last sunday I went for a ride up to the Crest. there were many bikers there seeing as how this was one of the few open canyons after the rains and one of the first clear days since the rains as well.

Quite a few 600rr's around. One guy had a 2 week old 600rr that was already crashed. he told me it happened that morning, "cold tires" or some such BS. At the far end I hooked up with that same group heading back...same guy crashed his rr again, hitting some gravel and lowsiding on the same side.

So I had to ask, "is this your first bike?"

He says, "No, I started on a gs500f. But I got bored with it after 3 months so I bought the rr".

I tell him he should go back to the gs500 and get more practice with throttle control-since thats what caused his first crash, not "cold tires". he said he might do that since he still had it.


So why dont people see the value in starting on a smaller machine? I mean, I didnt get to ride like this after only 2 years by starting on a smaller machine pablo's trackday video

grrr. Drives me insane. Girls dont seem to have an ego problem starting on a 250 or so. Why do guys? Rhetorical.

I agree. I had my 250 for 14 years, but I do admit that it wasn't my first. I would say my first purchase was based in ignorance. 250's are cool; 'specially the Ninja. If all I could afford was a brand new Ninja, I'd happily buy one. (I know I could buy something used, I'm just making a statement.) There was a girl I ended up following that was so smooth, I couldn't pass her. I was impressed!

Could'nt agree with you more pantablo.  I have dreamed and bought over 10 bikes in my head.  I am glad I have the will power to stick with the GS.  I am a married man with 2 beautiful girls (they help me keep things in perspective).  I will be approaching 2 years with the Gs  this August.  I currently have put about 8,000 mile on my GS and I am still reading, practicing, and constantly learning.  

For me it's aesthetics.  I like the newer body styles of bikes and larger rear tires.  It may sound shallow, but it is the truth.  For the type of riding I do, the 500 has plenty of power (mostly twisties and city driving).  

I may be getting a new bike at the end of this year ...... ?  I hope I will be ready.

Quote from: scratch
There was a girl I ended up following that was so smooth,  I was impressed!

Wowee Scratch ... does Mrs. Scratch know about this ...
Cool.
Srinath.

Oh...um...  It wasn't my fault, she had the right of way at the three-way stop. I tried to make a pass her...I mean, I tried to get past her. I was just observing that she was a real smooth rider. I was impressed not aroused! oh, bother...

Pablo, your trackday link is broke.

People always scoff and say "Haha man I bet you're ready for a bigger bike" or something like that, to which I reply "Not really." Not everyone, but about 25% of people.

They laugh, until I sweet past their R1 on the outside of a tight corner.

The people I ride with regularly have a lot of respect for the the GS and I because we eat them alive on the corners, even though we can't rip them in a straight out drag.

The ones that don't learn.

I wish I had the video we did one day of me making 8 foot diameter circles, scraping the center stand on my GS. Everyone is always amazed, even though I can only do about 6 before I get dizzy and have to stop.

i've managed to rack up 11k miles since last june. yeah, I'd like to get a bigger bike, but I can hold off a while longer. right now i've decided to try sprucing up the gs,  add just a little more power and stick another 10k or so on it.

I saw that story on socalsportbikes. I wish i could afford just one new bike and this kid has 2.  That and he had just passed the MSF course a couple weeks before he got the 600rr.
I was seriously thinking about picking one of those up as well but I thought back to the advice of improve the rider, not the ride.

Out riding PCH on Sunday my GS felt pretty loosey-goosey on that fast, sweeping curvy section before you get to Camarillo.  I couldn't help but think that a more solid and precise bike would be safer and inspire more confidence.    

I know, I've heard all the arguments - it's the rider, not the bike... but still!!  Between the spongey suspension and narrow tires, I have to say, the GS isn't living up to all the hype that I've been reading on the internet for the last few months.  It's great around town, but in the canyons it's like riding a donkey in the Kentucky Derby!  

Despite my gripes, I don't plan on getting the SV I want for a while yet.  So, don't worry!  :mrgreen:  I guess if I can learn to ride my donkey fast, I'll be even faster on a thoroughbred.

Yeager, you and I have similar experience.  The GS is a solid bike, but is not all that its hyped up to on this site.  Its a great beginner/commuter bike, but this "we destroy them in the corners" nonsense needs to stop.  

The GS does handle well in the corners, but to believe that a 380 pound, economy suspended bike has anything on a well-sprung modern 600 is an excercise in fooling yourself.  I am faster everywhere on my TL because I am more confident in its ability, particuluarly the brakes and suspension.  The GS sorely lacks in these areas.

Just because someone goes out and picks up a non-GS doesn't mean that they are going to spread themselves all over the landscape.  That guy with the ARGH-ARGH easily could have wadded the GS on a group ride.  Group rides are notorious for inadvertently pushing riders past their limits.  

The RR was not his undoing, it was his mentality.  He did not learn from the GS, and probably would have laid it down given time and circumstance.  I rode my GS for about 10,000 miles and am a better rider for it, but to assume that everyone needs a GS, or that the GS is the best beginner bike is short-sighted.

Aaron

Aaron, I'm sorry, but I've gotta disagree with you on this one.

I've ridden what used to be your bike...and yes, in the shape you had it, I would be much less confident in the corners on that than my own GS.  You had the thick Al fork brace on it, but very low oil in the forks, blown out fork seals, stock springs, stock rear shock, etc.  All of that, along with your Avon AV45/46 140/80 tire combo make for a very sketchy ride.  Maybe if you'd put some real tires on it, along with the standard suspension mods that almost everybody makes to their GS, you would have a different opinion.

Quote from: JohNLAPablo, your trackday link is broke.

alright, go here and click the "Pablo and I" video:
http://f1.pg.briefcase.yahoo.com/bc/mr.sparky@sbcglobal.net/lst?.dir=/videos&.view=l

or try this direct link to the video:
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/bc/4afe2da7_m418cc391/bc/videos/Pablo+and+I+10mb.wmv?BCV5BACBpXHXzvK2

you might have to cut and paste URL into browser.

Aaron, I get your point but I still think the GS is a far better first bike.

You can learn the basics of riding easier. And the soft suspension is fine for learning twisty riding. But you're right that once really pushed the bike gets all out of sorts. Even with the suspension upgrades I had done (progressives and a gsxr rear shock, good tires) I was riding beyond the bikes capabilities. I was immediately fast on the RR because of this.

On stock suspension (in good working order) the bike is okay to start taking twisties easily or moderately but it is a limiting factor. I think the gs still lives up to its first bike reputation. The pace those guys from the socalsportbikes ride I hooked up with was slow enough that a gs would not have had any issues. And I agree that he would have crashed his gs just the same. Unfortunately he had the F. Had he learned on a used naked gs the lesson he [hopefully] got wont cost him $1k to repair in bodywork.

I'm gonna agree with Pablo on this, because the rider has to learn a skill to compensate for a "poorly" suspended bike. A poorly suspended bike is going to expose any riding errors in input. You learn to be smooth on the front brake, so the front end doesn't dive so hard. You learn to get your braking done before the turn, so you don't have any upsetting chassis attitude adjustments mid corner. I'd rather learn confidence in my own skills, than in a bike. Ooh, there's a good signature tag line, "I'd rather have confidence in my own skills, than confidence in one single motorcycle". And because of that, then I can ride any motorcycle with confidence.

Oddly I am with Aplitz and Yeager sorta ...
OK at constant speed and raod comparisons ... aka The same curve at the same speed ... newer and better components make for afar better ride ... So your squirrely curve if you were clocking 60 on a GS and feeling like you're going to end up in the dirt, would have been a shade better on a bike with 1 notch better suspension and brakes ... Not to say you wont wad on that either ...
However The Modern day RR's are so far more powerful, and so track focussed in giving the rider the illusion of lack of speed ... they totally mislead you in finding the edge ... and hence you dont even know you are far over that edge ...
In anycase ... first learn the physics of motorcycling, then learn the limits ... and after that is when you are best suited for a step up ...
Cool.
Srinath.

as an interesting point of reference here's my experience with my upgraded gs and the rr:

On one stretch of angeles crest hwy (actually most of it) I could maintain a steady pace of 65mph with jaunts to 75 on the GS. That was the limit of what I was comfortable given what the bike was doing. This is with the gsxr rear shock and prog springs and good tires too. That same stretch on my RR sees speeds of 90mph with much more comfort and ease. The rr feels like it could be going much faster than that even.

On another "faster" section I could see 85mph on the gs through the sweeping turns and anything faster just felt like it was really too much for the bike. On the RR I go through the same section of road at about 110-125mph, again comfortably...uh, theoretically of course.

Wow, I'm surprised that a couple of you actually relate to what I'm saying.  I was prepared for a good spanking.

You're right about needing to learn the basic physics of riding, and then the limits of the bike one rides.  I'm a bit uneasy about learning the limits, becuase to really do that you need to go past the limits -which means CRASH.    Screw that  :mrgreen:

So far, I've enjoyed a life full of skateboarding, snowboarding, mountainbiking, and now motorbiking, without any broken bones or major mishaps.  I leave the squidliness and face-planting to my buddies.

I yearn for a better bike because its limits will be much higher, thus less chance to crash IMO.  The Suzuki SV650, or Yamaha YZF 600R (not the R6), are a couple of bikes that are built way more solid, but don't have a dangerous amount of power.

Again, I'm just whining, and will probably stick to the GS for about a year before moving up.

BTW, Pablo, that track day video was super freakin' cool.

Watched it twice.

thanks. Willow Springs Big track, its a fun [frikkin fast] track. i'm hoping to make it out there once a month march-december.