I'm sorry about the long post, but this is something that has "bad idea" written all over it and I want to be sure that people are aware of what our government is attempting to do. You can call me paranoid, but If you have the time, please read this and at least think about it.

Soon, the Senate will be voting on legislation to create a National ID card system which would replace the State Drivers' Licence system currently used. While this legislation looks like a good idea from the outside, there are parts of this that shouldn't be passed. Under the authority of the Department of Homeland Security, RFID chips could put onto these ID cards, effectively making them a wirelessly accessible container for your permanent address, social security number, drivers licence number, picture and any other information that the Department of Homeland Security sees fit to include on these cards. Your personal information could be stolen from your wallet as you stand in line at the grocery store or as you walk along a street. There are also parts of this bill that are not related to ID cards such as granting the Secretary of Homeland Security the ability to circumvent any laws he sees fit when it involves the borders of the USA.

To make matters worse, the bill's authors have attached this legislation to a bill that would authorize funding for US troops in Iraq and aid to tsunami victims in Asia. This bill has already passed the House, and will be voted on tomorrow in the Senate. Please contact your senators and tell them if you are against this bill.

The UnRealID.com site offers you an opportunity to send your senators a fax through their website.

Alternately, you can look up the phone numbers of your senators here and call their office.

The text of the bill has been posted here.

For more information, these are excerpts from a news.com article:

What does that mean for me?
Starting three years from now, if you live or work in the United States, you'll need a federally approved ID card to travel on an airplane, open a bank account, collect Social Security payments, or take advantage of nearly any government service. Practically speaking, your driver's license likely will have to be reissued to meet federal standards.

The Real ID Act hands the Department of Homeland Security the power to set these standards and determine whether state drivers' licenses and other ID cards pass muster. Only ID cards approved by Homeland Security can be accepted "for any official purpose" by the feds.

What's going to be stored on this ID card?
At a minimum: name, birth date, sex, ID number, a digital photograph, address, and a "common machine-readable technology" that Homeland  Security will decide on. The card must also sport "physical security features designed to prevent tampering, counterfeiting, or duplication of the document for fraudulent purposes."

Homeland Security is permitted to add additional requirements--such as a fingerprint or retinal scan--on top of those. We won't know for a while what these additional requirements will be.

Why did these ID requirements get attached to an "emergency" military spending bill?
Because it's difficult for politicians to vote against money that will go to the troops in Iraq and tsunami relief. The funds cover ammunition, weapons, tracked combat vehicles, aircraft, troop housing, death benefits, and so on.

The House already approved a standalone version of the Real ID. Act in February, but by a relatively close margin of 261-161 . It was expected to run into some trouble in the Senate. Now that it's part of an Iraq spending bill, senators won't want to vote against it.

"Supporters claim it is not a national ID because it is voluntary," Rep. Ron Paul of Texas, one of the eight Republicans to object to the measure, said during the floor debate this week. "However, any state that opts out will automatically make nonpersons out of its citizens. They will not be able to fly or to take a train." Paul warned that the legislation, called the Real ID Act, gives unfettered authority to the Department of Homeland Security to design state ID cards and driver's licenses. Among the possibilities: biometric information such as retinal scans, fingerprints, DNA data and RFID tracking technology.

ok, so how hard is it to get a canadian drivers licence again?  what about mexico? do they even have a licencing program?

Hmmm, let me think, didn't we have some of these discussions about this a while back? When was it? Oh, yeh, about the time we were getting ready to elect our Dicata...er, President. Well, what can you say. People in this country have gotten to the point that until something directly affects THEM in a bad way they don't give a rat's a** about it. Love the Baby G, Brazil (Sugar Loaf is breathtaking), and this forum.

C........

They should only have these rediculous ID's in Red States.  

Note to self: move to Blue State.

like davipu kinda said, get an international licence and romp around with that. keep the "realID" buried in a box in the  back yard. Who needs commercial flying, we will be able to teleport 3 years from now to near planets anyway and they will probably have a main road connecting all the continents too. Another reason to add more miles on the GS.  

and here i thought the republicans liked small government...

next thing you know, you will have to notify and get permission from the government to move.

in soviet america, the government owns you

Quote from: crashand here i thought the republicans liked small government...

The original 'states rights' platforms of the old GOP are ancient history.... as long as they control the federal government, they will be decidedly UN-states rights  

I guess I will be making an aluminium wallet to match my foil hat.

If you haven't read it before, Orwell's 1984 will be a bit a startling for you but help you see things in a different light.

If you have never read about the "Business Plot" of the 1930's you might want to check that out too.

Remember, polarized sunglasses prevent unauthorized retinal scans

Quote from: callmelennyI guess I will be making an aluminium wallet to match my foil hat.

If you haven't read it before, Orwell's 1984 will be a bit a startling for you but help you see things in a different light.

If you have never read about the "Business Plot" of the 1930's you might want to check that out too.

Remember, polarized sunglasses prevent unauthorized retinal scans

:lol:  :lol:

TOO LATE! TOO LATE!
RFID's are a fact of life. You guys want cheap Sh*t from walmart? There's sh*tloads of RFID's in their product packaging. And not just there either. EZPASS, your card reader at work, your school ID.... It's easy enough to steal your identity now, don't worry about another card. Put mine in my temple. Just let me see the aliens and floating cities.

Ok, come on you guys from the right, jump in and start explaining why this is such a needed thing and how it is harmless to the society in general. Rationalize how this is going to prevent the attacks to our society by the bad guys. Love the little White Owl, Canada (how much autonomy is there?), and this forum.

C........

There have been people in CA in the last couple of years that want to give drivers license to illegal immigrants. To get them they need to show ID that is really easy to forge. So if this ever happens, I imagine that my CA DL will be worthless for getting on planes. But I don't want to have to carry another ID around.

so because you can run jump or swim you can get a CA drivers licence?

(just to stir the pot)

Ed_in_AZ?  Where are you???

* sound of soap box being dragged across the sand*

Quote from: That guylike davipu kinda said, get an international licence and romp around with that. keep the "realID" buried in a box in the  back yard. Who needs commercial flying, we will be able to teleport 3 years from now to near planets anyway and they will probably have a main road connecting all the continents too. Another reason to add more miles on the GS.  

. there is an "international drivers license", but if you read closely, it does not take the place of the state issued one.
Click here. ive no issues with that possible thing happening,  1 cause ive nothing to hide,
and 2. if someone managed to get your state id, odds are they would probably have in their possession you wallet which if it does not have your ss card, will have something with your ss number on it. plus with medical data on it, it would be less of a hassle to treat you should you be on a road trip somewhere, and end-up ill, injured, or unconscious in a hospital, they can pull up your med records. and properly treat you. just my opinion btw  :dunno:

It doesn't have crap to do with whether or not you or me or anyone else has anything to hide. It just means I have more paper that I have to keep track of, more shaZam! the state has to keep track of, more money that has to be spent to ensure that everything is done by the book, just more hassle for everybody involved. You, me, and all the citizens of this country own it...not the federal government, not congress, not the senate and certainly not GWB. This is one more thing that WILL cause problems for a certain percentage of people in the future. Your just another one who doesn't care what happens in this country as long as it doesn't cause YOU personally a problem. So sad that we have degenerated into this mind-set. Love the bike and the forum.

C........

The security argument is that a new ID will be more difficult to get , so it can't be as easily used by "evil doers". Law enforcement will theoretically have access to the centralized database of all the state ID's . So if I get pulled for speeding in Texas they will know I got in trouble in Floida for screwing with TSA employees and treat me appropriately.

This idea is supported by many citizens, especially those that incorrectly believe that the 9/11 hijackers had fake or fradulently obtained driver licenses.

Perhaps the most controversial component of the bill is that the cards share some common machine readable format. Almost all states already have this in the form of magnetic stripes or bar codes. Some sponsors of the bill originally wanted RFID's in the cards so that they could be read remotely but that may not survive the final deliberations.

The other problem of course is that it is an unfunded mandate that places the costs of a federal policy on the states. If the bill passes it may be challenged by some states on this ground.

Of course we already have a federal document that meets all these requirements, it is called a passport. The gov't could require everyone to have one and carry it on their person just like in Soviet Russia.

Like most legislation in the last several years, this one is driven by behind the scenes corporate interests and the whores (Rep. and Dem.) that work for them. Database companies like Oracle have been slobbering over the possible contracts for such a large operation. The corps that would make all the new card readers and printers are also pushing this.

This will almost certainly pass in one form or another and cost the taxpayers oodles of dollars. Companies will get even richer and I predict it will be as effective as the billions we spent on airport security since 9-11, not at all.

My comments reflect my lunatic ravings and are not meant to represent the GSTwin community.

Quote from: cernunosIt doesn't have crap to do with whether or not you or me or anyone else has anything to hide. It just means I have more paper that I have to keep track of, more shaZam! the state has to keep track of, more money that has to be spent to ensure that everything is done by the book, just more hassle for everybody involved. You, me, and all the citizens of this country own it...not the federal government, not congress, not the senate and certainly not GWB. This is one more thing that WILL cause problems for a certain percentage of people in the future. Your just another one who doesn't care what happens in this country as long as it doesn't cause YOU personally a problem. So sad that we have degenerated into this mind-set. Love the bike and the forum.

C........

. dammit c wtf, where did i say that i dont care :x speak for yourself  :x , i rather have something like this cause the benefits would outweigh the probs, you kinda took it out of context :dunno:

I just do not trust our government anymore...in fact, not in a long time. There are too many things happening in a short period of time since the 911 deal that make me step back and think; why is this really needed, how is that going to help our nation, what is it that has all of a sudden happened that I or you or anyone else must give up this small thing and then that small thing and on and on until the next thing I know I feel like a dog in a cage or, in the worst case, like a Jew during Nazi Germany? I am troubled; am I paranoid? I love the little bike, North America (Canada included), and this forum.

C.......

heres my opinion on this matter take it as you will. i believe 9/11 happened because we were too lenient as it was our security was lax, nowadays in the airport it seems like youve got to go thru a metal detector to go take a s@!t. but i digress, i am willing to give up maybe a thing or two to get what i perceive as security. im more for it for the medical records aspect of it. sure some may say, okay you're willing to give up this, but when they come and get this , that, and the other then what?,. i dont see it going that far. i seriously doubt well end up in the "soviet states of america" just my opinion tho