Cer... I've ridden a half dozen dif Harleys... a few sportsters (883's and a some 1200's)..a lowrider ...a fat boy... I'm down on Harley Attitudes and ridiculous prices.

Why are there lots of forumns for Jap bike problems...I dunno....more of those owners  can afford a bike...AND a Computer with internet access....Heheheheh Kidding..mostly...

I worked with a guy  a few years ago that had a Buell... I think I saw it once when it was actually out of the shop....Hee had it to work two days and bitched about it the rest (til he sold it).

Have I ridden a brand new one - nope I haven't  ,so I can't say how good they are or aren't. Point taken.

Have you actually ridden one ,Kzin? or are you "spouting" too?

Besides wasn't part of the Title of this message..."Convince me I don't."??

I can count on one hand the problems I've had with all 3 of my Personal bikes.... The Gs... well the rear fender was too long....the CBR f2 ...that just ran good and handled great what a pain in the ass ...And my ZX11...Well after 10 years the sidestand bolts have started to come loose...


You ride what you want. I'll ride what I want.

Ktrim, Good luck in whatever you buy.

 

 

Oh I understand ya Ed,... Just purging a little sarcasm..... heh....

Anyway.... It's all Good.

I didn't mean to cause arguments,   When it comes down to I enjoy anything with 2 wheels,  I have ridden damn near every kind of bike you can think of from an old school indian to a full race prepped gixer.  Ive been on all kinds of cruisers ( last being an 1100 virago owned and ridden by my 82 year old aunt but thats another story) , sport bikes,  dirt bikes (inculding a harley 2 stroke dirt bike).  several street and trail bikes,  some old school 1907's "sports bikes".  even a 4 cylinder 2 stroke honda street bike (fun and fast).  they are all fun and every one of them breaks down.   every bike/ vehicle made has its querks.  just like the gs carb problems--  eventually some one will figure out a fix for all of the buells querks.  The question is do I wait until they do?  or do I figure them out and post them for others to follow (i.e. this board)  do know,  I still have time to decide..

Yes I have ridden one, and came away impressed.

I was quite frankly expecting it to be a POS just as many of you seem to think, because everything I had seen or read seemed to point that way.  It was a VERY fun bike to ride.  I rode an XB12S.  Since then I've been doing a bit of research on the XB buells, and have found that they are actually very reliable.  There's only been one minor recall that I am aware of since they came out with the XB9R and that was with an early model.

Just last year when the 12s were introduced they switched to a different drive belt that extended belt life to 25K.

I am by no means preaching about how great they are.  In fact if my posts were more than just glanced over, I said they certainly aren't for everyone.  However, I think you need to at least catch a ride on a new model XB9 or 12 BEFORE you make up your mind that they suck.

If you go in expecting a racebike, you'll probably be dissapointed.  However if you take it for what it is, a fun backroad corner carver intended to provide power in such a way as to make riding the corners easy and fun, then you won't be let down.

FI, No Valve adjustments, No Coolant, No chain maintenance, great suspension right off the shelf, and some of the best brakes I've had the pleasure of sampling.

Ride one.  Then make up your mind.  Oh, and if you do, don't forget to short shift it and whack the throttle...Grins will follow shortly  

Here's a long-term evaluation of the Buell Cityx. http://www.motorbikestoday.com/reviews/Articles/buell_cityx_longterm.htm    

Love the Baby GS, Vietnam (can't believe I said that), and this forum.

C.......

Anything that Blade rides is okay with me.  

 

I have a 1999 Buell X1 Lightning and while I must admit that the Buell wasn't without its problems Buell did step up and fix a lot of the problems through its recall program.   It was like a beta Buell, you were involved in the development and testing of the bike. After all it was X1, as in eXperimental. I would also have to admit the bike never left me stranded out on the road.

I vaguely remember one of the motorcycle magazines saying this bike was made for the Patriotic Shade Tree Tinkerer.

I did quite a few mods to the bike to include a SuperTrapp exhaust system. SuperTrapp was then drawn into the development process. The first muffler design (which was probably a standard design for several other manufacturers) didn't survive the vibration. After contacting SuperTrapp they sent me a newly designed muffler. The new one was built like a tank! That was bolted up the newly designed Buell muffler bracket. The first design was wearing out the bushings. The amazing thing is the way the Sportster engine was mounted in the Buell frame, it isolates the vibration from rider. Harley just recently modified its own Sportster by rubber mounted the engine, Finally.

Another mod was to swap out the ECM (controller for the Fuel injection) because the stock settings were way too lean. I especially like the "For Race Use Only" stamp on the top.

Currently the bike resides in the back of my garage collecting dust. I very seldom ride it because I got too old for it. My body doesn't like the ergonomics of the bike. I went out and bought a big comfortable "dirt" bike for my street needs (a 2002 Suzuki VStrom).

