Quote from: Kessen

Quote from: PhaedrusI still think you will be fine with a GS-F. A lot of people have started out on it and were just fine. Some total them, but most don't. Just be careful and try not to doing anything frocktarded  

really not going to do anything focktarded (lol).I mean savin up for a bike just to fock it up by being a focktard...thats just focked...

I agree, that would be completely frocking frocked!   :lol:

Quote from: Kessen.....speaking of dropping it, im going to buy fairing protectors and put em on before i ride

What you are probably referring to are actually called frame sliders. They are not designed to protect the fairing but the frame instead, the most expensive part of a bike to replace. They may help reduce some damage to the plastic but do not expect it.

Quote from: dgyver

Quote from: Kessen.....speaking of dropping it, im going to buy fairing protectors and put em on before i ride

What you are probably referring to are actually called frame sliders. They are not designed to protect the fairing but the frame instead, the most expensive part of a bike to replace. They may help reduce some damage to the plastic but do not expect it.

no im talking about fairing -protectors-, that is if i understood correctly, i thought you couldnt use frame -sliders- with gs's because you have to mount them to engine bolts or somethin...and gs's dont have then in the right place or somethin? wish i could get sliders( like with sv's, i think thats one of the major down sides of this bike.)

link where i read it:
http://www.gstwins.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=22377&highlight=sliders

Kessen - I am sure Dgyver knows what you mean, but I think he is just saying that they will not help much in a crash of any real speed. If you're just being a bonehead and knock the bike over at a stand still or going real slow, they should theoretically provide a buffer for the bike between the plastics and the ground. If you are moving right along at highway speed, they are not going to help. But when you are an ultra noob, they would come in handy when practicing your riding skills and getting used to the bike. Past that, you are kind of on your own  

Quote from: PhaedrusBut when you are an ultra noob, they would come in handy when practicing your riding skills and getting used to the bike. Past that, you are kind of on your own  

yup, thats exactly what i want.i understand they are not like sliders, hell, im hoping that if i wreck the bike in a crash, it would be someone hitting me...someone with insurance..but being an optimist when im in a good mood i feel that the main thing i need to worry about is dropping the thing while im practicing at low speeds.

im not saying the F isnt bad to start with at all, im saying get some miles under your belt on a cheap cheap bike 300$-500$, get most the dropies and oppses out of the way Vs just jumping on a Brand new, or near new bike for 3k-5K.  nothing saying you cant continue to save, hell you can even sell the beater to a buddy for about what you got it for.

Quote from: Blueknytim not saying the F isnt bad to start with at all, im saying get some miles under your belt on a cheap cheap bike 300$-500$, get most the dropies and oppses out of the way Vs just jumping on a Brand new, or near new bike for 3k-5K.  nothing saying you cant continue to save, hell you can even sell the beater to a buddy for about what you got it for.

so confused
i mean, i completely see where your comin from,get some expierience while saving even more cash, but again, my req is that it be a fully faired bike, now i know its sort of lame to have that as a req but its just what i want, need! cruisers just arent my thing, and i think 250's might be a bit small.

Quote from: Kessenso confused
i mean, i completely see where your comin from,get some expierience while saving even more cash, but again, my req is that it be a fully faired bike, now i know its sort of lame to have that as a req but its just what i want, need! cruisers just arent my thing, and i think 250's might be a bit small.

Who said anything about cruisers or 250s?  An older GS500 is exactly the same bike as the newer ones, just without the bodywork.  

What people are saying is that there's a pretty good chance you'll drop your first bike.  Not because you're an idiot, or you'll ride recklessly, but just because s happens and it usually happens with your first bike.  A shiny new F model is gonna cost you more to buy, and where an E will have little or no damage from a minor drop, an F will probably get scratched and cracked up and really piss you off.  :guns:

Best to reduce your odds of that happening (and save a little $ in the meantime) by starting with a regular E, ride it for a year or two, and then move up to something different, with fairings if you like.

jeff

Quote from: Jeff PTwo things to avoid doing while you're learning:  riding at night and riding in the rain.  Both exacerbate every problem you're likely to have.  Hell I've been riding for 3 years and I still avoid doing either.  

jeff

+1, that's how I went down the first time after my first month of riding: riding at night + a girl makes a u-turn in front of me + I lack experience to react = T-bone and 4 months in the cast.

Also at that time (after about a month) my fear of traffic transformed into fascination with the freedom and mobility and I started riding... in a not so safe manner  (partially the tbone was a result of that I think) so please don't assume you know it all after a month

Quote from: Soaring(after about a month) my fear of traffic transformed into fascination with the freedom and mobility and I started riding... in a not so safe manner

thats about the time most new riders think they've outgrown the little gs and start thinking of a liter bike...

Quote from: Jeff P... by starting with a regular E, ride it for a year or two, and then move up to something different, with fairings if you like.

jeff

thats what I did. It works.

Quote from: Jeff P
by starting with a regular E, ride it for a year or two, and then move up to something different, with fairings if you like.

you guys are right,though i dont want to admit it cause i was lookin forward to a fully faired bike,maybe ill look into E's.

Im not exactly sure of my fascination with faired bikes, i mean, E's are nice, but to me their  'just bikes', F's are more like works of art, and then a bike.
(not to talk shaZam! because im prolly going to end up on an E for awhile.)
:dunno: maybe its my age showin through.

speaking of crusiers, the diffrence between a cruiser and a sport bike is the riding position right?so even if a gs isnt faired its still a sport bike regardless of being faired or not?

Faired bikes are sexy, no disagreement here.  But I find the look of the naked GS500s to be pretty slick, for a bike that came out in 1989 it's still looks good.  It grows on you.  Random people compliment mine all the time.  

You're right it's basically the riding position that defines what a bike is.  The GS500, either the E or the F, is really a "standard" style bike.  The position just isn't as aggressive as a sport bikes.  They have higher bars and the pegs are lower and more or less below you, where on a sportbike they're higher up and further back.  Cruisers tend to have big, wide bars and the pegs are out in front of you.  

jeff

Kessen - There is nothing wrong with buying an "F" as your first bike. I've done it and so have many others. If it is what you want, then get it. Get the fairing protectors and be careful and like I said, make sure you have full insurance coverage. The higher speed crashes, if you get into one, the scratched up fairings are probably going to be one of the last things you are worried about. If youre bike skids 300 feet down the road, yeah the plastics are going to be chewed but so are many other things on the bike - whether it is an E, and F, or a Heyabusa.

Quote from: PhaedrusIf your bike skids 300 feet down the road, yeah the plastics are going to be chewed but so are many other things on the bike -

and on you...

Quote from: RVertigo

Quote from: PhaedrusIf your bike skids 300 feet down the road, yeah the plastics are going to be chewed but so are many other things on the bike -

and on you...

Exactly   The point is, in any *real* crash, the plastic pieces aren't exactly going to be a priority. And those stupid little roller skate stoppers (fairing protectors) will help protect it when you get off the bike and forget to put the kickstand down  

Quote from: Jeff PYou're right it's basically the riding position that defines what a bike is.  The GS500, either the E or the F, is really a "standard" style bike.  The position just isn't as aggressive as a sport bikes.  They have higher bars and the pegs are lower and more or less below you, where on a sportbike they're higher up and further back.  Cruisers tend to have big, wide bars and the pegs are out in front of you.

I'd submit that it has more to do with geometry and less to do with ergonomics.  Sport bikes have a steeper rake and shorter trail than standards, cruisers, or touring bikes.  This makes them turn faster and makes them less stable (thus easier to lean or more "flickable").  You can move the pegs and handlebars around all you want, but a sportbike will still behave differently than a cruiser.

Quote from: PhaedrusKessen - There is nothing wrong with buying an "F" as your first bike. I've done it and so have many others. If it is what you want, then get it.

It's really about how much you want to spend and how much you want the bike to be worth when you're done with it.  If you get a nekkid GS, you can probably do it on the cheap, and it will probably be worth very close to what you paid for it in a year or two (some other newb rider will be looking for it).  Get a new/recent F and you're going to pay a lot more and you're going to see the value drop sharply...especially if you drop it and rash the plastics.

I looked for an E for a while, but couldn't find one.  I ended up getting a new F.  Cost about 5x what I could have paid for an older, used one.  I've dropped it twice...the first left minor cosmetic damage (a few scuffs) on the right fairing (no biggie) and the other did no damage that I could find.  If you want a faired bike and are comfortable with the fact that you're very likely to drop it and scratch up the fairings...and you're willing to spend the $, go for it.  A lot of folks have done the same.  

By the way, it's not the end of the world if you drop it...from the way people talk about it you'd think that tipping it over in the driveway automatically causes the fairings to explode, but that's just not the case.  But...if you're going to obsess about your fairings being in pristine condition, you might want to start with something else (like a pre-dropped beater) first.

The GS is a good beginner bike...E, F, whatever.  They both ride pretty much the same.  Go with what meets your needs and budget...and enjoy it.

Quote from: BadgerThe GS is a good beginner bike...E, F, whatever.  They both ride pretty much the same.  Go with what meets your needs and budget...and enjoy it.

budget wise, it makes most sense to go with an E,since ill be able to afford one in say 3 months, an F on the other hand will take twice if not three times that much time.

and someone earlier mentioned full coverage insurance, now, i got my insurance guy to quote me for a sv650...when i had my brief affair with the semi-faired beast,then got the fear of noob mistakes into me...i decided to go for a 500,
anyway,
with my age one sided insurance for the sv was around 400 a year, im guessing its lower for the gs,full coverage on that same bike was 3.6 grand (mind you i have a perfect driving record, it just seems that being 18 does you no good insurance wise) so full coverage is out...that is until my rates drop and the insurance isnt going to be more a year then my bike is worth.

im okay with getting an E, nice looking bike,my only problems teh front, and im sure itll grow on me,though, are they any headlight mods where you can put 2 on there instead of one, without a wind screen,always liked how that looks (pics anyone?)

Kessen - Yes, a GS is much cheaper for insurance than an SV650. Others have discussed this on the board elsewhere, but SV650's are notorious for their high insurance rates.

Have you seen an "E" in person yet? I hadn't until a GStwin PA ride last summer. I saw pdg108 and weazelnose's bikes, both E's. They both changed my opinion of the "E" for sure. At first, from only pictures, I didn't like them very much. But after seeing them guy's bikes, it gave me a fresh perspective on them.  

Quote from: PhaedrusKessen - There is nothing wrong with buying an "F" as your first bike.

250 Ninjas seem to sell well as beginner bikes and are full faired, too (but they're not just for beginners...  ).