mr72's '92 project - "Renegade"

[cbrfxr67]

winning right there,...
Cant wait to see the final rendition,...

[mr72]

It's rainy and cold here. And I have 6 yards of gravel in the form of about 3.7 1 yard pallets and about 2.x yards in a giant pile all in the driveway between where my GS is parked in the garage and the road.

So no riding. But the crazy thing is, I really want to ride my GS!! But I have an almost literal mountain to move before I can. Started with 8 yards of gravel and now down to about 6 total to move but that's still about 18,000 lb of rocks that have to get from my driveway to my front yard before I can go ride.

Grr.

[mr72]

More Riding the Renegade .. or is it a GS500-X ? Or maybe ... what's the Japanese equivalent of "Multistrada?" Is this a Suzuki Ōkunodōro?

After moving some of my rock pile I opened a corridor between the garage and the road just barely wide enough to very carefully pull the GS out and put it on the street. I was going through withdrawal for a motorcycle ride after the weather turned very nice so I had to do something! It was a pretty delicate operation getting the GS out around the piles and pallets of rocks but worth it. However, there's now way I could get the bike back in. The hill is making it a real challenge. Of course we have rain coming again on Thursday and Friday so I now have to either move two 1 cu-yard pallets of gravel in the next three days or concede to leave the GS out in the rain.

I decided to use the GS for errands on the weekend even though it was very cold in the morning when I had to do them -- about 35F. With no fairings of any kind and really 2-season gear (summer and half of Fall and half of Spring) this was really too cold to be riding. But it was basically low-speed under 45mph neighborhood errands so I did it anyway. The bike was very difficult to start in the cold and I noticed some small amount of fuel leaking form the bottom of the carbs somewhere. Choke doesn't really seem to be working right. Not only will the lever not stay where I put it on the bar, sort of springing back to half-choke all the time, but even if I hold it, the bike doesn't do the 5k rpm revving. Also after the bike sat for several days it had to be put on PRI to start at all. I think this must be related to the fuel drops I saw on the top of the engine: it must be draining the float bowls while it's sitting. Likewise once it gets running after great effort the bike bogs and won't run under load until it has been running and warming up for a few minutes. Trying to ride away after it has only been running on the side stand for a minute or so results in a stall. This is not how it was running a year ago when I was riding it regularly, that's for sure. Just love how carburetors have a life of their own.

On top of that, during the course of these rides, especially with the lower gearing (14t), it is clear that I need to jet up. IIRC I am running 125s now, but the bike really does basically quit accelerating at about 8.5K rpm in any gear, which is right where it should be cooking. It also has a bit of a hesitation around 3-4K rpm under big throttle changes, and really only runs like it should between about 5K and 8K. I think both sides of this may be the same problem, just need to bump one jet size. So I have a set of 127.5s on the way. I'll swap them in when I pull the carbs to find the fuel leak, clean the fast idle jet, and see what else is not happy in there. Guess it's a good thing that I have gotten good at working on carbs on this bike. But it did remind me just how much I am spoiled with the fuel-injected Triumph which starts instantly and runs essentially perfectly in any temperature no matter what.

OK, enough of the toils of carbureted motorcycles. Aside from my frozen hands those errand rides were fun. Again I was reminded how quite different it is to the Bonneville. Then Sunday afternoon, the weather was nearly perfect at about 65 degrees F and sunny, so my dad joined me again and we rode the Volente Rd - Lime Creek Rd (look it up on youtube!) which is right next to my house. Now, I know everyone thinks Lime Creek Rd is where you go to test the handling limits of your Panigale or GSXR1100 (or your Lotus or Porsche...) but in reality this is where the Lil' Renegade (or GS500-X?) really shines. I have ridden my Bonneville a dozen times or more on this road and it works well but it's very different. The GS's high-revving, high-strung engine by comparison just adores this hilly road littered with crazy 15mph turns. Once you are in the 6K rpm range the bike really has more than adequate power and accelerates great. And the sound!! Oh the sound!! The crackling on decel is glorious, and it just sounds so fabulous when it revs. This Chopped-down Yoshimura is magical.