I've been trying to sell the Buell for a while. Not a big market for them out there. The other thing that hurts me in the selling of the bike, I actually rode it! I have 16,000 miles on the bike and in the classified ads I'm going up against X1's that have less than 5000 miles on them. Sometimes a lot less.

Every once in awhile I'll take it for a ride and the bike still has "it". That intangible fun factor feeling usually expressed by a silly grin across your face. That torque sure is addictive.

[/img]

Quoteremember that your GS engine design is as old and outdated as the HD V-twin

speaking of outdated lets compare that.

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Bill Harley and Arthur Walter Davidson started making thier singles in like 1903. In 1909 Bill Harley made a project of the first 1000 CC 45 degree V-Twin that produced a modest 7hp. but Harley-Davidson didn't invent the V-twin !! When Bill Harley developed one, he just followed the tendency of the time.

The "F-head" engine is introduced in 1911. It will be the power workhorse until 1929, when the "Flathead" engine is introduced.

1914 saw the addition on the sidecar to the Harley-Davidson

1915 saw the emergence of the three-speed sliding-gear transmission.
In 1917, one-third of all Harley-Davidsons were sent overseas to the U.S. Military to fulfill their patriotic call and to aid in the war effort.

In 1918 Harley-Davidson was the biggest motorcycle factory in the world. They even survived the depression. The V-twin was Harley's specialty, so the company tried to defeat its only remaining rival ... Indian.
But these days were the thoughest, because the motorcycles got out of date and the prices of automobiles decreased (the T-Ford was born)

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lots more of this to read
Refrence page  http://www.powerpassion.nl/harley/story-engels.html

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Suzuki wasn't always the Motor Corporation. In 1909, Michio Suzuki founded the Suzuki Loom Company in the small seacoast village of Hamamatsu, Japan. Business boomed as Suzuki built weaving looms for Japan's giant silk industry. Suzuki's only desire was to build better, more user-friendly looms. For the first 30 years of the company's existence, its focus was on the development and production of these exceptionally complex machines.

Despite the success of his looms, Suzuki realized his company had to diversify and he began to look at other products. Based on consumer demand, he decided that building a small car would be the most practical new venture. The project began in 1937, and within two years Suzuki had completed several compact prototype cars. These first Suzuki motor vehicles were powered by a then-innovative, liquid-cooled, four-stroke, four-cylinder engine. It featured a cast aluminum crankcase and gearbox and generated 13 horsepower from a displacement of less than 800cc.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

reference page
http://www.koups.com/sales/suzuki/history/suzukihistory.htm


suzuki has built more engines far more inovated and advanced then harley. this is just going off the GSline from first GS model to latest GSxr outa the create this day.  is the GS500 dated? yes. but then this design while not as powerful as the HD seems to hold up better to the same abuse and Maintence scedule then the HD's that ive seen put through the same.


useing "Its just as outdated technology as HD" is untrue HD designs go back many many more years ENGINEERINGLY speeking then most the jap bikes. while i can live with it as a bike, i can Not live with the hype and cost from a bike boasting to be the end all Be all "if its not a harley its only second rate" bike.  ive found harley clones run better, longer and outlast alot of Production harley's  the clones are ones that have had alot more R&D to Improve a design but yet still hold themselves "INSIDE THE BOX"  now help me out, has there been a 4 valve head on harley's yet? The V rod doesnt count, if i understand it correctly some Porche/audi friends helped to design that engine and i wouldnt consider that harley


as to buel

the Buel is a harley engine on an updated frame design thats still based on what oversea's manufacturers have already done, this would include brakes, and suspension as well.


ive ridden a couple of HD's, 1 of 3 was very comfortable but damn vibration is just too damn much, 883 was a joke, and i couldnt tell you what the 3 was, i can tell you it merely resembled a bike but otherwise was garbage.  the one had alot of torque, but so do tractor.  

Compare it to a jap bike twin of about same size engine the jap bike is smoother and from what i have seen gives less issues. Harleys are another bike. they other then being around along time deserving nothing more then the name. but thats just my opinion

It's incredible that people can be so blindly prejudiced against the Harley Davidson brand that they consider a "technology" that requires partial disassembly of the engine for regualr service every 4,000 miles to be superior to one that completely eliminates that particular maintenance(valves).

