Found my oil leak(s)

[J_Walker]

Alright, here is what it looked like before everything came apart. since all the oil was spread around from the breeze, you can't really tell by the picture where it was leaking from, but pretty much most of it was coming from the half moon shaped areas.


Now a little protip, zip tie your fuel tubes to the frame before you remove them, wont lose your clips and you won't spill anything past a drop of fuel, just remember to turn off the petcock on the gas tank, petcock is off with a 1/4 of a turn! Do not turn it half way, its back on that way!


Now it's pretty much taking the head off, get the gas tank all the way off. a little pro-tip is to take the little piece of aluminum that connects that vent hose from the airbox to the engine, off. 4 bolts, paper gasket, if the paper gasket rips a little, don't really worry just slap a thin layer of RTV on it when you reinstall. what you're gonna need is some clean rags/paper towels and LOTS of Q-tips, I mean just grab a hand full and stuff them in your pocket.. you gonna use all of them.

Clean the surfaces that are going to come in contact with the RTV/gasket. Spray the purple power, ONTO your Rags/Qtips, not onto the part! clean with the surfaces with the degreaser/acetone and make sure to wipe down after them with a dry clean rag. For the rubber gasket,
be VERY careful even if it looks good it's going to be stiff to a point and be sorta easy to break, but I washed mine down with some dawn dishsoap and water in a bucket, with a small piece of rag to scrub at it a little then I took it off an rinsed it off with water, and threw it on a clean rag and used Q-tips to dry the whole thing

Now put the gasket back onto the head, as a trial run to figure out how you're gonna get it back in there with the RTV on the head, when putting the gasket back in, don't let it touch the head until you have the whole thing in there. the GASKET only goes in ONE WAY, notice this.


Now my tube of RTV came with a little applicator tip, that you cut off to get a certain bead size. try to get one with this. but if you don't have one, or want something EVEN BETTER. get a wisdom tooth socket cleaning syringe, I don't know if they have a more "official" name but googling that gave me exactly what they where. having my wisdom teeth removed, at least one good thing came of it.. that little syringe is a godsend for applying PERFECT sized beads of RTV. Another free pro-tip there.  just remove the plunger squirt the RTV into it, and reinsert the plunger... pretty EZPZ

Now roughly this is the size of bead you're going for, and where it needs to be applied. DO NOT apply the silicone into the "grooved" top half! you will want to punch yourself in the  if you ever decide to replace the headgasket over all. because its a real PITA to get out...




Okay now time for the "magic hands" put the gasket ON TOP of the RTV, what I do is kind fold the gasket to get it under the wires/cables and actually go in from the SIDE [notice the sparkplug wire is removed below] I then let it unfold and put the half moon parts in first.
NOTICE THE GASKET ONLY GOES IN ONE WAY.

Now you got the gasket back on there. put the head back on over it, try not to knock the gasket, but it should have sorta a suction on engine part so it won't slide around easy. you will probably get some spots that didn't "click" in just right, I used a dental pick to push and pull the gasket so it would fit perfectly, go around and check all 4 sides to make sure its seated

Now put the bolts and when I mean, hand tighten, just take the allen bolt bit and hold it in your fingers, and finger tighten only!

Wait 1 hour

Then whip out your torque wrench and torque down to 11 foot pounds, mine doesn't really work below 15 foot pounds, so I just stuck it on 15 and torqued it down to 15, nothing felt sketchy or stripped so 15 is OKAY.



That is it! Wait 24 hours for the RTV to fully cure before turning on the engine. oh and remember to plug in any wires you unplugged and to turn the fuel tank petcock back on..  EZPZ

[J_Walker]

I suppose a real thin bead top and bottom to "fill in the cracks" wouldn't hurt.

I'm just going by how I've always used it, as a gasket replacement.  I once rebuilt a Jeep Cherokee transfer case without a single proper gasket.  Took two whole tubes of RTV!  Held oil for years.  Bought that truck with like 112k and finally junked it around 190k.  Still ran strong, the body deteriorated, though.

there is some places that are OKAY to use RTV.. if you're just trying to keep oil from leaking, and you really don't see huge amounts of oil pressure. then its okay to use RTV. and RTV is okay with paper gaskets to fill any inconsistent case machining. or just a dab to get the paper gasket to stick to a casing encase of FGS floppy gasket syndrome.

this is why I mentioned earlier if his gasket was cracked/dry rotted that it can't really be reused or repaired, and why I said to be very careful when handling the old gasket as if fully ripping and its time for a new one.. but them leaking is a pretty cheap easy fix. and if they are leaking up and AROUND the gasket [oil coming from the grooved side] RTV in a horse needle can be injected up in there to "shut" the leak up. lol

[Darkstar]

gasket

Hey man, thanks for documenting this so thoroughly, I know it's a lot more work, but you gave me a few things to consider. I think I'm going will be to use RTV as a gasket replacement, and also replace the bolt o-rings. Will keep you posted. thanks again

[HPP8140]

I recommend Hylomar® Universal Blue sealant

[J_Walker]

gasket

Hey man, thanks for documenting this so thoroughly, I know it's a lot more work, but you gave me a few things to consider. I think I'm going will be to use RTV as a gasket replacement, and also replace the bolt o-rings. Will keep you posted. thanks again

hah the post was the most "work". I had to do mine anyway it was just snapping pictures along the way. I would advise against using JUST the RTV as a gasket.. the complicated parts are gonna be those half moon shapes.. I dunno its only $26.95 on bikebandit for a whole new gasket. if money is tight just keep riding it with blowing oil as is, and don't take it apart. until you can afford a new gasket. it doesn't leak that much unless there is a whole blown out piece of rubber. but you do you.

[Darkstar]

I would advise against using JUST the RTV as a gasket.

And I just realized why. I'm surprised in those nihon-jin engineers for putting out such a crappy design on this. I was cleaned my gasket and surfaces just as you did, applied a thin bead to the head valve head surface, laid the gasket in place, and then put the cover on. Had to adjust it as it squirmed around. I'll take it for a spin tomorrow afternoon and see if it spews. Thanks!

[Watcher]

I would advise against using JUST the RTV as a gasket.

And I just realized why.

Those half moons would be hard to do, lol!

[Rallyfan]

Great pictures!

May I ask though: What about the OTHER leak, down by the sprocket and chain? Did you do the o-ring there or? And, do you have pictures of that? Thanks!

[Darkstar]

May I ask though: What about the OTHER leak, down by the sprocket and chain? Did you do the o-ring there or?

J_Walker and I are doing the same gasket fix. I started the thread about this and the clutch and he posted the pics. To answer your question, when I opened up the sprocket cover I discovered a pound of chain lube thrown on the wall. Someone here suggested that the leak down there may have actually been the lube melting and dripping down. Yesterday after fixing the valve cover gasket I degreased the entire engine and later today I go for a test ride. If I see any oil coming from the sprocket area, I'll know that it is indeed the clutch o-ring. If that's the case, I'll take pics and document it for you, under a new thread.

[Rallyfan]

THANK YOU!!!!

I find myself torn... On the one hand, I hope you DON'T have a sprocket area leak. On the other hand, since I too might have a sprocket area leak... I'd like to see a how-to thread...

If you do find a leak there (knock on wood) please do a thread, I'd really appreciate it!

Good luck and thanks again!

[Darkstar]

If you do find a leak there (knock on wood) please do a thread

You're out of luck, so far anyway. I took it for a hard 30 minute ride and not a drop of oil anywhere. Looks like the RTV held up and the clutch o-ring is good. I'm doing 200 miles Sunday though and that will be the real test. Previously, I was losing >1ml of oil per mile. If I'm still losing some, it means my control oil rings are burnt. That's where this all started for me. Crossing my fingers.

[Rallyfan]

Ok thanks. I'll degrease mine ASAP and see what happens also.

[Rallyfan]

Ok so I left the cover on but sprayed degreaser and then water under it from the rear side and below and I dried and lubed the chain. The oil now is... worse which may be good news(?!). My theory is there's globs of old lube under there and I scratched the surface. I'll see what happens...

[J_Walker]

Ok so I left the cover on but sprayed degreaser and then water under it from the rear side and below and I dried and lubed the chain. The oil now is... worse which may be good news(?!). My theory is there's globs of old lube under there and I scratched the surface. I'll see what happens...

There's this engine cleaner stuff I get from ace it comes in a big spray can.. when I NEED something completely cleaned, I use it.

http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3077200&KPID=4662678&cid=CAPLA:G:Shopping_-_Catch_All_-_DT&pla=pla_4662678&k_clickid=11e5ebee-2c29-4b64-922e-6834caf29fc1

actually its cheaper at walmart.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Gunk-Heavy-Duty-Gel-Engine-Degreaser/16816126?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=0&adid=22222222227016951077&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=c&wl3=42977346272&wl4=pla-81469353872&wl5=9012405&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=8175035&wl11=online&wl12=16816126&wl13=&veh=sem

but walmart is a 25minute drive, for me, and my ace is like 8 tops.

[Rallyfan]

Yes that stuff doesn't mess around thanks!

[Rallyfan]

I too found caked grease under the clutch cover and cleaned it up as best I could. Bet that's the issue.

[Darkstar]

How did it go, is it still leaking? Last week I found another leak from my oil cooler, easy one to miss. Just fixed.

[Rallyfan]

The sprocket cover is now clean. I now see oil from the crankcase cover on the same side but it may stil be residual; I'll have to see.

[sledge]

Don't use RTV......please

You can clean it off the outside but not the inside. Imagine a cured fragment of RTV breaking off inside and becoming lodged in an oil gallery or between the clutch plates or in the selector drum.

You shouldn't need it anyway, use a new gasket, clean the surfaces properly and torque the fastenings correctly, that's all it takes.

If you feel you have to use something non setting gasket compound like Hylomar is the way to go.

[J_Walker]

Don't use RTV......please

You can clean it off the outside but not the inside. Imagine a cured fragment of RTV breaking off inside and becoming lodged in an oil gallery or between the clutch plates or in the selector drum.

You shouldn't need it anyway, use a new gasket, clean the surfaces properly and torque the fastenings correctly, that's all it takes.

If you feel you have to use something non setting gasket compound like Hylomar is the way to go.

considering the head gasket I used, was new, with less then 5k miles on it, leaking. I'd say its the new headgaskets that don't fit right.

also the "pressure" of the engines case, presses the RTV outward, the proof is in the pudding, there's always some "outside" squeeze out of the RTV after running it for about 100-200 miles. NOT before.

I did not develop any oil leaks. but since my engine is now dead again, and it's gonna get torn down again to find out what exactly is wrong, ill report any loose RTV anywhere in the engine, since mine is red, it will be easy to see/find. I've got 1k miles on the bike since this post, from when it died. so I'd say more then enough time for something to dislodge any loose RTV.