OK so who is to blame for the collapse of society following Katrina ...
I heard that city of NO had over 1000 which could have been dep;oyed to cart off people the day before the hurricane, leaving just the hold out's. There by averting the superdome catastrophe ... instead the busses stood in the yard and got flooded and washed out. I dont have any real opinions here, just what I heard. The Mayor/Governor was too cheap to have state funded transpoin the mandatory evacuation ... or truly complacent ... Again just what I heard.
Cool.
Srinath.

they did use city busses.  from what i've heard those busses were carrying only about half capacity on their last trips.  indicating that they didn't use more busses or run more trips because they couldn't find enough people to pick up.

which sounds to me like they really screwed up the task of rounding up the people.

i understand that in Florida they had a list prepared of the elderly and infirm that they could use to figure out who needed help.

there are so many stories and so much spinning coming out right now that it's really difficult to figure out what really went wrong.

i'm hoping that a comprehensive bi-partisan congressional investigation can tell us what really happened.

W.

He accepted responsiblity today.

"And to the extent that the federal government didn't fully do its job right, I take responsibility. I want to know what went right and what went wrong,''

--President George W. Bush


i have to say i respect him for making that statement.

now, hopefully there'll be some meaningful follow through on this.  hopefully the administration and congress will work together to do what's necessary to fix the system.  and hopefully they won't give into special interests along the way.

I don't understand why we are asking these kinds of questions.  No one expected what happened to happen.  Folks went to the superdome to ride out the hurricane, the hurricane wasn't all that bad but when it forced lake Ponch into the city it became a huge problem.  They didn't have supplies to last for a week when they were planning to ride out the storm for a day...  It became a dire situation.  Sometimes the worse case happens.  I think positive things will come of this.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all about helping those who are faced with this kinda trauma.  
However, a friend of mine just returned last week from volunteering down in New Orleans.  He left KC with good intentions and a positive attitude that he was going to help people down there.  He came back dissapointed and frustrated.
He said the majority still in the city were totally capable of helping themselves, but would rather sit around and smoke crack.  no kidding.

whats the deal with that?

"Cocaine is a powerful drug." ~ Rick James

Quote from: Jake DW.

He accepted responsiblity today.

Hell no - he did it only to thwart any attempts to make that FEMA situation any worse, and have it negatively impact the Roberts confirmation. he also is not eligible for re-election and hence doesn't want it to drown the rest of the repubuickan party ... Its like Me and me alone acting wihtout the knowledge of anyone else put this nincompoop friend of mine in charge of FEMA and then arranged for katrina to come over and destroy NO, while the whole repubuickan party is behind Roberts and please vote for Cheney in 2008. Thank you.
Yea right ...
Cool.
Srinath.

i'm hoping that a comprehensive bi-partisan congressional investigation can tell us what really happened.[/quote]

now that's satire!

i did say hoping, not expecting.

We all remember the comprehensive bi-partisan congressional investigation into 9/11 right?

If anyone is up to speed on their geology/meteorology they would've known, that "if" a Cat. 5 hurricane, like Katrina, hit NO that the whole city would be under water for ages.  NO is below sea-level, meaning water doesn't leave the city.  They have to pump out the water after heavy rains.  Another thing is that this hurricane was something like a 1000 (or 10000) year storm, which means statistically a storm like Katrina will hit that region of the coast once ever 1000 (or 10000) years.  This is a rare thing, but any half educated person in the NO area should've known that WHEN a big storm hit the city would be practically wiped out.  If you want to blame the gov't go ahead, they should've done more to inform people to get the hell out.  The real blame, at least in my mind, is on the people of NO.  Seriously, what is it that seperates us, humans, from animals?  Conscious thought, or in other words WE KNOW BETTER!  Hell, I bet if you asked a wildlife commissioner he could've told you that the critters were buggin out, and leaving.  I would like to say for the record, that I do feel sorry for many, maybe most, of the people from NO.  The storm, destruction, death, and flooding were bad enough, but then WAY too many completely selfish A*HOLES decided they wanted to rape, and pilledge, and basically act like they were in a bad movie (Waterworld).  These are the people I have zero simpathy for, in fact if I were a law maker I would do everything in my power to have these fools exterminated like the vermin they are.  
Here's a piece of history for you...
After the 1904 (not quite sure of that date) earthquake, the mayor of San Fransico declared that ANYONE caught looting would be killed on sight.  That's right you steal anything that ain't food or water, you die.  Let me say this another way, if you are so selfish, that even though you are able bodied, you refuse to help other VICTIMS, and instead you take advantage of you fellows you don' deserve to live, and you WILL BE KILLED.  Maybe I'm a Neo-con @$$hole, or whatever anyone wants to call me, but I think that was the right idea.  If you aren't part of the solution you are part of the problem.  There are way to many good quotes that apply, but I think I've gotten my point across.

I'm sorry I got on a soap box, but I'm done preaching for now.

Quote from: oppy00If anyone is up to speed on their geology/meteorology they would've known, that "if" a Cat. 5 hurricane, like Katrina, hit NO that the whole city would be under water for ages.  NO is below sea-level, meaning water doesn't leave the city.  They have to pump out the water after heavy rains.  Another thing is that this hurricane was something like a 1000 (or 10000) year storm, which means statistically a storm like Katrina will hit that region of the coast once ever 1000 (or 10000) years.  

That is incorrect. I believe the return period for a direct NO hit is closer to 35 years for a Cat 5. This was just a High cat 4, and not a direct NO hit. Add in a 50 mile wide swath on either side of NO, and cat 4 and the window is a very very pedestrian 10-12 years. The previos Cat 5 to make land in NO was Camille in 1969. It was a Cat 5 and it made a direct hit on NO. Cat 4 return periods are like 60 years for charlotte, which is over 100 miles inland. Cat 4 for any coastal city is right in the 10 year range. Charleston, Outer banks, anywhere ... a few cat 3-4's grazed NO, Ivan, Floyd, just in the last 2-3 years ... Katrina was not a freak oddity like an auto accident, its a measurable item like the wear on your tires ... If they're worn, they're done ... ride 5K miles and they will most likely be done ... OK if you were very easy on the throttle and rode only down hill with light loads and stayed off your brakes ... OK you may get a few more K's ... that's it ...
Cool.
Srinath.

 

tilt at windmills much?

 

Quote from: Ed_in_AzOK, well you MUST be right, as always. BUSH, the BUSHIE, the CHIMP did say it was his fault.

Well, I came into this thread looking forward to a spirited, fact-based debate, but then I saw Ed was....uh... was posting.  

Oh well.....maybe the NEXT thread will require that knives and guns be left at the door.  :nana:

Quote from: Ed_in_AzAs long as BUSH, the BUSHIE, the CHIMP gets the blame that's all that matters isnt' it? :dunno:

No? :dunno:

What's that you say? Oh I see, as long as the RepubliKan party is outlawed, all the elected officials in the RepubliKan party from BUSH, the BUSHIE, the CHIMP on down, go to prison and pay hefty fines, the country might be able to recover.

OK, well you MUST be right, as always. BUSH, the BUSHIE, the CHIMP did say it was his fault.

No one blamed "Bushie the chimpie" for anyhitng really in this disaster ... you have to think though here ... he never takes blame for anyhting, even the ones for which a generous portion does come to his door ... and he takes blame for a hurricane ... He must really think we're really really stoopid ... Besides. I am trying to get away from the clouding of the issue and seeing what else is there ... buses standing ... any other venues not used.
Cool.
Srinath.

 

Quote from: Ed_in_Az

Quote from: seshadri_srinathNo one blamed "Bushie the chimpie" for anyhitng really in this disaster ... you have to think though here ... he never takes blame for anyhting, even the ones for which a generous portion does come to his door ... and he takes blame for a hurricane ... He must really think we're really really stoopid ... Besides. I am trying to get away from the clouding of the issue and seeing what else is there ... buses standing ... any other venues not used.
Cool.
Srinath.

The bait here was - RepubliKan ?? Give me a break. To blame the party is wacked.

To blame the people in charge of, with authority over, dozens of school buses left standing in a lake that could have been used pre-emptively by those drivers that knew the city routes blindfolded to ferry people out before the flood, now that would make sense. Agreed?

RepubliKan - I didn't say that ... I said repu - buick - an ... been saying it for years, that means nothing ... I also say demi crat, Demi Craze ... and they are demi craze cos they like demi moore all sorts of crap ... doesn't make me one way or another ...
The point about buses - yes I saw that and was wondering what else we're not being told about the problem ... If people had been carted out of there, the state/city will have had to pay transportation costs for them ... or what else ... Good call Ed ... lets see what else was left un used ... well I guess its all well used now ...  :lol:
Cool.
Srinath.