 :dunno:  

In the first place, the old UL and WL machines are not the actual progenitors of the current crop of HD engines. For that you really need to go forward in time a little...1936 and the Knucklehead. That evolved into the Panhead in 1948 which then evolved into the Shovelhead in 1966. Then came the Evo motor of the eighties and now we are up to the TC88 of the current iteration of the original design. HD didn't need to design a whole lot of different engines because they found a design that works perfectly well for what it is suited and then some. It's like GM and the Small and Big -block chevys. They lasted as long as they have for one simple reason; workable simplicity. When I was an engineer in the auto industry I was told early on to make my designs as simple and robust as I could and to never ever try to re-invent the wheel; it's already been done. Same with HD; you can't build anything more simple or robust, all you can do is improve it with time. And that, my Blu friend, is what Mother HD has done. I love my little GS (but it will never compare to the lowest HD), China (Bruce Lee was the greatest), and this forum.

C....... (and why in hell would you need 4-valves on a Harley??)

ok, this could go long and hard tossing facts and slinging tech points and the works, point is, from what i and many others have seen, Harley has not kept up with the rest of the world in trying to make a better machine. where as many other bike manufaturing companies may still produce some old school designs, they did not stop growing and evolving.  

its a bike, ive not had greatest dealings with them, nor has many of the folks i know own them get to use them as pain free as most Non harley bike owners. it deserves the respect for being around aslong as it has. other then that it hasnt earned any more repsect from these mechanics's eyes and hands.  It certainly doesnt deserve the price tag its getting.

ive said my peace, im gonna bow out now.

http://www.goingfaster.com/angst/noharley2.html

Blu, I was waiting for your reply; and in the second place:

http://www.damnbikers.com/jokes/joke8.htm

Nuff said

Love the Baby, Siberia (home of the Chukchi and the great Siberian Husky), and this forum.

C........

Quote from: Blueknyt

Quoteremember that your GS engine design is as old and outdated as the HD V-twin

speaking of outdated lets compare that

Sorry to make you do all that research, but you're essentially comparing two pieces of outdated technology to each other. In 2005, it matters not who came with what engine in what year. Hey i love my twin, but saying it's better because it's newer is like saying a pentium 1 is better than a pentium 535 - one is twice as fast, but both have been rendered technologically obsolete.

closer to comparing a comadore Vic 20 with a 486 dx4 100. but asleast we dont  dont have to 'press play on tape to load program'


most of those were laughable in more ways then one, thanks needed that  

'Harley riders don't have to worry about their bikes being outdated by new technology.'

kinda like saying its perfect and cant or shouldnt be improved in any way.

I want to say again that the buells are beautiful bikes.  I seriously wish they just had a better reputation for quality control.  Seems like you can get a good one and be completely trouble free or get a bad one that has parts missing or parts that vibrate off.
This is a thread from another forum where a few people who have owned more than one buell give their opinions. http://www.bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=118420

I really want them to be great bikes, but they still seem to be in the development stages- they have to fix some design flaw with each new model.  I really hope that in ten years they are still around and that all the kinks are worked out.
Unfortunately, it looks like they won't be around long.  They already discontinued the tube framed ones- also gorgeous bikes.  Now, it seems like every other dealer that used to carry buells no longer carries them.  Literally- There used to be 6 buell dealers in the bay area and now there's only 3, and I worry about those.
Now, I hope HD doesn't ever change their design.  If they did, they wouldn't be HD.  Indian motorcycles closed up shop and somebody should continue to make reliable vintage motorcycles.  I think they are at the top of their game in that area because they have had 20+ years of fixing all of the design flaws since their low point in the 80's when HD earned its reputation for making unreliable bikes at the same time as abandoning their vintage styling to some extent (trying to compete with the honda goldwing, a tourer).
HD needs to stick to this vintage thing if it wants to survive- americans couldn't compete with the low prices of the honda cruisers and that would be painfully obvious if HD started copying them instead of vice-versa.
Lets face it, there is a market for vintage and vintage copy bikes.  Buying a new HD gives the status of having a vintage bike while having the reliability of a new one.  They aren't selling performance, they aren't selling modernity, they are selling attitude and status.  The honda shadow can only sell attitude, because it lacks true vintage roots.   Lets face it, if you want comfort, performance, efficiency, and modern styling there are bikes out there called "sport tourers" and touring motorcycles that are better in every way.  However, if you want show people that you are rough, tough, and a lover of fine classic styling then you get a cruiser.
I don't buy into that styling myself, even though I look good in a leather vest, but I do understand why others do.  The bikes look good and you can't help but give a second look.  The riders often wear little protection, often wearing unapproved eggshell caps with a spike on top, a t-shirt, and jeans- but that's all part of the attitude that says they are tough as nails and are living free as hell.  I think the whole thing is stupid- but I've never been one to pay much for status nor sacrifice efficiency or safety for style.
When I get a motorcycle it will have to be reliable, modern, efficient, performance, and I will have brightly colored leathers and a full face helmet.
But it would be cool to have a harley to putt from bar to bar in, just to show off.

Good link...Only two reviews had anything to do with current model XB's though.  One was a shining review.  The other wanted more power and better mirrors.  No big complaints.