Taking the engine apart.... With a surprise inside !!!

[flank]

This is the front nut that hold the cylinder head...

Here is the damage:


One question: Am I boned ?

The engine is still in the frame but even out, I do not see how I could extract the screw ?
I don't think a drill with a flexible extension can bend like that ....

Are the screws used for this bike made of clay !? Am I doing it wrong.....
Do you guys have a way to "feel" when a You win! is about to break ?!


PS: Is the forum havin fun b.o.l.t is changed to bolt

[Tombstones81]

for starters, let the bike run a lil bit.
if oil leaks out of it, then its a Now problem.

if not, then it depends on where the break is.
which I am not sure about in that department.

I forgot to put that into mine when I first started it after all my upper engine work and it was leaking oil quite a bit from there.
its ok for me tho, i was only seeing if it would start.

but yeah, VERY bad break i think.

[bombsquad83]

I'm not sure this will work, but I do (unfortunately) have some experience with this.  First, order several different small size LEFT-HANDED drill bits.  McMaster Carr has these.  You might also need a screw extractor for the bolt size that you have there.  Start with the smallest left handed bit and drill directly into the center of the bolt.  Then move up to the next size.  Go slow and make sure you are centered and going straight into it.  Hopefully since you are drilling in a counterclockwise direction with the left-handed bits, and with the heat produced by drilling it will come right out.  If not, then it's time for the screw extractor.

Hopefully it's not broken off so deep that you can't get at it with the bits.  And also hopefully it's somewhat accessible or you will be taking your engine out of the frame before you try it (like I did with my camshaft journal cap bolt).

If none of that works...then you will have to drill it out and tap the hole one size up.

Good luck man, I feel your pain.

[flank]

The issue I have is the space availlable.....

[BaltimoreGS]

I'll save twocool a post:  "Were you using a torque wrench?"   

To repair it right you will probably have to pull the cylinder head off the engine.  If there is enough bolt left sticking out of the head you could grab it with vice grips.  If it is broken off too deep you can try extractor bits.  If they fail, drill and tap or helicoil it.

-Jessie

[twocool]

I'll save twocool a post:  "Were you using a torque wrench?"   

To repair it right you will probably have to pull the cylinder head off the engine.  If there is enough bolt left sticking out of the head you could grab it with vice grips.  If it is broken off too deep you can try extractor bits.  If they fail, drill and tap or helicoil it.

-Jessie

Sorry dude...I gotta post on this one!   

He said the bolt broke on disassembly...torque wrench doesn't help on disassembly!!

Cookie

[miander]

I have a lot of expierence with broken bolts. They seem to seize in turbo housings all the time.

Anyway it looks like the bolt you broke has some threads left on it. The thing to do is clean up the the end that goes into thethe threads with a small file just making it neat. Use a Torque wrench and see if it will tighten to the proper specs if you re install it. If it will and of course no other malidy comes from it you should be fine. I hate doing things this way but if you are short on skill and parts and money it works and has worked fairly well. You will have to check it after time goes by but that is no big deal. Maybe use the smallest lock washer possible.

The other option is using a set of grab bits. They work fairly decent but if the bolt is seized it is almost a waste of time. This is the only method I know that works best without a drill press and proper tools. Get some penetrating oil and soak the part over night. Get the appropiate grab it and go ahead the cut the part in the first step. Once it is cut get a torch and heat the area around the boltuntil it will blister your hands if you touch it (don't touch though). Then use the second step of grab it.

If this does not work then it is time to drill it out and tap it.

[twocool]

I have a lot of expierence with broken bolts. They seem to seize in turbo housings all the time.

Anyway it looks like the bolt you broke has some threads left on it. The thing to do is clean up the the end that goes into thethe threads with a small file just making it neat. Use a Torque wrench and see if it will tighten to the proper specs if you re install it. If it will and of course no other malidy comes from it you should be fine. I hate doing things this way but if you are short on skill and parts and money it works and has worked fairly well. You will have to check it after time goes by but that is no big deal. Maybe use the smallest lock washer possible.

The other option is using a set of grab bits. They work fairly decent but if the bolt is seized it is almost a waste of time. This is the only method I know that works best without a drill press and proper tools. Get some penetrating oil and soak the part over night. Get the appropiate grab it and go ahead the cut the part in the first step. Once it is cut get a torch and heat the area around the boltuntil it will blister your hands if you touch it (don't touch though). Then use the second step of grab it.

If this does not work then it is time to drill it out and tap it.

I generally have had good luck with teh "gra-bit" brand of extractors!  I don't like thier drill end of the tool, although it is left hand drill and sometimes wroks, but mine went dull when used on SS....so I drill with my regular drill bits, but the extractor end of the Gra-bit works great...

What I do is use a "hand chuck" to hold the gra-bit....not a power drill like they say.....just put the exctractor into a hand chuck, to twist out, and you have more "feel" and control....

Cookie

[bombsquad83]

Yeah man, I agree with Jessie.  You are going to have to take the cylinder head off to get at that.  Soak that thing in penetrating oil, heat it up and try those left-handed drill bits first.  Then next is the screw extractor.  You need a pilot hole of a certain size for the screw extractor bit anyway, so you might as well do it with a left-handed bit.  You might also heat the whole thing up before you drill as has been mentioned.  The drilling process does provide some amount of heat though.

[BaltimoreGS]

I'll save twocool a post:  "Were you using a torque wrench?"   

To repair it right you will probably have to pull the cylinder head off the engine.  If there is enough bolt left sticking out of the head you could grab it with vice grips.  If it is broken off too deep you can try extractor bits.  If they fail, drill and tap or helicoil it.

-Jessie

Sorry dude...I gotta post on this one!   

He said the bolt broke on disassembly...torque wrench doesn't help on disassembly!!

Cookie

Missed the dis-assembly part   

Modified comment:  "Did you use an impact driver?"   

-Jessie

[flank]

I do not see how taking the cylinder head is possible at this stage since this bolt holds the pieces together and there is some thread left ...

@twocool: Nope !I just used a small regular wrench ... This is not the first time one breaks on me although I was luckier....

Thanks for the tips, Now I need to find something that left me drill at a 90 degree up angle .....

[Bluesmudge]

If you can justify the purchase, a bunch of companies make 90 degree drills.

[Paulcet]

I do not see how taking the cylinder head is possible at this stage since this bolt holds the pieces together and there is some thread left ...

You're holding the head of the bold in your hand.  How will it now hold the head on the cylinder block?

[BaltimoreGS]

I do not see how taking the cylinder head is possible at this stage since this bolt holds the pieces together and there is some thread left ...

You're holding the head of the bold in your hand.  How will it now hold the head on the cylinder block?

+1

Once you take the 8 cap nuts and the cams out the head should pull right off.

-Jessie

Edit: I think I know what he means now.  The threads that are left are in the cylinder head, the jug hole is not threaded.  If you get lucky there will be enough of the bolt left sticking out of the head that you can get some vice grips on it once it is removed.

[flank]

Are you saying the bottom part is not threaded ?!?

[bombsquad83]

Any time two metal pieces are bolted together like that, you can pretty much assume that only the bottom part is threaded and the top part is held with the head of the bolt.

[twinrat]

you are taking the head off arn't you,thats why it broke when you went to remove it.just carry on and remove it when you have  it on the bench

[flank]

Is there a way to easily separate the cylinder head from the main body !?
It seems pretty stuck even with hitting it with a rubber mallet ...

Actually after a while...  I can see it swing of 1/10mm as in the picture:



When trying to pressure from left to right, it is the bottom of the cylinder that moves and oil is sipping out

It seems to me a bad idea to swing it either way or am I worrying too much ?

[Paulcet]

Right where your lines cross, there are alignment pins going from the head to the cylinder block. Keep working it!

[Bluesmudge]

When I took mine off I got a large flat head screwdriver and stuck it way in there so as not to damage the fins and then slowly worked my way around to lift the head. If you are careful it won't damage anything.