter
5 - rear scooter facing back, next to GS500
6 - just above front scooter's headlight, a Blue Vstrom
7 - above 650's panniers and facing back, can't quite make it out but there is a bike there too, looks like another scooter.

How'd I go?

Michael

[Suzuki Stevo]

1 - Front left - GSX650
2 - Front - Ninja
3 - far right, GS500F
4 - front scooter
5 - rear scooter facing back, next to GS500
6 - just above front scooter's headlight, a Blue Vstrom
7 - above 650's panniers and facing back, can't quite make it out but there is a bike there too, looks like another scooter.

How'd I go?

Michael

100%!!!!