http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2008/09/06/do0604.xml
I remember hearing about this before ,
but they switch it on on the 10th , basicly they want to recreate the big bang , but people are saying it could produce a black hole and suck the earth up .
these *Scientists* say even if it did produce a black hole , it would last a millionth of a second , and that it couldnt even swollow a atom
Thoughts?
the invention of the internal combustion engine did more to damn mankind over the lasthundred years than anything else.
oh, well, TV f%&ked it up pretty good too.
a black hole ? who cares.
Quote from: Jay_wolf on September 05, 2008, 06:13:33 PM
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2008/09/06/do0604.xml
I remember hearing about this before ,
but they switch it on on the 10th , basicly they want to recreate the big bang , but people are saying it could produce a black hole and suck the earth up .
these *Scientists* say even if it did produce a black hole , it would last a millionth of a second , and that it couldnt even swollow a atom
Thoughts?
My thoughts are that you'll survive the 10th. You'll read about it on the 11th, and it'll probably not be too exciting. They might poke fun at it for a week or so, but after that you won't hear much about it. I don't buy the "big bang" story to begin with! ...or for that matter, evolution or anything else man has dreamed up to explain away creation. My $.02. Some won't like it, but I won't hold it against them. :cheers:
ill post on this thread on teh 11th, lettin ya know, im alright :thumb:
+1 on what TheUBS said. :thumb:
BeSafe
PJ
+2 on ubs reply. ill stop there cause i dont wanna tardify the thread
Well if we die u cant,
Quote from: theUBS on September 05, 2008, 09:52:32 PM
I don't buy the "big bang" story to begin with! ...or for that matter, evolution or anything else man has dreamed up to explain away creation.
So when you get an infection, you instruct your doctor to prescribe only penicillin, because it kills all bugs that were around in 1950, and of course those were all created 6000 years ago and have been unchanged in the time since? Or you avoid all medicine, since your death is G-d's will, and "science" won't affect it? Or am you a hypocrite?
"Drug resistant bacteria are a myth" - We'll put it on your headstone if you are a man of principle.
I think that both sides can have their opinions and in the end it really doesn't matter.
Science is about physical and mathematical facts, not beliefs and opinion.
Understanding science doesn't require leaving your religion. On the same token, understanding religion doesn't require leaving science.
Quote from: DoD#i on September 06, 2008, 12:58:52 PM
Quote from: theUBS on September 05, 2008, 09:52:32 PM
I don't buy the "big bang" story to begin with! ...or for that matter, evolution or anything else man has dreamed up to explain away creation.
So when you get an infection, you instruct your doctor to prescribe only penicillin, because it kills all bugs that were around in 1950, and of course those were all created 6000 years ago and have been unchanged in the time since? Or you avoid all medicine, since your death is G-d's will, and "science" won't affect it? Or am you a hypocrite?
"Drug resistant bacteria are a myth" - We'll put it on your headstone if you are a man of principle.
Bacteria are still bacteria.
It's not to say that adaptation isn't a very believable part of science or religion. However, I don't believe the spontaneous occurence of life, as Darwin imagined it, is possible. (For the record, that involved something along the lines of proteins in a mud puddle being united by a bolt of lightning.) If Darwin himself had the benefit of the electron microscope, he would have went back to the drawing board. Even in his own writings, he stated that if the simple cell was more complicated than he believed it to be, then his explanations of the origin of life would have to be tossed. There are many processes going on inside the "simple" cell involving many essential parts--each part not surviving independently of the others. It's called irreducible complexity. For some reason though, the scientific community has taken Darwin's theory--and it is nothing more than theory--and ran with it. It's NOT proven fact.
For the record though, I don't really trust most doctors. Most just want to write you a script for something that does more harm than good and send you on your way. If I die and a headstone is placed above my body, you can put whatever you want on it. I won't know the difference. :thumb:
dod its not G-D its god. mmmkay take care :thumb:
Yama, there are several religions that believe it is inappropriate to spell out God and submit G-D as a substitute when needed for writing. Judaism comes to mind most clearly as one, but I do believe there are a few sects of christianity that follow this principle. If you want Dod#1 to respect your religious beliefs try being accepting of his right to comply with his own beliefs.
:dunno_white:
fine ill try being accepting of his demeaning sarcasm. :thumb: because i also take G-d as horribly offensive. meaning god d****t
really???? God Damn man. lol. I dont find much offensive. :cheers:
Neither do i, cept for gd. i dont find f**k offensive or anythign like htat. or teh words damn by itself
They have been building this thing for years its truely amazing, a huge ring with electromagnets that launch particles around a huge 27k long ring and they meet at a station at the north and south where they try to capture the exact moment. The belief is that they will get atoms to collide with each other and give an insight into if this was possibly how planets were created, not just our own but all planets, just atoms in space colliding with each other. Nothing is going to happen and im 100% confident. Like they say it happens on a miniscule scale. Now if they had built a machine which made all the atoms around the sun spin around into each other - then id be more worried because the scale is so much larger and thats how basically what theyre trying to see if that could have happened. They will spin round crash into each other, sensors will capture the moment and it will all be over in a blink. Then they will spend years going through the reasearch.
Depends which was u see it , it may be so tiny we couldnt see with the naked eye , and they have said yes, there are possabiltys that a small black hole could be formed ,but lasting 1000000th of a second etc , what concerns me , is that they are making the atoms collide at 99.99% the speed of light , and the force they are going to hit at will split the atoms creating a huge amount of energy *Granted at a small scale to re create the big bang ,. stars are created by alot of gas building and mixing in space then a igition , to create a burning ball of gas. Black holes are formed by starts collapsing under there own weight
Black holes get bigger from when they are created , however i dont believe on earth we can create the sort of power that could make one happen
The project has cost 6 billion pounds , what a waste of money i think , being that religion dismisses the whole idea of it , so u have already lost faith in that aspect to anyone who follows a God, the money could of been spent in such a better way
Worth every penny! ...but probably incoclusive...maybe a step forward to understanding the origins of life, the universe and everything.
Whatever it proves, or fails to prove the believers in creationism and talking snakes won't be moved.
neither will the non believers be moved Soooooooooooooooooooo
John Titor had some good comments on the subject of CERN and blackholes and time travel.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Titor
Quote from: theUBS on September 06, 2008, 04:04:54 PM
Quote from: DoD#i on September 06, 2008, 12:58:52 PM
Quote from: theUBS on September 05, 2008, 09:52:32 PM
I don't buy the "big bang" story to begin with! ...or for that matter, evolution or anything else man has dreamed up to explain away creation.
So when you get an infection, you instruct your doctor to prescribe only penicillin, because it kills all bugs that were around in 1950, and of course those were all created 6000 years ago and have been unchanged in the time since? Or you avoid all medicine, since your death is G-d's will, and "science" won't affect it? Or am you a hypocrite?
"Drug resistant bacteria are a myth" - We'll put it on your headstone if you are a man of principle.
Bacteria are still bacteria.
It's not to say that adaptation isn't a very believable part of science or religion. However, I don't believe the spontaneous occurence of life, as Darwin imagined it, is possible. (For the record, that involved something along the lines of proteins in a mud puddle being united by a bolt of lightning.) If Darwin himself had the benefit of the electron microscope, he would have went back to the drawing board. Even in his own writings, he stated that if the simple cell was more complicated than he believed it to be, then his explanations of the origin of life would have to be tossed. There are many processes going on inside the "simple" cell involving many essential parts--each part not surviving independently of the others. It's called irreducible complexity. For some reason though, the scientific community has taken Darwin's theory--and it is nothing more than theory--and ran with it. It's NOT proven fact.
For the record though, I don't really trust most doctors. Most just want to write you a script for something that does more harm than good and send you on your way. If I die and a headstone is placed above my body, you can put whatever you want on it. I won't know the difference. :thumb:
So what you are saying is that you do believe in evolution, just not abiogenesis. Wish you had said this in the first place. Also, natural selection is the process. Darwin's theories are just a starting point. Darwin's theory is just a theory. Natural selection is just a theory like gravity is just a theory. They each have approximately the same amount of scientific backing. How often do you drop things and not have them fall to earth?
We haven't run across irreducible complexity yet. All of the delightful examples presented by the 'creation scientist' oxymorons have been debunked. However, guess what. If natural selection is disproved scientifically, the scientists will move on. They actually change what they do based on data.
we all have thoughts, and we ALL have opinions. neither one can prove with 100% accuracy/fact. there is faith involved on both sides. pull up the def. of faith, you'll see what i mean
Quote from: yamahonkawazuki on September 07, 2008, 07:53:56 PM
we all have thoughts, and we ALL have opinions. neither one can prove with 100% accuracy/fact. there is faith involved on both sides. pull up the def. of faith, you'll see what i mean
Actually, if you don't have proof, you need faith. As you suggested, I looked up the definition on dictionary.com. Here's the top three, emphasis mine.
1. confidence or trust in a person or thing: faith in another's ability.
2. belief that is not based on proof: He had faith that the hypothesis would be substantiated by fact.3. belief in God or in the doctrines or teachings of religion: the firm faith of the Pilgrims.
