kinda a long story but the main problem i am having is at the bottom

well the story goes as follows, i was having problems with my bike and i figured out that the carbs were acting up so Srinath was gracious enough to work on them for me. had a bunch of problems that were fixed and then the carbs were sent back to me. got the carbs back today and the same problem that i was having before they were worked on is still happening, so now i am fed up with the recent string of problem this bike is giving me. i bought the car about a year ago and it rode perfectly up untill about may of this year when i tried to do a summer maintenence. i replaced the tires, chain, sprockets, brake pads, and front brake rotor. after all of that was done (which took about a month and a half to get all together) i was finally able to ride the bike. within the first 15 miles i came to a stop sign and the bike stalled and wouldn't fire, it would turn over but would not start, and i look under the bike and see that there is gas dripping out of the left carb bowl (the float stuck i supose) and since i dont know much about bikes i just put it in my friends truck and took it home. tried to work on it and couldn't get the bike to run at all so i found this forum and had Srinath help me out by looking at the carbs and fixing them.

So here's the problem i now have: got the carbs back on the bike and start it, i get the bike started and it runs and i let it run for a couple minutes then try to ride it, the bike will feel like its missing a cylinder or something up untill about 5k rpms then it will kinda clear out and run just fine. i ride it up and down my street (about 2/10 of a mile) and the bike just stalls and has trouble starting again and if i can get it started again it wants to die on me. are there any other things that can be causing this problem besides the carbs? the bike has been down for about 4 months now (summer months mind you  :x ) and now i am furious that i still can't ride my bike. if anyone has heard of this or a way to fix it please help. thanks in advance and please please help me get my bike back on the road.

replace your plugs $1.49 at autozone

I was just going to suggest the plugs when I saw Ktrims post. Give it a shot at least.

yes, i replaced the plugs when it started having problems.  I also forgot to mention that i replaced my air filter with a foam filter, right after i put that in is when it started acting up.

Did you replace your plugs with the same it had, or hotter? My bike ran like caca with hotter plugs.  :dunno:

pandy

Lemme think this over ... but answer my PM, will help point me better ...
You have any hoses un connected in your air box, drain or top one is ripped/missing ?? How does sock over air filter do ... and how does no air filter do ??/
Cool.
Srinath.

i'm gonna change the plugs again tomorow and when i get off of work today i am going to try some of the tricks with the air filter and check all of my hoses and such. not quite sure what you mean by a hotter plug though, i will admit that i am quite the noob when it comes to bikes but i am learning quickly thanks to you guys. any suggestions on what kind of plugs i can get to try some different hotness's, maybe different plugs could do the trick, i might as well get a few different types and see what may work the best. thanks again for all your help, maybe i can get this thing running by next summer , if i'm lucky

First of all, do NOT change the heat range of the plugs! I DOUBT that is going to do anything except make matters WORSE!

Please answer a few questions:

1.  Did you rejet the carbs when you changed to the foam air filter?

2.  Have you tried starting the bike with the choke on full?

3.  Try to start the bike, then pull one plug. Is it wet with gas? Is it dry? Is it carbon-fouled? Tell us EXACTLY what it looks like; be specific.

4.  Now pull the OTHER plug, and compare it to the first one. DO they look similar (wet / dry / carbon-fouled)? If not, what is the difference?

Do NOT let your impatience lead you down the wrong path; you're being bombarded with suggestions from well-intentioned people, and you're reading advice from people who had similar symptoms that turned out to be unrelated to your problem.

When a motorcycle won't start, check the battery first; does the horn work? If so, you have SOME electrical power, though you'll still have to do some spark-chasing to be sure it is going all the way to the plugs, but THAT comes much later. It's better (and cheaper) to do the EASY things FIRST.

OK, if you have a charged battery, the next things to consider are gas and air. So, do you have gas? Is it flowing all the way to the carbs? How do you know? What did you do to PROVE you have gas to the carbs?

OK, if you have a good battery and gas, do you have AIR? By that, I mean, do you have ENOUGH air to the engine / carbs? Do you have TOO MUCH air? The condition of the plugs will help you determine the answer to that...

Post your answers, and tell us anything else relevant you can think of. Good luck; I'll check back as often as I can for your reply.

wow, looks like i have a lot of work to do, thank you for all your sugestions and trouble shooting tips, i will definetly get back with results and i am sure to learn from this one.

Quote from: my00forestwow, looks like i have a lot of work to do, thank you for all your sugestions and trouble shooting tips, i will definetly get back with results and i am sure to learn from this one.

Now THAT is the RIGHT attitude! I'll watch for your answers to my questions (HINT), and do my best to help you get this figured out...

Good luck; take your time doing this, pay attention to what you see and hear, make good notes so you can tell us what happens as you follow those steps, BE PATIENT, and odds are good that we'll get this nailed down pretty quickly.

Quote from: Hugh JardonFirst of all, do NOT change the heat range of the plugs! I DOUBT that is going to do anything except make matters WORSE!

Please answer a few questions:

1.  Did you rejet the carbs when you changed to the foam air filter?

2.  Have you tried starting the bike with the choke on full?

3.  Try to start the bike, then pull one plug. Is it wet with gas? Is it dry? Is it carbon-fouled? Tell us EXACTLY what it looks like; be specific.

4.  Now pull the OTHER plug, and compare it to the first one. DO they look similar (wet / dry / carbon-fouled)? If not, what is the difference?

Do NOT let your impatience lead you down the wrong path; you're being bombarded with suggestions from well-intentioned people, and you're reading advice from people who had similar symptoms that turned out to be unrelated to your problem.

When a motorcycle won't start, check the battery first; does the horn work? If so, you have SOME electrical power, though you'll still have to do some spark-chasing to be sure it is going all the way to the plugs, but THAT comes much later. It's better (and cheaper) to do the EASY things FIRST.

OK, if you have a charged battery, the next things to consider are gas and air. So, do you have gas? Is it flowing all the way to the carbs? How do you know? What did you do to PROVE you have gas to the carbs?

OK, if you have a good battery and gas, do you have AIR? By that, I mean, do you have ENOUGH air to the engine / carbs? Do you have TOO MUCH air? The condition of the plugs will help you determine the answer to that...

Post your answers, and tell us anything else relevant you can think of. Good luck; I'll check back as often as I can for your reply.

OK well I sorta need to point out couple things at this point ... His carbs were re jetted - by me ... Now the heat range change - I also came up with that idea. There have been a rash of plugs (NGK's mainly) that seem to work just fine when the bike is lean (read hot) and when you jet it out of its leanness it craps out ... His bike however has had the same problems from well before the rejet ... Hotter plugs will not hurt, neither will champions in the same heat range as stock NGK's ... I am just saying to stay away from the stock NGK ... I have sent out bikes that ran perfectly with champions and 2 weeks later they are running like sheite with new NGK's in it (ask drifter8844 and ginovega about these) ... My virago also ran like a charm with Champions ... till I broke it one day, and the NGK's I put in were sheite ... then I hunted and found autolites whihc were not only bad, their threads were black and impossible to read. Then I found 1 step hotter NGK's and no problem since ... till that starter sticking incident ... I think NGK is a great plug, just that of late they seem to be getting a shade colder, and that's just enough to kill the bike at times.
The rest of your list seems sound and logical, I also advised him to do valves first ... so lets see ...
Cool.
Srinath.

Hi, srinath...

Yeah, I've seen your advice about Champions, and I agree completely. I just don't want to see him make ninety-three changes all at once, and then not have any idea about what helped and what didn't. I've used just about every brand of plug sold in the US in the last thirty years, and NGK has always been at the top of my list, except for the recent problems. FWIW, I've also had good luck with ND (NipponDenso) plugs, but Autolites :x ...

We need to take this by the numbers, so hopefully, he'll let us know what the plugs indicate, and we can try to guide him from there. Until we nail down the basics (spark, fuel, air), there is no sense in trying to rush this to a solution. If the plugs indicate a lean condition, he'll have to check intake boots etc. If they indicate no fuel, he'll have to t'shoot the carb / fuel circuit, and so on...

You know how it is; every day, someone on this forum tells someone else to rebuild the carbs, degree the cams, balance/true/shotpeen/magnaflux/weld the crank, mill the head, adjust the headlight, fenderectomy, remove the counterbalancer, reflectorectomy, install the counterbalancer, polish the rims, install some LED taillights and some pimpin' PURPLE NEONS (Hi Pandy!), decarbonize the pistons, rotate the tires, mow the lawn, polish the license plate, and balance the checkbook, and if THAT doesn't solve the problem, part it out and buy a new one. Oh, and dibs on the gauges and clusters...

Well-intentioned advice (maybe), but worthless nonetheless. It's like telling a ballplayer to hit a homerun every time at bat, and he won't strike out any more... Nowadays, people are told that they're entitled to their opinions; we'd all be a lot better off if they were ALSO told that they're entitled to keep their opinions to themselves.

Yes, that applies to me as well, but I don't bombard people with advice to bulk up my post count; I try to write detailed, informative instructions so they have something to work with, rather than have to ask nineteen extra questions to find out which metric hammer I recommend buying. I've lurked here for more than FOUR YEARS, always resisting the urge to give advice, because I've wasted far too much time posting computer repair advice in other forums; it isn't bad enough that I fix the damn things all day, I also have to punish myself at NIGHT too, over the 'net, for free...