The thing is, if you keep it below 5K it's a docile little mouse. You can stand on the pegs and just putt around in first gear and dodge pot holes or look for a parking spot like a prairie dog commuter if you like. But once you get the revs up it's just a highly engaged, interactive, glorious analog experience. The suspension is stiff and reminds you that you are doing something. The light weight of the bike is held high which keeps you on your toes because you are constantly reminded that not putting your body weight right will unload the front tire and it feels like it'll slip so you have to really kiss the mirror on turns, but it rewards you with progressively quick cornering and abundant grip. If you keep the revs up then you can keep the bike in 3rd gear on these 40mph roads with 15mph turns and just engine-brake into the corner with popping and crackling and fanfare, then roll on the throttle through the turn and come out of the exit with this howling tenor on the way back up to about 7-8k rpm when you get back off the throttle for the next turn. It's not that it's loud, it's just that it's constantly talking about what's going on, and it demands your attention.

I was again just reminded how much character the old GS has. It has quirks. You have to know how to ride it. But it pays back with abundant smiles if you get it right, or even if you try.

So yesterday, after riding the GS alone for a week or so while the Bonneville sat resting in the garage, I was really glad I didn't sell last spring, when I was really tempted to. It's not going to displace the Bonneville as my daily rider, but I'd regret not having this breath of fresh air around to take from time to time. The foot peg relocation and improved (for me) ergonomics put this bike right back into the rotation for me.

Anyway, by contrast the Bonneville is easy to ride and relaxing. It's effortlessly powerful and you can just leave it in 3rd gear and come out of those 15mph turns at 2K rpm and it just doesn't care. It carries all of its heavier weight very low making it really easy to put into turns without a lot of histrionics from the rider. The Bonnie is a joy to ride, but in a really different way. I mean, it's a 20-years-newer motorcycle built with a whole different philosophy. The Bonnie is easy to live with every single day. There's no trick to starting it, no big punishment if you look at the scenery for a moment every now and then, little danger of stalling or laying it down if you find yourself suddenly in the wrong gear after a corner. You basically don't have to be 100% "on it" every moment on the Bonneville. But the GS, well you basically have to be 50% more engaged all of the time. It is exciting and fun as a vacation from the norm but would be exhausting daily, and I remember when I was riding the GS daily, it was exhausting. The mileage numbers don't lie. In 3 years I rode my GS about 5K miles. In one year I rode the Triumph about 4K miles. It's not really that the Triumph is more enjoyable, it's just way easier to live with every single day.

Welp, sorry for the long post. I was just feeling pretty happy about my GS adventure. It's back o the road now at least until the rain comes later this week and the Bonneville is stuck in the garage so it'll be my daily ride for a few more days, then once I am done with this rock project and the jets come in I'll take her apart, probably finish the last little pieces of my foot pegs job (paint, maybe? try to reinforce that shift lever a little bit), but I'm going to put the GS back into a regular rotation. Maybe I ride the Triumph every day for routine stuff but those moto-therapy rides I take once or twice a week over on Lime Creek Rd. or down 1431 might be better suited to the GS.

[cbrfxr67]

great read!  Thanks for sharing,...  My favorite: "The crackling on decel is glorious, and it just sounds so fabulous when it revs,".....  I love riding that bike.  Perfect write up of its character

[Endopotential]

I totally agree.  I have a few other fancier, more powerful bikes in the garage, but there's something about the little GS that makes it so fun to ride!

Granted mine's been modded a bit, but the combination of its light weight, suspension and easy handling make it a blast on curvy hills 

[mr72]

You know it really reminded me of driving my 240Z. Same kind of bonzo soundtrack and visceral experience of just having to be in control of yourself and everything. It's like it just cranks your senses to 11.

FWIW I am not sure my GS out of the box would have been this way. Endo, this I think is where you and I might have similar experience. There are a couple of choice mods involved here: stiffer suspension, the right exhaust, dialing in the carbs, 14t sprocket. Transforms the character of the bike. I have to remind myself of this every time I hear someone condescendingly refer to a GS500 as "a commuter bike". You'd have to be a masochist to commute daily on mine, at least around here where the average commute is 40 minutes each way alternating between 65mph freeway and stop and start gridlock. But you'd have to be a robot to not want to ride it just for kicks every once in a while down roads that don't go anywhere you need to be.

[Endopotential]

240Z !?!  That's a classic!  Would love to add a 3rd Gen RX-7 to the tinkering workshop one of these days

Now if I could only figure out how to get my GS to have something like 70hp / 50 ftlb torque I'd pretty much have my dream bike...

[Bluesmudge]

Now if I could only figure out how to get my GS to have something like 70hp / 50 ftlb torque I'd pretty much have my dream bike...

Suzuki already makes your dream bike. The SV650!

The GS500 does make a great commuter bike. Good mpg, just enough power (it will sit at 90 mph all day if you ask nicely), and cheap maintenance.

[mr72]

240Z !?!  That's a classic! 

Yeah. Wish I still had it!! I traded it for a Toyota station wagon years ago when we were hard up for family transportation. But what a car!

Would love to add a 3rd Gen RX-7 to the tinkering workshop one of these days

Yeah, agreed. I had a 2nd gen RX-7 that was given to me, a complete car in great condition except it must have had apex seals shot because the thing never did start so I sold it for $200. One day the 3rd gen will be classic supercars alongside NSX and Supras of the era. I also had (on sort of long term loan) a 2nd gen MR-2 which along with my 240Z were our "family car" solution for several months... we would caravan everywhere in the two sports cars with a child seat in the passenger seat of each car. Then the MR-2 was sold and I traded the Z and the rest is history.

In the end my Miata was a better sports car than either of them.

Now if I could only figure out how to get my GS to have something like 70hp / 50 ftlb torque I'd pretty much have my dream bike...

HP is easy. Put a chopped GSXR head on it and find a way to keep the crank from breaking when you rev it to 12K rpms all the time and you'll make 70hp all day long. Torque is another matter.

I disagree that a SV650 is the same thing though. A water-cooled V-twin has to have very different character from an air-cooled 180-degree parallel twin. Maybe you, like me, should be looking for a Ducati M695.

[mr72]

Pulled the carbs yesterday for a rejet. The 14t sprocket made it evident that the bike was running out of steam at too low of an rpm. It had 125s in it, I went to 127.5. Also noticed that the carbs are leaking a little bit from the float bowl gasket, and the right side carb had a lot less fuel in it than the left. Guessing storage without riding for weeks at a time coupled with my excessive side stand lean are contributing to this. I'll fix all that eventually.

Ok so jets.

Bike definitely goes better at wot and above 7k. Still doesn't do what I think it should at 9k. But a little stumble or hesitation coming from low throttle at under 5k to wot has come in with the bigger jets. I think it's rich in that range. Probably need to reset the idle mixture.

Went on a 75 mile or so ride through back roads yesterday and it was a treat. Bike is dripping with personally. Plenty quick as long as I don't try to ride it under 5k rpm. There's some weirdness in the steering at low speed tip in that always makes me feel like it is slipping, and I would like to figure that out. Maybe I just need more tire pressure up front. Running 33/36. With the different ergos from footpeg and handlebar changes the front feels very light. But the whole thing feels very light and slightly top heavy compared with my Bonneville.

Anyway, I think even bigger main jets might be worth trying. I have some 132.5 that I might put in. But I wish I could lower the needles in that case.

[cbrfxr67]

Interesting!  Really enjoy reading the saga of figuring it all out.  Much better than doing it myself haha

Mine is similar on the power under 5k.  I thought maybe something was wrong with it, but it's just asking me for more throttle.  A 'treat' is a good way of describing it, as it's a blast.  I run around 40 on all my bikes.  Why 33/36?

[mr72]

33/36 is recomended stock tire pressure IIRC. The Triumph is 33/38.

[mr72]

Mine is similar on the power under 5k.  I thought maybe something was wrong with it, but it's just asking me for more throttle.  A 'treat' is a good way of describing it, as it's a blast.

I had a bit of a stumble before (read a few pages back) which I definitely found to be too-rich coming off idle. It turned out to be non-stock needles. Putting stock alloy needles in and the 125 jets fixed the stumble and made the light-throttle, low-revs running much better, but at the expense of top end. The 14t sprocket basically results in you running higher revs all the time so the lack at higher revs was apparent.

I think there may be some interaction with the main and pilot jet. Everyone always tries to tell me that it "runs on pilot" except at big throttle openings and big rpms but objectively that doesn't seem to be true. I think by increasing the main jet size it made it richer at idle or just off idle. I might have to retune the idle mixture to be lean at real idle to get it lean enough coming off idle with bigger jets, and in that case maybe 130 or 132.5 will work better. I have a set here ... maybe 130 or 132.5. Might be worth a try.

Another thing I noticed, since removing the center stand, working on the bike on the side stand really is a lot harder. My old method of removing the tank bolts, shove a 2x4 under the rear of the tank to tilt it so I can get a screwdriver on the tank petcock, well that's tricky now because the tank wants to slide off when doing this on the side stand. Gonna have to figure out another way to do this easily. Bungee cord from the right side handlebar?

Another thing I noticed is that both of my last two long rides on the footpeg-modified GS have resulted in serious pain in my left foot. I have a neuroma in that foot (well, both, but the left is much worse) so it's prone to problems anyway. Previous ride, I was wearing some worn boots that exacerbated the problem, but with my new boots I still had a problem, albeit less. I'm really not sure what's causing it. I'm beginning to think it's vibrations in the pegs. The GS transmits a lot more vibrations from the engine to the rider than my Triumph does, and the Triumph doesn't give me this foot pain really at all.

[Endopotential]

Awesome that you're having such a great time on your bike Josh!

I love riding mine, but have no comparison to what a really nicely tuned GS would ride like.

On my Christmas wishlist - I wish there was some way for us to have GS Moto Rally together so we can all see each other's creations in person.

You're in Texas, I'm in SF; I think Showbiz and Buddha are East Coast?  I suppose Kansas has some nice flat roads, though they're probably buried under 5 feet of snow currently... 

[ShowBizWolf]

That would be really neat for sure I am indeed on the East Coast (western Pennsylvania) and I think Buddha is in one of the Carolinas.

[mr72]

Texas is kind of in the middle, right? Long ride to SF. Or Pennsylvania.

[cbrfxr67]

That's be a great adventure on my gs for sure! 

[mr72]

New tires got here a couple of days ago.

I took the rear brake bar off and gently coaxed it to allow enough tire clearance with my 4 lb sledge hammer, then touched up the paint.

Now on to the tire mounting. I hate doing this job. Called a shop to see whether they'd do it, they want $60/wheel to mount tires. Man, what a racket!

Later this afternoon I plan to try swapping the tires myself. I have done it before, it's just not much fun. And of course the old tires from the GS are going onto the Triumph, so I have to do four of them.

EDIT: got too busy with my day job to work on the motorcycle, and now it's raining today and tomorrow, which basically means I can't take the stuff out of the garage that's in my way where I need to work. I considered how to get the bike off the ground now that I removed the center stand and decided a rear swingarm stand from HF for $33 is the way to go, so I may go pick one of those up. That way I can support the rear of the bike with the HF stand and lift the front with ratchet straps from the ceiling and pull both wheels at a time safely. As for the Triumph, my dad brought over his motorcycle jack so I can take it off the ground with that, giving me ability to have all four wheels off at once. Then I might be tempted to haul four wheels and two new tires over to Cycle Gear and tell them I should get the "Watcher Discount" (ha!) for mounting everything up... Or just pay whatever they ask, or price-compare with RideNow... If I can get $20/wheel I'll be happy to pay someone else.

[cbrfxr67]

$20 is worth the pita!  Hopefully that works out!

[mr72]

My dad texted me yesterday wanting to go for a ride, and given that it was a beautiful Central Texas winter day, sunny and 73F, I couldn't resist. I geared up on the Triumph and then he texted me and told me his Honda Shadow wouldn't start, so he was bringing his DR200. That basically meant back roads riding only at low speeds since he's loathe to ride the DR topped out at 60mph. Again I decided to take the old "Renegade" out. We rode over an hour, and it was quite nice. Again I am shocked with how light the GS is, so easy to park!

Even after jetting up to 127.5 and knocking the front sprocket down to 14t I am still getting 50mpg. But I did notice yesterday that I still have a bit of a stumble and drop in power at about 8500-9000 rpm WOT. Maybe I went the wrong way with the jets, maybe they need to go back to 122.5. I need to read the plugs and see what they think. Bike is powerful and quick when underway, no running problems, but it just kind of hits a wall with a bit of a sputter when approaching 9k rpm and it should rev right past that no sweat.

Still haven't gotten around to swapping the new tires on. I had high hopes of doing that yesterday but ran out of time with my other project that is literally "in the way" (in the garage). I should finish that up today with any luck. Ditto that fabbing up a mount for the rear brake reservoir which is still zip tied in place. And while the front wheel is off I think I'll swap in a new set of brake pads that were kindly given to me by a fellow GSTwinner.

Oh yeah, I noticed that while riding with the balls of my feet on the pegs, my right heel occasionally touches the back of the muffler. I think I might just make up a heat shield to prevent me from ruining my boot.