Faith is what you use when you don't have proof. The reason the nasty mean scientists don't want things like 'creation science' (an oxymoron) taught in school, is because science actually requires proof, and most science is based on empirical, observed phenomena. Most people don't understand that to be called a scientific theory, the hypothesis must be supported on a regular basis under controlled circumstances. Simply not understanding something is not adequate to disprove it. It doesn't fly to say 'I don't understand how this could be done, god must have done it' in scientific circles. As the band Suicidal Tendencies said, "Just 'cause you don't understand don't mean it don't make no sense".
Gravity is just a theory? :laugh:
Quote from: MattCodder on September 07, 2008, 08:29:26 PM
Quote from: yamahonkawazuki on September 07, 2008, 07:53:56 PM
we all have thoughts, and we ALL have opinions. neither one can prove with 100% accuracy/fact. there is faith involved on both sides. pull up the def. of faith, you'll see what i mean
Actually, if you don't have proof, you need faith. As you suggested, I looked up the definition on dictionary.com. Here's the top three, emphasis mine.
1. confidence or trust in a person or thing: faith in another's ability.
2. belief that is not based on proof: He had faith that the hypothesis would be substantiated by fact.
3. belief in God or in the doctrines or teachings of religion: the firm faith of the Pilgrims.
Faith is what you use when you don't have proof. The reason the nasty mean scientists don't want things like 'creation science' (an oxymoron) taught in school, is because science actually requires proof, and most science is based on empirical, observed phenomena. Most people don't understand that to be called a scientific theory, the hypothesis must be supported on a regular basis under controlled circumstances. Simply not understanding something is not adequate to disprove it. It doesn't fly to say 'I don't understand how this could be done, god must have done it' in scientific circles. As the band Suicidal Tendencies said, "Just 'cause you don't understand don't mean it don't make no sense".
but evolution is still known as a theory . as are a few otehrs, like the big bang, etc :thumb: , so by definition it is still on faith :cheers:
I wouldn't be too concerned about the formation of a black hole, I mean everyone was worked into a lather over Y2K and I think that somewhere there is a group of eggheads that laugh their balls off about selling that line of crap to the public and people ate it up. Slamming particles together at nearly the speed of light is cool as hell.
lol the accelerator is old tech, hell its been goin on for two decades now. i cite fermilab, in illinois, i lived VERY near one of these things :thumb:
I thought Fermilab was pretty cool. I got to visit when I was in highschool. we actually got to see the accelerators.
Quote from: Cal Price on September 07, 2008, 07:28:17 AM
Worth every penny! ...but probably incoclusive...maybe a step forward to understanding the origins of life, the universe and everything.
Whatever it proves, or fails to prove the believers in creationism and talking snakes won't be moved.
Hey now, if you're going to poke fun, don't forget about Balaam's donkey. :laugh:
Quote from: MattCodder on September 07, 2008, 04:35:08 PM
So what you are saying is that you do believe in evolution, just not abiogenesis. Wish you had said this in the first place. Also, natural selection is the process. Darwin's theories are just a starting point. Darwin's theory is just a theory. Natural selection is just a theory like gravity is just a theory. They each have approximately the same amount of scientific backing. How often do you drop things and not have them fall to earth?
We haven't run across irreducible complexity yet. All of the delightful examples presented by the 'creation scientist' oxymorons have been debunked. However, guess what. If natural selection is disproved scientifically, the scientists will move on. They actually change what they do based on data.
Evolution on a small scale perhaps. I believe that intelligent design has allowed for a measure of biodiversity. If you choose to use call it "natural selection" as it's called in scientific circles, that's fine. Though believing in creation does indeed require faith, so also does abiogenesis. There is no evidence truly supporting it. It's never been duplicated in a labratory. What data is used to form that hypothesis without taking a major leap of faith? The rest of evolution on its grander scale requires an assumption of abiogenesis--being unproven, that seems like putting the cart before the horse to me. Especially if it's going to be taught in schools to the extent that it just becomes accepted as truth, while the concept of creation is either skimmed over or left out completely.
Creation by no means has been debunked.
As for faith, I prefer this definition:
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. :cheers:
Lets force evolution into action, lets keep leapping off of high things so that our offsrping may slowly develope the ability to fly, or glide at the very least. Whos first???? Who has the faith?
hey we only have a day left to live...i am going to spend all my money on coke and hookers :cheers:
Yeah, that worked so well the last time, Frankie. <slap>
good one....don't let me get away with that bull shaZam! :thumb: :bs: :2guns:
You guys be careful out there, especially around 11.30pm - all those crazy people will be out celebrating that life will finally end, also all the people too scared to commit suicide incase it fails and they end up not dead but injured will be out throwing themselves off buildings :)
well if they are too scared to commit suicide i will kill them for $10 if they provide the weapon, $20 to break their neck and $60 for a family of 4...hey that is a $20 savings
Quote from: Kasumi on September 09, 2008, 09:45:15 AM
You guys be careful out there, especially around 11.30pm - all those crazy people will be out celebrating that life will finally end.