Anyway, I'm tired of dealing with fourteen year-old pornhounds, so a few days ago, I decided to start posting here, where I'm in the company of pornhounds like davipu, pandy, and 97gs500e (the notorious racist); at least they're all old enough to have a motorcycle license, though I think 97gs500e is actually still using a learner's permit, and riding a Big Wheel... We all know you can't say enough good things about those ignorant Mid-West redneck jerky-boy peckerheads; actually, I can't say ANYTHING good about them, so I won't. 97gs500e doesn't realize it, but I have family in Lenexa, and friends in Overland Park, Olathe, Lenexa, Ft. Scott, Hays, Kanorado, Speed, Stockton, Iola (stop in and say hi to the folks at Packy the Shipper's for me!), Pittsburg, KCMO,  Raytown (MO), and Excelsior Springs (MO). Several of them have been to the Applebee's where he works, and they tell me he is just as much of an immature dipshit in person as he seems to be online, which is quite an accomplishment, for him, anyway...

Well, here's hoping my00forest reports back with some informative details, so we can get him back on the road BEFORE next summer; see you in the forums.

Save humanity; :guns: a racist!

Quote from: Hugh JardonFirst of all, do NOT change the heat range of the plugs! I DOUBT that is going to do anything except make matters WORSE!

Please answer a few questions:

1.  Did you rejet the carbs when you changed to the foam air filter?

2.  Have you tried starting the bike with the choke on full?

3.  Try to start the bike, then pull one plug. Is it wet with gas? Is it dry? Is it carbon-fouled? Tell us EXACTLY what it looks like; be specific.

4.  Now pull the OTHER plug, and compare it to the first one. DO they look similar (wet / dry / carbon-fouled)? If not, what is the difference?

well i have somewhat of an answer to number one, when i changed the filter in i put on the filter oil and i think i may have put it on a little too much, so the first thing that i did was take paper towels to that and try to get some of the oil out and spread it around better so now the filter is properly oiled, while the filter was out of the bike i tried to start the bike and the same problem was happening(can't get the bike to idle on its own and when i try to ride it and give it throttle it just dies immediatley and gets bogged down) checked the compression with the plugs out and finger over the hole(clymer told me to) and compression seemed good on both cylinders, and i did try to start the bike on full choke and it does not seem to help any more than with out
ok now for what the plugs looked like after i had the bike running for about 5 min with some help . the one plug that i pulled out (came from the right side as i'm sitting on the bike) (i'm going to descibe it to you the way that my dad did to me, he grew up on dirtbikes and such so knows a little about plugs and engines) he said that the electrode is surrounded by porcelin(sp?) and on the first plug this part was black along with the rest of the plug top. the second plug that i pulled was a little cleaner and the porcelin part was white around the top (my dad said it was good) so he cleaned off the first plug a little and we tried them in the bike. the bike did start (now when i start it it has to be on prime and when it gets running i switch it back to on) and it still wouldn't idle on its own but was running. after it idled for a few mins i tried to ride it and as soon as i gave it gas it would bog down and almost die untill i let off the throttle (the choke was off btw) and then we stopped for the night.
so in the morning i am planning on getting new plugs and checking the valves as prescribed by Srinath. i hope i didn't forget anything except that i do have champion plugs in there now. if i think of anything else i will post it, and thank you for even reading this and taking your time to help me out. i am incredibly appreciative and as mentioned in another post i might look into the beerpal to repay you guys oh wait i'm only 20 :dunno: maybe next year. anyway thanks again, shane

OK you do need to look at your valves ... But ...
OK left is choclate or so colored, and right is black ...
You may have a pin hole in the vacuum line ... letting in enough air to make the left run right and right is rich and fouling ... Now that ON when you get it running ... OK why dont you try it in prime ... when the bike is running prime is fine ... How much fuel in the tank Maybe low ... You think.
Cool.
Srinath.

well i guess my plan of attack for tomorrow is to..
fill gas tank
try to run in prime
get new plugs
check valves

any thing else to add to the list, i'm trying to go down through things easy to hard so lets see what happens and will get back to you guys tomorrow sometime, thanks again, shane

Get champion 809 plugs. Also the valves being tight will get fine once it gets hos and yea high revs will be fine, but you will not have a black or even a choclate colored plug .... they'd be white ... once it gets hot it will run like a bear ... My $$$ is on vacuum leak in the vacuum line ... if it gets a bit better in prime ... then bingo ... How about you cap off the vacuum fitting on the left carb and run it in prime ... if that gets the left plug looking like the right, and if it runs better ... bingo ... vacuum leak ...
Cool.
Srinath.

Not that this will actually help, but a few suggestions anyway...

Look for problems that are causing air leaks, especially to the carbs. Check to be sure that your air filter is properly installed, and that there are no air leaks around the intake boots, which are the tubes connecting the carbs to the cylinder head. You can spray starting fluid around them as you try to start the bike. If it starts, that means you've just found your air leak.

Which brand of air filter did you install? I can see a few problems with using an aftermarket air filter; some NEED to be sealed into the airbox with heavy grease (axle grease should work). Without the axle grease to provide an air-tight seal of the filter to the airbox, you'll have a lean condition and problems both starting and running the engine. Also, you usually have to rejet your carbs when you install the aftermarket air filters; I get the feeling that your carbs have not been rejetted to match the new air filter, and that will also cause a lean condition, and problems of this type.

Can you reinstall the OLD (original) air filter, and check to see if the engine will start? The original filter might be restrictive enough to make the engine run, and that will prove that your carbs are jetted too lean to work with the new air filter.

If you CAN'T reinstall the OLD air filter, and you're convinced that the intake boots are NOT leaking, spray starting fluid into the new air filter as you crank the engine, and see if the engine runs. If it does, that will also help to prove that your carb jetting is too lean for the new air filter.

What is bothering me so much is that you've told us that these problems began RIGHT AFTER you installed the new air filter, so I have to suspect that it is at least CONTRIBUTING to this problem in some way. Whether it is because the installation of the new air filter itself was incorrect, or because an air leak has developed between the airbox and the cylinder head, or for some other reason that hasn't registered yet, I have to believe that the new air filter is involved somehow.

My (our) hands are tied until you answer these questions; be sure to tell us about the new air filter (brand, model, etc.), and to check CAREFULLY and THOROUGHLY for the types of air leaks I've described, and report back when you can.

Good luck; I'll try to watch for your reply.

http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/partslist.aspx?Bike=3312&Style=7336
this is the filter that i have in my bike now. should i bother getting one that is the real stock filter from bikebandit?
thanks, shane
oh and if you look at the picture my filter is the one all the way to the right(the black foam one)

Quote from: my00foresthttp://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/partslist.aspx?Bike=3312&Style=7336
this is the filter that i have in my bike now. should i bother getting one that is the real stock filter from bikebandit?
thanks, shane
oh and if you look at the picture my filter is the one all the way to the right(the black foam one)

Well, Shane, my question is, did you install the Uni-Filter CORRECTLY? Even though you supposedly DON'T need to re-jet (according to the webpage), you are trying to use this Uni-Filter in a motorcycle that is NOTORIOUS for poor stock jetting, and a high-flow air filter (like this one) will only make that problem even WORSE.

That is why I asked if you could re-install the stock filter; if you don't have one, we'll just have to try something else, but using the stock filter will at least let you know whether or not the bike will run, and then you'll know for sure that you'll need to rejet for the Uni-Filter.

I LIKE Uni-Filters; I've used them for a long time now (along with K&N and Dynojet), and I consider them to be as good as any filter on the market, at least for the motorcycles I've installed them on. That being said, I ALWAYS rejet (if the jetting is wrong), as soon as I get the motorcycle home. If I decide to change from one type of filter to another, I rejet again, to match the flow characteristics of the new filter.

Try to start the motorcycle with the choke ON halfway, and then again, with the choke ON all the way; does it start when you use the choke ON halfway? What about when you use the choke ON all the way?

Doing that will tell you if the jetting is a problem; if using the choke IMPROVES things, it is proof that the jetting is too LEAN. That means that you'll HAVE to either switch back to a more restrictive filter (like the stock filter; though you STILL might have to rejet), or rejet now, to match the Uni-Filter.

If the bike won't start even with the choke ON (BTW, does your choke actually WORK?), let us know, and we'll decide what to do next.

Good luck; keep us posted.

ok, well this morning i got up and went to the parts store and picked up new plugs (champion 809), starter fluid, and gas. when i got home i gapped the plugs to about .76mm and filled the gas tank. and i decided to try to put a clean rag into the air filter and started the bike. now the bike runs and there is no dead spot in the rpm range,  yea , but now there is an eratic idle. i will get the bike to idle with the idle screw and the bike will idle at about 1500 rpm for 30-45 sec then shoot up to about 3000 or more rpms then drop after about 10 sec or so. i think i've pinpointed my one problem and now it looks like i have a bit of a diferent one. my choke does work and i get to about 5 or 6k rpms with the choke on full when the bike is at normal idle. i think my next step is to check the valves. hope you guys are ready for this new problem cause i'm getting kind of weiry of problems . thanks again, shane
oh and when i finally had the bike kind of running i did get a chance to ride and went about half a mile when the bike died going up a hill and stopped on a flat part thankfully and thanks to my dead battery could not start again, so i started to push. i luckily had one last downhill before the longer uphill to my house so i decided to try to bumpstart it and boom it started and i was able to ride home(still no dead spot in the rpm range ) so at least i was able to ride the bike about 3/4 of a mile and got some exercise on the way  :lol: