Really Rough Shifting + Possible electrical issues?

[fetor56]

Owners manual sayes measure the oil from an UPRIGHT position,whilst on the sidestand......Workshop Manual sayes measure it on the centre stand(they both say bike located on a horizontal surface)
Don't guess it matters much but i prefer the Sidestand/Upright position.

PS...i noticed it was hard to accurately measure the correct oil level just after an oil change,but the unmarked rear of the dipstick gave a clearer reading.With a dremel i just scribed the upper/lower oil limits on this unchequered side. 

[lynx124]

... Didn't mean to seem if I was saying you a noob ... But I have noticed over the years of engine problems in all kinds of vehicles .... There is a very wide spectrum of understanding things...  .. And sometimes it is simple stuff that gets overlooked ...  That's all  ..

As an example on this forum .... Look up fuel issues sometime ... You get ... Lines blocked/pinched/ass about problems, vacuum problems, carb problems, forgot to turn the  fuel tap on problems... And the famous "it has plenty of gas cos I can hear it sloshing about" problems ....

Or ... 'Starting problems/goes click' ... You get .... Bad rotor problems, wrecked starter motor problems, bad solenoid problems, battery connection problems ..... And the famous 'but my battery should be good because I used it a week ago but now it's dead so I replaced it and magically the bike starts' ... Problems ....

I know if I have an issue with an engine ( and yeah I'm not a expert or a mechanic, just a normal person ... Well kinda normal) .. Like most people I get annoyed/agitated ... And sometimes miss simple checks ... So I try to keep it to basics to start with and eliminate simple 'causes?' ... Before I jump into a expensive cause theory .... And I remind others to do likewise as a friendly gesture...

Simple stuff I fix/fill/rectify/adjust ..... Complex stuff I get paid help with or just point and say 'sort that out' ....



... And a question for the lads about the oil .... Aside from having the low oil level .... And later putting oil in ... If the oil filter was completely clogged ... Would that prevent oil circulation? ... Or does the bike have a bypass line/gallery? ... Oil not circulating well would also would build up heat quick? and with a extra hot engine the oil that was moving a little would get burnt off quicker yeah?? ...

Genuine question above... I don't know on the bike ... But I know my truck (proper truck not a pickup) the filters mounts have a bypass on them if they get completely clogged .... I don't let them get that way ... But it's there.. 

I will give that a shot. Ive been spending quite some time the past few days reading everything on this forum lol. I really appreciate ur help and input and ur completely right about being frustrated and skipping the simple checks. I guess I just got freaked out when 3+ mechanics told me to trash the bike when it runs and sounds perfectly in idle. Surely if I had done makor damage I'd hear it.

Thanks again buddy! (Def + feedback)
Be safe riding out there!

[lynx124]

The fact that it is cutting off in 2nd is most surely a coincidence.

Go a head and take your battery to autozone or something and have them load test it to see if it is in decent shape. Certainly check the fuel lines to make sure they are not kinked, and you may want to consider replacing the lines to be completely rule out the issue of clogged lines (this is pretty cheap, just takes time if you are new to it, i can swap out all fuel lines on my bike in 5 min start to finish and be back on the road).

Measuring the oil on the side stand would make the reading lower than in should be. If you think about it, putting it on the side stand makes the left side lower, so more oil will go to that side, and since the dipstick is on the left side, the reading will be lower. It sounds like your oil is not too high or too low (both are very bad and the main cause of gs500 engine failure), so you should be OK on the oil front.

This very well may be an electrical issue or a fuel delivery issue. If the engine runs smoothly at idle/with a bit of a rev and doesn't have any messed up sounds, the engine is probably fine.

Graham 

Im really hoping that it is a coincidence. As for the battery, I ALWAYS keep it connected to a tender and its a fairly new battery (Bought it last season) and it isnt one of those cheepo ones either. Regardless, Ill take it to autozone anyways just to rule that out. The bike doesnt have a problem turning over and on when its cool.

As for the fuel lines, I might put that off until I can find a tutorial or something to help me cuz the last thing I wanna do is create more problems. What I dont understand is that if the issue was a fuel issue, how come the bike idles nicely even with the occasional rev up to 4K RPM or so? it doesnt chop or choke at all.

Thanks dude!

[frylockjim]

In my experience on my '06 GS500F, the oil burns up because of the fact its air cooled. The gear shifting is a little hard in the stopped position, next time it has problems shifting, then try moving it back and forth. Dont worry too much about it running with no oil because it probably didnt run with no oil for that long, so there might not have been any major damage, if there was any damage at all. I ran my bike with no oil for about a good 100 miles before i filled it back up again. Probably not the smartest thing to do on my part but i was broke as hell at the time.

[jdoorn14]

One other item that bothers me... You checked the oil and found it to be 1/4 up the dipstick with the engine warm...and still rode it to Autozone to get oil? Without adding any oil? IMHO, this is asking for problems. 1/4 up the dipstick with engine cold is even more disturbing...

Out of curiosity, have you taken an MSF Basic Rider Course (BRC)? If not, you should, regardless how much riding experience you have. One thing you'll learn is the major items to check in a pre-ride inspection. (T-CLOCS)

One of the first things I did upon buying my bike was to make sure I always had extra oil at home, because I know that carbureted engines have a tendency to burn oil. (Parents had a 1976 Chevy Caprice until roughly 1994...and I started reading about it here before buying my GS.)

Yes I did take the MSF course (First few lines of my opening post) And I am aware of the whole burning oil thing, but it shouldn't be burning all of its oil in a 1mi ride! right?

Meh. Was at work when I read it the first time. Long paragraph, little punctuation/white space...easy to miss key points. But, hey, we all make mistakes.

BTW - the only way you're going to be called a squid around here is if you ride in a tank top, shorts and flip flops. Every person here was a noob at some point, both to the forum and to motorcycles in general.

Welcome to the nuthouse!

[Paulcet]

You said "1/4 full". Do you mean it had less than a liter in it? Or do you mean the oil on the dipstick reached 1/4 up on the hash mark?

How much did you have to put in it to bring up to full?

While the engine my indeed be dead, this is not the typical low oil = dead engine scenario, IMO.

By "1/4 full" I meant the dipstick reached 1/4 up on the hash marks. In other words, the oil tank had 1/4 of the oil it should normally have.

Ok, that means you were barely low.  The stick doesn't reach all the way to the bottom.  The low-full mark is only about a 1/2 liter if I recall correctly.  Your bike holds approximately 3 liters.  The dipstick will be dry long before there is actually NO oil in it!

[lynx124]

One other item that bothers me... You checked the oil and found it to be 1/4 up the dipstick with the engine warm...and still rode it to Autozone to get oil? Without adding any oil? IMHO, this is asking for problems. 1/4 up the dipstick with engine cold is even more disturbing...

Out of curiosity, have you taken an MSF Basic Rider Course (BRC)? If not, you should, regardless how much riding experience you have. One thing you'll learn is the major items to check in a pre-ride inspection. (T-CLOCS)

One of the first things I did upon buying my bike was to make sure I always had extra oil at home, because I know that carbureted engines have a tendency to burn oil. (Parents had a 1976 Chevy Caprice until roughly 1994...and I started reading about it here before buying my GS.)

Yes I did take the MSF course (First few lines of my opening post) And I am aware of the whole burning oil thing, but it shouldn't be burning all of its oil in a 1mi ride! right?

Meh. Was at work when I read it the first time. Long paragraph, little punctuation/white space...easy to miss key points. But, hey, we all make mistakes.

BTW - the only way you're going to be called a squid around here is if you ride in a tank top, shorts and flip flops. Every person here was a noob at some point, both to the forum and to motorcycles in general.

Welcome to the nuthouse!

Lol thanks buddy!

Yea no tank and flip flops here. More like boots, armored jacket, full faced helmet and jeans every ride. My dad and I are big on safety cuz we know too many people who have had their lives ruined from riding with improper gear.

[weedahoe]

At this point, if you have not already damaged the engine, I would be surprised.

If you are not leaking oil externally, then you are using it internaly. Simple as that

weedahoe, Im sure Im not leaking any externally, and if I was burning oil I would most likely see white exhaust smoke and different/abnormal scents coming out of there too. That's why I'm so baffled lol 

If you were burning a lot of oil in a short time you would see it but if a little over a long time then you might not see it.

[lynx124]

UPDATE:

Ok so I checked oil levels and restored it back to full. Fuel lines are clear as well. Clutch is properly adjusted too. There is about what looks to be about slightly less than 2 gallons of fuel left in the tank and although I dont believe this is a problem (Ill explain why in the next paragraph) I flicked the petcock to RESERVE. I took it out for a quick spin and it stopped AGAIN in SECOND GEAR! 

Here's why I dont think its a fuel level issue. Most cars, when they run out of fuel, sputter before coming to a full stop. So I assume its the same with bikes. When riding, however, the engine cut off each time suddenly, without any sputtering. PLEASE correct me if my assumption is wrong. Im sure someone out there rode their bike to an empty tank and describe what it feels like to me.

In the meantime Im gonna take my car to the nearest gas station and fill up a red tank to put in my bike, just to be extra sure.

Thanks in advance for your replies!!!

[bombsquad83]

The flat bottom of the tank can play tricks on you and make you think there is much more gas left than there actually is.  Did you try setting the petcock on prime?

[lynx124]

The flat bottom of the tank can play tricks on you and make you think there is much more gas left than there actually is.  Did you try setting the petcock on prime?

I'll give it a shot (Im about to take it out for another test ride). I figured the reserve setting would do the trick though. But again, doesnt a bike sputter when it running out of fuel?...Each time the bike stopped it was as it someone flicked the red cut off switch mid-ride... (Which i didnt do lol)

[bombsquad83]

That actually sounds like an ignition problem, but it would be good to eliminate fuel issues.

I believe there have been others who have had an issue with the timing pickup when it heats up.  You might search for something like that.  Also, you might want to change the name of this thread.

[MarkB]

I'll give it a shot (Im about to take it out for another test ride). I figured the reserve setting would do the trick though. But again, doesnt a bike sputter when it running out of fuel?...Each time the bike stopped it was as it someone flicked the red cut off switch mid-ride... (Which i didnt do lol)

From your initial indication of running for a half mile then stalling I too was thinking fuel flow problem, but you're right, it would run roughly before quitting all together.  I'm wondering now if there is some combination of problems with the side stand switch and the neutral safety switch that makes it cut out in 2nd gear.  It's supposed to stop the engine (as if by the red kill switch) if the side stand is down and don't either have the clutch lever depressed or the engine out of gear.  Of course the 2nd gear thing may be a red herring.

[lynx124]

OK so fuel getting to the engine is completely ruled out right now. The tank has about 4 gallons in it now and I was riding with it in reserve so that every drop of fuel is accounted for.

Oil is not a problem either. Its full and new.

I took it our for a short ride around the area and never left second gear. No issues at all and more importantly, no sudden engine cut-off. The issue then came up when i was pulling into my driveway. I got onto my driveway in 1st gear and pulled up next to my open garage. I normally put the engine in neutral and then cut power before pushing it into my garage (space is tight). The problem was that with the clutch fully pulled in, the shifter WOULD NOT BUDGE! I tried EVERYTHING and nothing happened. I then cut power, (remaining in 1st gear) lightly tapped the shifter up, and I was in neutral (bike moved back and forth).

Just out of curiosity, I restarted the engine. It easily went into first gear, then when returning to neutral (or second gear) it did the same thing, it DIDNT BUDGE!

Engine off - easy shift
Engine on - freaking impossible

I am now beginning to think I have two separate problems happening to my unlucky self at the same time. I think I have some sort of electrical issue with the safety stuff AND there is some sort of issue with the shifting mechanism.

Just to be clear, the odometer reads 6.778 and the bike has never been laid down, so its in excellent condition...Im just completely lost on how to deal with this.

[lynx124]

That actually sounds like an ignition problem, but it would be good to eliminate fuel issues.

I believe there have been others who have had an issue with the timing pickup when it heats up.  You might search for something like that.  Also, you might want to change the name of this thread.

Not sure how to rename the thread...new to the forum 

[adidasguy]

To rename the index title, edit the first posting. It won't change the title on each posting, but the index will have it changed and all new postings will have the new title.

Our bikes (well, most) don't shift well when stopped. Let the clutch slip a little or roll forward or back a little. It is the way the gears slide sideways and mesh to do the shifting. All that sounds normal.

Easiest to shift while moving. Hardest to shift when standing still.

You might need to adjust the clutch. With the engine on, there is some pressure on the drive train due to the engine running. Try the standard 3 point clutch adjustment as mentioned in the WIKI or a Haynes or Clymer manual.

[lynx124]

To rename the index title, edit the first posting. It won't change the title on each posting, but the index will have it changed and all new postings will have the new title.

Our bikes (well, most) don't shift well when stopped. Let the clutch slip a little or roll forward or back a little. It is the way the gears slide sideways and mesh to do the shifting. All that sounds normal.

Easiest to shift while moving. Hardest to shift when standing still.

Thanks to both of those pointers...
I just got scared because of the fact that it used to shift from 1st to neutral while standing still, no problems, all the time...sure it took a bit more foot power than when barreling down 4th gear and shifting to fifth, but this was ridiculous!

BTW r u the same adidasguy that does the videos on YouTube?

[Snake2715]

Lots of long replies. I skimmed them.

In my experience hard shifts can mean tight chain or loose chain.. So whats the chain tension like?

Hash marks on the stick is within range. There is a low and high range, but hash is within range.


Clutch cable working correctly? Not hanging, broken, etc?

What method did you follow to adjust the cable, can you link it or explain it?


He is the one and same Adidasguy, yes.

[john]

side stand switch? 

The GS uses oil -at least most of them can eat up to 1 quart every 500 miles.  This is why it is so important to check the oil all the time.  Just make it part of your start up routine when you start your day.

And by the way, your mega paragraph made my eyes bleed.  But it's OK.  We are an accepting bunch.

[lynx124]

Lots of long replies. I skimmed them.

In my experience hard shifts can mean tight chain or loose chain.. So whats the chain tension like?

Hash marks on the stick is within range. There is a low and high range, but hash is within range.


Clutch cable working correctly? Not hanging, broken, etc?

What method did you follow to adjust the cable, can you link it or explain it?


He is the one and same Adidasguy, yes.

Same guy, huh? I owe him ALOT of thank you's starting with the fact that he taught a 5'10'' 144lbs guy like me how to put the bike on the centerstand without any help lol

The chain is properly adjusted. It is about one tick mark to the left of center.

The clutch is properly adjust from the lever end, I can assure you that. I didnt follow any links, I just found the adjustment mechanism similar to dirt bike ones.
I did learn, however that apparently there is one or two more adjustment point and yea...i have no clue where to begin with finding and checking those.