...that element I did forget to take into consideration. Gotta watch out for those guys!
Just Hours Away , Steven Hawkings made me feel safe , If this is the end , what a f%$king ride its been :cheers: :cheers:
Quote from: frankieG on September 09, 2008, 09:16:44 AM
good one....don't let me get away with that bull shaZam! :thumb: :bs: :2guns:
damn right, id drive to NB and whip your liberal ass, from Fredericton , to gaspay and back :icon_confused: :thumb:, no coke. but hell get drunk and a few hookers?
Quote from: Jay_wolf on September 09, 2008, 04:36:01 PM
Just Hours Away , Steven Hawkings made me feel safe , If this is the end , what a f%$king ride its been :cheers: :cheers:
Amen to that!
p.s. i thort id let you know after the event that these collisions happen around you all the time, the only difference with this is that they have a controlled environment to watch them in.
See Google this morning?
(http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k57/n2brewha/lhc.gif)
so r we in another dimension now? our overlord a giant juice laden coke crazed bunny
They've only turned the machine on. The begining of the end won't come for another 30 days or so when they smash stuff. :thumb:
I dont no what the hype was , they didnt even mention its gonna tested , i thought it was the gonna happen today! l 21th october thats the day it all hits the fan
Lol, that would be careless off them, never tested it before and they just flicked it on to full power and stood back and watch the shaZam! hit the fan. Nah just testing, all theyve done is fired two seperate beams today.
Plus like i said before particles are colliding with each other all the time at the speed of the light micro milimeters from your head, have you been sucked into a black hole :cookoo:
Id be more worried about the whole thing melting from teh heat of the magnets than creating a black hole. Chill out have a beer.
But think about it, the first people to be gobbled up by the black hole will be the french and the swiss. Yea, the french think they can surrender their way out of this ... but are they in for a surprise ...
Cool.
Buddha.
Quote from: The Buddha on September 10, 2008, 11:27:03 AM
Yea, the french think they can surrender their way out of this ... but are they in for a surprise ...
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
f%$king funniest thing i've read in ages. I spat my tea over the keyboard lol
Quote from: The Buddha on September 10, 2008, 11:27:03 AM
Yea, the french think they can surrender their way out of this ... but are they in for a surprise ...
Cool.
Buddha.
<snicker, snicker, snicker> ...okay, I can't hold it!
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
that was pretty fuckin funny.... :laugh: :laugh:
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :cheers:
now google "the complete military history of france" :thumb:
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: yamahonkawazuki on September 10, 2008, 11:57:52 PM
now google "the complete military history of france" :thumb:
Military ... they have a military ...
I was there in 2004, as I got off the plane they shouted all hail the Buddha, and did a hitler salute and knelt down ... I said OK, and I went to the cafe they had, and they charged me $14 for a cup of coffee, and I went ohhh this is their game, all surrender on the outside, all expensive on the inside.
Cool.
Buddha.
man check your history.
1. the american revolution was a losing battle until the french joined in. ever wonder where the statue of liberty came from? no french help no america...period.
2. in WW1 it was the french that stopped the germans
3. oh not again it was the french that held off the germans so that the british army could escape.
3. in ww2 it was the french that made d day possible
4. it was the french who was kicking ass in vietnam until the american took over
this whole anti french thing is just american ignorance of history.
america did not rescue anyone in ww1 or ww2. we stayed out of it until we made as much money as possible as war profiteers and joined in the fight when it was convenient.
Quote from: The Buddha on September 11, 2008, 08:30:24 AM
Military ... they have a military ...
I was there in 2004, as I got off the plane they shouted all hail the Buddha, and did a hitler salute and knelt down ... I said OK, and I went to the cafe they had, and they charged me $14 for a cup of coffee, and I went ohhh this is their game, all surrender on the outside, all expensive on the inside.
Cool.
Buddha.
Who needs a military when no one can afford to invade you?
hmm....my history books said that we, america, saved the french's ass, not the other way around. and the Statue of Liberty was a gift from France you are correct. the only reason you say the french "stoped" the germans is because they couldn't go any farther once they got across france! a little thing called the english channel. and the british helped us at d-day thank you. my grandfather was there. para-trooper at Normandy. lost his hearing driving across northern france and the jeep next to his hit a landmine. many cheers to gramps! :cheers: :cheers:
I think i have it Wierd
My dads side grandad fought in the war , On the German Side
My mums side Grandad fought for the British . I was kool either way!
