Installed Highflo Filtro and now no power past 1/2 turn

[JinBrian]

as my first real post (long time forum reader) i feel bad for asking such a common question but i have looked/searched for about a month every night and no results. i have a 06 gs500f with as of today 12,200 miles. i just did the oil/plugs about 1000 miles ago and smaller front sprocket with chain adjustment,the bike is stock with just the filter as a engine performance mod. 

major carb issues 

so i recently bought a hiflo air filter because my old one wasnt breathing right. no light got through it, it was that dirty. the bike rode fine and there were no issues with the old filter, when i replaced it and rode the bike i noticed i had no full throttle. just about or near 3/4, any more and it would fall on its face and bog out like it was lacking air or fuel.
read here that it was a rejet issue so i got 20 pilots used the same 60 mids and 140 mains.

after assembling, the issue was still there and slightly worse... at this point it would stall out and at one time i couldnt start it for a while, just kept cranking and cranking until it barely chugged below idle at full throttle until it climbed and actually ran correctly. no throttle above half to 3/4 still. noticed it was worse at slightly cooler air temps.
so a few friends and i thought it was just way too rich so i got some 135 mans and slapped those bad boys in there...

slight improvement but not much i got a little bit more throttle than the half that the last jets did, so as a further idea we put the 130 back in and it helped yet again a little more...although nothing past id say 65-75 percent throttle. 

thought it was a ignition issue because i noticed it didnt go past 6.5k but its just that the throttle wont really allow it to. i can rev up pretty high if i use half throttle and ease on it during a period of time but its not ideal at all for any type of riding since it takes forever. it gets to road and freeway speeds but i can not use any throttle past what iv mentioned.

all these symptoms are under load (while riding). At idle it idles a little low because i backed out the adjustment screw that connects to the butterflies on the bottom of the carbs for idle up or down. sometimes at a stop it will idle just fine and out of nowhere it falls a few hundred rpm and sometimes just shuts off. it starts right back up but still stalls.
as of right now i have 20-60-130 and a hiflo filter. i want my bike back and cant figure this out for the life of me. 

checked the needles and they have i think it was 2 washers on top and the idle set screws have been tampered with by previous owner. i have no idea what they are set to. 

also its not dependent on gear or speed, it happens strictly upon throttle positioning. 
tried the method of restricting air into the filter today and it made it worse. i couldnt get maybe more than 20percent throttle before it bogged out like full/near full does without doing that.

any ideas would be greatly appreciated and im sorry for the long post i just re read it many times and inserted info as i thought of it. im in Fresno CA if anyone near here knows or wants to try to help figure this out...i really want my bike back to riding standards...
i will post up more info as i think of it and any new things i try with the carbs. 
it seems like its a common issue but no one has a solid answer, its all try jets/fuel lines/petcocks/clogged carbs/floats/idle air screws...

[piresito]

Don't ride the bike without a filter, but try it stopped in your garage without a filter. How she behaves compared with the filter on?!

Have you synced the carbs? If not, might solve stalling issues.
Your Hiflo filter is the right one for the year of you bike? There are some GS500 which come with a restrictor in the filter, so if you had no restrictor, and now bought one with a restrictor, you re going rich.

Also, change plugs!

[BockinBboy]

I would think plugs wouldn't be an issue if they were change 1k miles ago... but have you 'read' them?
It sounds like you may be confused about lean/rich symptoms (probably because you have gotten such 'mixed'  results with changing mixture).  Color of the plugs should give a more definative direction. 

- Bboy

[bombsquad83]

It might be a good idea in this situation to go back to stock size jets and a stock air filter to eliminate those variables.  Once you have things running better with the stock setup, you can try the higher flow air filter.

[jestercinti]

IIRC, the Hiflo air filter is almost 100% stock, unless they have changed things.  Agree with Bombsquad.  Go back to stock.

That said...

For a stock bike that is in tune (that's a clean carb, valves in spec, everything else tip-top):

+2 main
+1 pilot
2 washers under needle, 2.5-3 turns on screw.

[JinBrian]

Thanks guys I'll bee looking into all the mentioned stuff starting with the spark plugs.
They didn't look extremely bad or anything
Moving on to new plugs and will check the with and without air filter next.
Oh and I forgot, I can't go back to stock right away. Someone threw out my old air filter so I'd have to buy another one and I just want the stuff I have to work first.

[jestercinti]

Does your air filter look like the HiFlo in the Wiki:

http://wiki.gstwins.com/index.php?n=Upgrades.AirFilter

If so it's VERY similar to stock.  It's like buying Fram instead of AC/Delco for a GM Car.

[JinBrian]

Yes its same filter. I was tipped of that filter due to the wiki there and since then its been nothing but fuel/air issues.

That's said filter next to my old one. I took pics when I replaced it to try to document everything I do to it.
Plugs didn't make a difference. Throttle is still the same and power output hasn't changed.

[piresito]

Hi had a HiFlo filter like that and had no problem, although my bike was one with the two circuit carbs. The problem isn't in the filter.
You might have to remove the carbs and check if there is something wrong with them. Check carbs, recheck tubes, tank breather tube, try it with petcock on prime...
Also, those needles with two washers, have you tried them without the washers?

[JinBrian]

Strangest thing- today I took out the air filter, road it to work and it feels perfect it's fast and back to normal...so how do I fix it so i don't have to ride without a filter...
It means I had too much fuel and not enough air if Im thinking right...and now I have a lot of air and less fuel per unit so I'd need yet again bigger jets?...

[mitch79]

Your results tell me that, for whatever reason, your Hiflo filter is too restrictive. Buy an OEM filter and go back to the stock jets you had before.
Alternatively you could fit a K&N drop in filter and jet to suit though that's probably more mucking around than you want at this stage

[JinBrian]

Would my jetting sizes be any help of figuring this out? I have in it the only one I changed is the pilot , at 20-60-130.
Doesn't seem like much of a jump and that's just idle so I'm baffled as of why the hiflo (which seemed like it flowed `more`) would all of a sudden be restrictive. I think I have 2 washers on the needles so a friend said remove one and try again with the filter. Does that sound like a good idea or double work?
And I have actually thought about getting a really hi flowing filter and removing the air box or something along those lines. I know its not good to ride without a filter there but its been 2 months and I missed my bike
If anything I'll just get a oem replacement and set fire to the hiflo unless someone wants it...and I'll leave the pilot and start playing with the idle screws and needles...

[JinBrian]

  so im still confused about it all but i did put a clamp on the vaccum line from the back of the fuel petcock and it helped seal that up pretty nice, also found a leak on the lower fuel line from the petcock to the carb 'T'...pretty much looks like it snapped off. any idea what i could use? and like i said before, no filter is great, with filter i have no throttle past about 50%.

[The Buddha]

130/20 should work perfect ...
How about you clean the old paper filter with gas and blow it out with compressed air, get it dry, sun it if you need ... dry. Try that. Maybe the hi-flo isn't so hi flow.
You do seem to be rich ... you can drop back to the old 17.5/127.5 or just to 127.5 keep the 20's, the pilots control low down, or take out 1 washer.
Air screw etc is not an issue.

I will do 1 thing at a time and test it out before making another change.

The plug pull is useless unless you did it @ 1/2 throttle. As in ride ... 1/2 throttle keep for 5 sec. Hit the kill switch, pull over and pull the plugs. Your plugs are an idle read, and they look good.

Cool.
Buddha.

[ned from PA]

DO NOT USE A HI-FLO FILTRO -- THEY DO NOT BREATH SUFFICIENTLY!!!

Going from a dirty stock Suzuki filter to a new Hi-flow filtro on my 1992 GS-500, I though my engine was failing.  There is definitely something wrong wtih that knock-off filter; it doesn't breath enough, causing loss of power (and, in my case, knocking sounds from the engine). 

I ended up switching to a K&N lunchbox, and my problem is solved. 

Note that I have stage-3 dynojetting, so my bike needs lots of air.  The stock filter was borderline okay, but the Hi-flo filtro was the straw that broke my rich-jetted camel's back.

Ned

[Higgins13]

the straw that broke my rich-jetted camel's back.

quote of teh day

[Suzuki Stevo]

DO NOT USE A HI-FLO FILTRO -- THEY DO NOT BREATH SUFFICIENTLY!!!

Going from a dirty stock Suzuki filter to a new Hi-flow filtro on my 1992 GS-500, I though my engine was failing.  There is definitely something wrong wtih that knock-off filter; it doesn't breath enough, causing loss of power (and, in my case, knocking sounds from the engine). 

I ended up switching to a K&N lunchbox, and my problem is solved. 

Note that I have stage-3 dynojetting, so my bike needs lots of air.  The stock filter was borderline okay, but the Hi-flo filtro was the straw that broke my rich-jetted camel's back.

Ned

Glad you got to the bottom of your problem, there is a reason K&N's are the industy standard, they do breathe well  '
(No, I'm not slamming K&N filters....I am just showing what it takes to attain high CFM)

[sikiriki]

EVERY time I take the carburetors off to change the jets I hit the floats. Changing the level of the fuel in the bowls. I do not want to, but it happens.

I hate carburetors, fuel on my next bike will be injected by electricity and algorithms.

But until that time i check the floats, pressing them slightly would make them run higher and you have more fuel than you would like. Sucking it easier trough jets and running richer...

[Suzuki Stevo]

fuel on my next bike will be injected by electricity and algorithms.

Amen..I have only 2 bikes left with carburetors, a Honda CH80 (selling soon to oldest daughters BF) and a Ninja 250R....being replaced by a Ninja 300 with EFI 

[JinBrian]

Anyone else ever break the lower fuel line T, its the line from the fuel petcock to the middle of the carbs.  its like one problem to the next...
Anyways I'll look into a OEM filter and hope that works...other than that Now its the fuel line issue...thanks guys I will definitely post the results and more info as it happens.