Apparently there are 40 words for surrender in french. Now these I believe sound very very much like other commonly used words in french. So for example when they say "I want breakfast", It sounds like "I want to surrender" So I think they surrender by accident when the general wakes up in the morning and asks for his breakfast. See how easy that explaination is. Yea ...
Cool.
Buddha.
Hahahahahaha. The french are always a great thing to joke about. Thats why they hate us americans. But damned if they dont need us. If shaZam! hit the fan, thier asses would be toast. No one likes america, but everyone wants us to help them when they get thier selves into knee deep shaZam! they cant crawl out of. They may not say it out loud, and we may force our way in, but hey, everyone wants it. lmao! The french can kiss my ass with thier pay to use portajohns. f%$k that ill piss on the side of a building. How can you charge a man to do whats natural? :flipoff: :cheers:
Well Frankies sort of right, the French havn't always been pathetic however in terms of the war, if they were so amazing they wouldn't have let the germans walk all over france to begin with. You could say a select few, the underground reveolutionairies were courages as they came out of the woodwork to help out when we got in there and yes they laid their lives on the line to protect us so we could fall back and retreat, however they needed our help which is why they did it. But i dont care either way.
And yes the Americans did just profit from all the wars and only jumped in when they realised the people who were buying shaZam! off them were fast running out of money and there was no more to be made so then jumped in to save face. However its all appreciated even if you did turn up late!
As for the french now, they run away from any possible fight which could occur, they are the only country who wont donate troops to combat missions, for the UN, NATO etc... even if its to protect peoples liberties. Yet that is a requirement to stay in these organisations. And do you know why, because in real life no one would want to fight side by side with a french man knowing it took hell on earth to get them there lol. And thats not even because you dont trust the actual man next to you, he may be willing to die to save your life but hes going to be no good if the frenchies come and pick him up in a helo and leave you in the shaZam! in the middle of a fire fight because theyve chickened out.
People pick on the French because they want protection but arn't willing to protect anyone else in return. Thats the real reason.
no country could stop the germans including russia...until the germans ran out of steam. as for today, well france is a power with the bomb so i doubt very much if there will be any invading going on :)
Errrm , England Has been Invaded Once in the 1000's of years we've been a country , i hate to say it was the french in 1066
But otherwise we have never been invaded ..
unless i am mistaken the scots did a number in britannia in the 1500's was it? i can't remember. but Britain is an island which always helps. besides who would want it..hahahaha jk
have you Seen Braveheart? The English won
oh i know but Britain was still invaded. France was invaded but not now, America was getting its ass kicked by the British. Washington and the white house was taken by the British with out much of a fight at all. we see saw back and forth . BTW i tend to get my history from books or class rather than television or movies.
Considering its part of the Uk and theres nothing stopping someone walking over to england ,
I used Braveheart as a Ref , Im pretty sure Mel Gibson wasnt Alive back then
Quote from: Jay_wolf on September 13, 2008, 09:11:53 AM
have you Seen Braveheart? The English won
i saw braveheart.....the scots won. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: jserio on September 13, 2008, 12:42:25 PM
Quote from: Jay_wolf on September 13, 2008, 09:11:53 AM
have you Seen Braveheart? The English won
i saw braveheart.....the scots won. :icon_mrgreen:
lol, basing facts on movies now eh ? cool, i'm gonna smoke some fatties and jam some bob marley. HA !
SWEET!!! I WANT SOME! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
I was planning to try a roof jump as featured in 'The Matrix' based on other films such as Braveheart which depicts only the most truthful of events i think it must be possible and will be having a go on monday.
Anyone wishing to watch my fatal demise i should think it will be featured in the evening news :laugh:
On a side note, bravehearts accurate :thumb:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j50ZssEojtM
Quote from: frankieG on September 13, 2008, 06:44:19 AM
Britain is an island which always helps. besides who would want it..hahahaha jk
CORRECT!...... if it wasnt for the English Channel my name would probably be Hans, I would drive a VW Beetle to my job in the local kraftwerk and look like this down the pub.......
(http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd92/iainmcdermott/lederhosen.jpg)
The mentioned on the news yesterday that the Machine broke down ... Again , The Magnets keep overheating in the Minus 200 Celsus tunnel , Waste of 6 billion
Indeed my good man, indeed :cheers:
6 billion dollars? are they f%$king mad? if they want to blow shaZam! up, i can do it for less than 6 billion dollars. :cookoo:
Yeah, but they're gonna blow really little shaZam! up...................less is more or some shaZam!.....
4.4 billion Pounds..... 6.6 billion Euros ..... 8.8 billion Us
along the lines of that
well hell, $50 of c4, and i have some broken stuff, Sooooooooo :laugh: :laugh:
ARMAGEDDON (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLnfFvKNU_Y) :cookoo: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: Jay_wolf on September 22, 2008, 03:55:27 PM
4.4 billion Pounds..... 6.6 billion Euros ..... 8.8 billion Us
along the lines of that
That doesn't even scratch the surface of the kind of cash our government pisses away. 700 Billion for a pointless war in Iraq, another 700 billion to bail out financial companies that gambled in the home loan market and now don't want to take it in the pooper so they want the feds to save them. Congress will actually have to vote to raise the national debt limit to something like 111 trillion to do it. 8.8 billion is nothing.
nevermind... in further reading my comment was alreayd addressed
Quote from: Jay_wolf on September 21, 2008, 11:33:12 AM
The mentioned on the news yesterday that the Machine broke down ... Again , The Magnets keep overheating in the Minus 200 Celsus tunnel , Waste of 6 billion
Riiiight. Machines break down, machines get fixed, and the first machine of a type that has never been built before is going to have breakdowns and repairs until they figure out where theory and practice (which are the same in theory) diverge in practice (where they are different). If this actually requires a change in theory, it will be made, and knowledge will be gained. If it requires a change in engineering practice, that will be made, and knowledge will be gained. A far better return on money spent than many other expenditures.
someone tell me again how this is "knowledge" gained is going to benefit us? i'm all for learning and changing practices etc. we can always use improvement in almost every aspect. but how will this help us improve anything? what are they hoping to gain by this expenditure? :dunno_white:
Well, now, if we knew that ahead of time, we wouldn't have to do it - a fundamental problem of fundamental research is people (often in the funding side) who want to know ahead of time what is going to be found - when the whole point of doing it at all is to find out.
Quote from: jserio on September 24, 2008, 12:10:27 PM
someone tell me again how this is "knowledge" gained is going to benefit us? i'm all for learning and changing practices etc. we can always use improvement in almost every aspect. but how will this help us improve anything? what are they hoping to gain by this expenditure? :dunno_white:
Benefits of this, who knows?! Theres lots of theorys but you don't know what your going to find out. It could give us the possibility to create whole new atoms, from scratch, create stuff thats never existed before, learn how to break down nuclear waste so its as safe as drinking water. No one really knows, When your down to the level of research they are doing, breaking down even atoms then your getting to the core of what scientists believe everything is made off. If you know how its made then you can inturn know how to make it/change it, evolve it. Endless possibilites.
At least your not feeling any of the cost from this, perhaps focussing on the $2300 your going to have to spend to bail your economy out of the shaZam!. (dont worry you won't be alone we will be there too)
i don't even wanna talk about this f%$king idiotic bailout. it's stupidity. the problem however is we're f%&ked no matter what we do. the economy is going to tank, drop whatever you wanna say. it's gonna happen. all this bail out might do is buy a little time but if we do this AND then the economy tanks, we're even more f%&ked than if we had just let them fall flat on their face. it would serve them right, greedy fucks. the banks and CEO'S have been f%$king us with no KY for years. now they turn to me, after turning me down(and many fellow americans) when asked for a loan for some stupid shaZam! ass reason or another, and they expect me to pay them? why the f%$k should i have to? i didn't default on my mortgage. i didn't buy a home i couldn't afford. i didn't write up these crazy programs to sell tons of mortgages to people who couldn't afford them. i bought smart. got an FHA loan, fixed rate. it's idiotic that i have to pay to clean up this mess. damn. pisses me off! (i said i didn't wanna talk. lmao. )
Quote from: jserio on September 26, 2008, 05:45:48 PM
i don't even wanna talk about this f%$king idiotic bailout. it's stupidity. the problem however is we're f%$ked no matter what we do. the economy is going to tank, drop whatever you wanna say. it's gonna happen. all this bail out might do is buy a little time but if we do this AND then the economy tanks, we're even more f%$ked than if we had just let them fall flat on their face. it would serve them right, greedy f%$ks. the banks and CEO'S have been f%$king us with no KY for years. now they turn to me, after turning me down(and many fellow americans) when asked for a loan for some stupid shaZam! ass reason or another, and they expect me to pay them? why the f%$k should i have to? i didn't default on my mortgage. i didn't buy a home i couldn't afford. i didn't write up these crazy programs to sell tons of mortgages to people who couldn't afford them. i bought smart. got an FHA loan, fixed rate. it's idiotic that i have to pay to clean up this mess. damn. pisses me off! (i said i didn't wanna talk. lmao. )
What more can I say. :dunno_white:
:thumb:
the government is bailing out the greedy....so if you owe the bank 5 thousand dollars you have a problem if you owe the bank 5 million dollars the bank has a problem.
so much for capitalism. it is nothing more than greed. i don't have a problem with government regulating banks, investments etc but i do have a problem when they let the banks run nilly willy until the brink of collapse. so much for the little guy.
Money rules and affects everything, the only thing that affects money is war and oil. If you don't try and fix the banks your screwed as is probably huge proportion of the world, we certinally will be. If you choose not to support it then theres not even a chance of getting out of this mess. Much as its rediculous and down right unfair, its going to have to be done. The question is, when and will it be enough.
If the government wants to fix the economy, instead of bailing out the banks they should give every US taxpayer over the age of 18 $100k. That would only cost $138 billion (if my math is correct- in 2007 there were roughly 138 million taxpayers)- way less than paying cocksmoking bank execs. How many of those bad mortgages would stay bad if all of the sudden people had means to pay them down? Sure some dumbasses would go pick up a Ferrari and then have their house taken away and they would deserve it, but that would get the economy back on track in a hurry and cost the taxpayers a lot less. Fixed rate mortgages FTW!
At 100k each for 138 million tax paying citizens would actually only equal 13.8 trillion which to me not almost impossible, but why not if we are expected to give 700 billion to a banking industry that has honestly taken advantage of me at every turn. As americans, we are used to hearing the govt throw out rediculus figures and I deceided to investigate a bit on what 700 billion could acomplish. First, the govt could give every tax payer, at 138 million tax payers, a bit over $5000 each. More importantly though, 700 billion is enough money to actually end poverty in Africa. The entire continent, with enough food and resources for everyone. It could end homelessness in America. I personally do not believe we are in any position to bail out Africa, the homeless, and surely not the banking industry. I only put the three in the same category because in one way or another their problems are self induced. The worst offender being the banking industry because I would assume that they would be experts on finance. It doesn't really matter whether I think it is stupid or not though, because unless I move, whatever deceisions are made, I will have to live with. Even if I become homeless in the process.
To Darwin for a second, I read "The Origin of Species" and he was torn. In his time, to not be regligous was unheard of. Darwin traveled and on one of these trips he began pondering the natural selection theory. It disturbed him because even though his scientific side knew it made the most sense, his religous side knew that this theory contradicted his beliefs. He tried to disprove his ideas and went all around the world trying more to disprove than to prove. Iin the end, he went with science and was persecuted for his deceision. Some of the most brilliant people in history were jailed or institutionalized for going against the church. Even one of the church's historic figures, Martin Luther, was tossed on his ass for saying, "thats just not right" when the catholic church was taking advantage of the poor because they couldnt read. Intellegent Design came along as a reply to the growing support for evolution. Most of history's great minds, even the religous people, agree that evolution has merit and that religion is lacking is merit including, Nietzsche, President Lincoln, Darwin obviously, Einstein, Karl Marx, Carl Sagan, Rosevelt, Thomas Jefferson, Robert Ingersoll, John Adams, Martin Luther,... and many more
"Question Everything or Believe Anything" --Einstein
Yeah, I wasn't sure about the number- too many zeros to keep track of on the stupid accessory calculator in the start menu. I think this country needs to get back to being a fundamentally cash society, credit is far too easy to come by and causes problems like this to fester until the entire economy is gangrenous and a portion must now be cut out- not bandaged up with 700 billion worth of gauze. These banks that gambled on sub-prime mortgages need to be amputated from the economy to save it. There will be ghost pains of missing they way it was once they are gone but the economy will adapt and get used to it.
Quote from: bikejunkie223 on September 28, 2008, 07:15:28 AM
Yeah, I wasn't sure about the number- too many zeros to keep track of on the stupid accessory calculator in the start menu. I think this country needs to get back to being a fundamentally cash society, credit is far too easy to come by and causes problems like this to fester until the entire economy is gangrenous and a portion must now be cut out- not bandaged up with 700 billion worth of gauze. These banks that gambled on sub-prime mortgages need to be amputated from the economy to save it. There will be ghost pains of missing they way it was once they are gone but the economy will adapt and get used to it.
England just bought out its second bank, Bradford and Bingley.
At least they are telling you guys about plans to take your money off you to bail things out. Our country keeps doing it and getting no publicity then all of a sudden interest rates go up and people are looking round for the cause.
Im afraid these days cash society doesn't exist. The government could print off as much green as it wants but all its worth is the paper its printed on. Along time ago that ment your money was worth the resources your country possesed, mainly gold. Each country had to have something of physical worth, all the paper was then was a certificate to prove it. This soon went out of the window when a world market developed and the resources of one country became worth 300 times as much to another country, wealth increased and soon it became impractical to store that amount of wealth in something physical (ie gold). Now it is a world economy your money is worth what you export, be that primary/secondary/tertiary sectors. This means that in this case, your banks are failing, if the government itself was to just go ahead and print more money (effectivly create its own cash) then your money would be worthless, your watering down what your worth to the world. Hence why the government is wanting to take your money from you, in this case its borrowing it rather than creating it. Using money which already exists.
Like was said earlier or in another thread, on every note it says something along the lines of "you promice to pay the bearer on demand..." well in this day and age, there is nothing physical to back that money as it was dispanded with years ago.
There are some states in America that are trying to create physical value in their money, particularly New Hampshire. You can prove what you are worth, in terms of what you own, It is then backed by gold and you are given a certificate to prove that your money is backed by something. These are just like your american notes and alot of stores take them in the states which participate. However what differes is no matter how much the american doller is watered down, your new hampshire (for lack of remebering the proper name for the note - it has nothing to do with new hampshire) note is worth exactly the same, more perhaps as gold is a decreasing resource therefore it becomes more valuable.
unrestrained capitalism keeps the rich richer and when they lose money they steal it from the taxpayers. a combination of socialism and capitalism is the only way. government needs to regulate greed. America is crippled by dept...a dept which can nor will ever be repaid. they are mortgaging our children's and grandchildrens future. both obama and McCain's fiscal plans include increasing the dept. look at Canada who has had a balanced budget since the early 90's and is by law not allowed to spend more than it takes in. the Canadian economy is spanking ours and their housing market is strong. their dollar is strong. all this with health care for everyone. so tell me who has the better system? we wast our money on police, military and security that we would not need if we were not such assholes to the world. i am not talking about being isolationist but we need to tone it down a bit or allot. corporate greed is killing us. tax cuts...bull shaZam!..we need a good 10% tax increase with double that in reduced spending. yes it will hurt but it will work. again look at Canada...they took the bull by the horns when need be and they are much better off because of it. our spend spend spend attitude needs to stop. or else we and our economy, will fall. this is not fear mongering but just plain fact. if the US were a corporation or a family we would have been bankrupt many times over already. the only reason it stay afloat is that no one can call in the marker without the whole thing falling apart. hard facts but facts they are. we don't need all these jails, we don't need all these people in jail. we don't need a cop in every corner. we don't need a huge military and national guard. i mean who are we afraid of? fear sells and that is what is going on. we need to stop this. we have more people in jail than any other country in the world. 1 in every 100 is in jail. why? give them a ticket, make them pay a fine or other measures. don't house them in "criminal universities" give them 3 hots and a cot and expect them to be OK when they get out. the whole system is on its head and we have our collective heads in the sand. man if i thought i would do any good i would run for office in the US like i have done in Canada. but honesty i don't think one man like myself will do any good.
we need to have harsher penalties and execute more criminals.
stock market is crashing!!! went down seven hundred something points the other day. YAY!!!!
and went up a few hundred. lol this however IMHO has only begun :o :cry:
yep, word on the street is that were to blame for the global financial crisis. uh oh spagetti-ohs son! I bet a lot of people shaZam! themselves recently....I wonder if suicide rates are going to go up as a result of the financial crisis.....
i wonder how many financial institutions would collectively crap themselves if those who were responsible borrowers en masse suddenly decided not to pay their loans to protest the bailout of irresponsible lenders and borrowers.
Ya know maybe thats the difference but as a responsible borrower I have never considered not repaying what I owe.
Oh and do me a favor tape the phone call with your mortgage company's collection agent when you tell him your not paying your mortgage because when the LHC comes online it's going to suck the entire planet up anyway.
As far as the end of the world super collider come on baby dady wants a shielded quantum singularity in a package the size of grapefruit to provide power for his new motorcyle that uses compect 300hp wheel moters the size of honeydews because of the breakthroughs in super conducting technology.
Quote from: bettingpython on October 01, 2008, 09:32:17 AM
Oh and do me a favor tape the phone call with your mortgage company's collection agent when you tell him your not paying your mortgage because when the LHC comes online it's going to suck the entire planet up anyway.
Thats something I would do as a prank call regardless! :laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: CanukGS500 on October 01, 2008, 11:14:46 AM
Quote from: bettingpython on October 01, 2008, 09:32:17 AM
Oh and do me a favor tape the phone call with your mortgage company's collection agent when you tell him your not paying your mortgage because when the LHC comes online it's going to suck the entire planet up anyway.
Thats something I would do as a prank call regardless! :laugh: :laugh:
Do that. Tape the call and then act it out with puppets on TV. That'd be sweet....
Damn, we're still here. I thought the world had already ended. :cheers:
the world i gone we are in a different universe completely like our last one...dummy
:flipoff: