OUCH!! HIGHSIDE

JBix · July 27, 2003, 01:40:52 PM

I think cruisedaddy should be knocking on wood. Don't be so proud as happy that you haven't tasted asphalt. It will happen. PERIOD. Whether you are ready or not. So expect it all the time. I know I do, as does any decent rider. I don't look forward to my turn, but I'm ready for it. Like nut-kicking contest.

Ride hard, Ride safe.

Peace.

Bix

July 27, 2003, 03:04:37 PM

Where can I get the stats from that you guys are quoting?

Its an inductivist (generalization) argument, what your saying is that EVERYONE who has ever ridden a bike WILL crash... thats crazy

I dont doubt that the huge majority of people who ride bikes will crash, no doubt at all! And your turn could be around that next bend.

If a guy has been riding for 20+ years and never come unstuck, dont you think that he is getting further from crashing and not closer to crashing??

I dont know... but seriously, I want to read the stats, I am interested in Motorcycle facts and stats of any kind! So post a link or email me them or whatever...

Stay Safe

vegbiker · July 27, 2003, 04:36:21 PM

I'm glad you're relatively okay! Scary stuff! I think you did the right thing by trying to avoid the racoon. Driver (i.e.: car) training states to run over small woodland creatures, but with riding it's a different story. My MSF instructor ate pavement because she ran over a cat. I think the riders' course stresses quickstops and sharp turns for a reason - it seems like the lesser of two evils. Where I grew up racoons were 20-30 pounds. I don't think I could run one over and stay on the bike. Obstacle avoidance is a good strategy.

I hope you heal quickly...

WAP · July 27, 2003, 07:43:41 PM

Personally I found that a more philosophical approach to crashing is more helpful than pure statistics. The following is taken from an essay by Mark C. Taylor and Jose Marquez included in "The Art of the Motorcycle":

"To fall off a speeding motorcycle and survive is the impossible event that underwrites all motorcycling...Falling is the inevitable catastrophe that nevertheless must be avoided, the inescapable fate that must be permanently deferred...the rider must always think of falling but never acknowledge the thought."

That last line is one i like to quote (plagiarize?) whenever the subject of crashing comes up. The entire book is actually a very good read if you live breath and (die) motorcycles. Pour yourself a cup of your favorite beverage and kick back type good.

cruisedaddy · July 29, 2003, 11:03:36 AM

I _did_ find on interesting stat, specific to my home state NJ at least. In 1998-2002, it turns out that 84% of all motorcycling accidents in NJ had a rider within their first six months of riding. I assume this includes everything from the most trivial fender-bender to T-boning an 18-wheeler, but I think this is telling. You really, really, really want to be careful until you're an expert rider. I mean the GS is often the mount of newbies, so it makes some sense to me that there will be crashes. But, that's not to say that crashes are inevitable ... more experienced riders usually have some hard-won roadcraft skills that you can absorb for free ... ride behind the driver of something like a Honda Gold Wing sometime and you will usually see some excellent road and traffic skills.

pantablo · July 29, 2003, 11:59:40 AM

Quote from: cruisedaddyI _did_ find on interesting stat, specific to my home state NJ at least. In 1998-2002, it turns out that 84% of all motorcycling accidents in NJ had a rider within their first six months of riding.

Interesting, This is counter to the nationwide(?) stats quoted in MSF course and in Proficient Motorcycling book that states of those involved in accidents, most were in their 2nd or 3rd year of motorcycling. Their asumption being that it is enough time to gain confidence in your skills but the confidence is above what their skills really are. I don't have the exact numbers off top of my head though.

Quote from: cruisedaddyYou really, really, really want to be careful until you're an expert rider.

You really need to be careful all the time though...the cages are out to kill you. And if you ride the canyons hard you're pushing your limits-eventually you might find them.

mrslush50 · July 30, 2003, 01:46:16 PM

If you push the edge of the envelope, eventually you'll get a paper cut.

hahaha

aren't I witty?

KevinC · July 30, 2003, 02:13:24 PM

There are very few reliable statistics on motorcycle accidents. The only really good report was done in 1981 I believe, commonly referred to as the "Hurt Reprt" after the author. The conclusions are available many places:

http://www.magpie.com/nycmoto/hurt.html

Some excerpts:

20. Motorcycle riders between the ages of 16 and 24 are significantly overrepresented in accidents; motorcycle riders between the ages of 30 and 50 are significantly underrepresented. Although the majority of the accident-involved motorcycle riders are male (96%), the female motorcycles riders are significantly overrepresented in the accident data.

25. More than half of the accident-involved motorcycle riders had less than 5 months experience on the accident motorcycle, although the total street riding experience was almost 3 years. Motorcycle riders with dirt bike experience are significantly underrepresented in the accident data.

There is a movement afoot to do an updated study, since so many factors have changed since 1981:

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/people/injury/pedbimot/motorcycle/00-NHT-212-motorcycle/appendix_a-81.html

pantablo · July 30, 2003, 04:23:50 PM

Quote from: KevinC25. More than half of the accident-involved motorcycle riders had less than 5 months experience on the accident motorcycle, although the total street riding experience was almost 3 years.

That would indicate crashing on your second bike...more reason to stick with the GS.

V8Pinto · July 30, 2003, 07:22:11 PM

Sorry to hear about that man.... Hope you're ok..

When I crashed earlier in the year I had all my gear on and came out ok. I carry a big knife in my pocket and landed on it. My leg was all bruised up there and my jeans wore through in that spot. I don't have special riding pants so I am stuck with jeans. Hope you scab up soon!

One of my favorite movie quotes is "pain goes away and chicks dig scars"....

or something like that. hahahahaha

L8r

mrslush50 · July 30, 2003, 10:35:56 PM

It's

"Pain heals. Chicks dig scars. Glory... lasts forever."
-Shane Falco
The Replacements

great movie.

smp · July 31, 2003, 02:12:04 AM

Quote from: tricked500ok people you all have made some good points I dident buy my bike to look at ,I got it to ride.......crashes happen and happen the the best riders,yet I know im not the best, But i fell I can hold my own. I dont like to ride in a straight line I like turns and high speed turns!! you got to have fun on your bike! If you go for a ride and dont have fun You dont need a motorcycle "get rid of it"

I did'nt make this post to have people argue about whos right and whos wrong. I just wanted people to know what happend.
Were all like a family here, we help eachother out when we can and help you up when you go down!!!

life is a learning leason and im still learning!! how about you?!?!?!

Chris

I hear you man, and since we're all friends we want you alive.
Riding agressively at night where there is chances of wildlife is a big GAMBLE.. don't gamble with your life. You can have high speed twisties and fun and everything without riding in the woods at night.

Oh.. and I'de like to add.. the stats thing, I heard it was the first six months and then again between 2 and 3 years.
As for sayings..
"Ride like there's no tomorrow and there won't be"

Cris · July 31, 2003, 11:31:39 AM

Glad you are ok.

The Buddha · July 31, 2003, 11:42:09 AM

I have once hit a small piglet and gone down. I have also hit a big dog and not done anything other than break its spine both on the same bike in India within a minth of each other, and the difference was mainly if you were going straight and trying to turn/swerve and how much suspension and steering you have left unused. The pig hit was when I swerved right and had the brakes on and I hit it cos it also was runing to the right. Also the critter in the fraction of a second it takes to get to where you hit it may be a few inches ahead and that could make the difference between hitting and not hitting it. I have assumed that I am hitting something only to show up at the pre arranged location to find out that the silly creature has decided to die another day. Cats mostly and I believe foxes, raccons and dogs on occassion but the darkness usually plays its share of games. Usually if I am going straight I'd let off the gas, brake lightly and see if I run into it. On a Curve I would let off the gas and drag my inner foot motocross style heading up to the impact. More often than not I have missed the creature cos it moved away.
Cool.
Srinath.

octane · July 31, 2003, 11:46:08 AM

Quote from: pantabloanybody else crashed and I'm gonna have to come over there and wup your ass.quote]

There goes Pablo bullying everyone around again...

pdg108 · July 31, 2003, 12:12:14 PM

Just to throw something else into the equation.

I know the area you ride in has to affect your chances of crashing.

I've riden in the middle of nowhere Indiana were there aren't as many cagers and intersections and twisties. Then I moved to the Wilmington, DE, Philly, Baltimore area were things are much more crowded, busyier and hectic.

From my experience the more cagers around, the more chances of one of them doing something unexpectedly stupid.

I just try to pay attention, and make sure that if I go down it wasn't because I did something stupid.

BTW, in my MSC, they told us about "squishables" and "non-squishables", but making the call leaned over in a bend in a split second sounds like a flip of a coin to me.

later

V8Pinto · July 31, 2003, 01:20:49 PM

Quote from: mrslush50It's

"Pain heals. Chicks dig scars. Glory... lasts forever."
-Shane Falco
The Replacements

great movie.

My name is Shane.... I think I will *adopt* that quote. hahahahah. Too cool. Thanks for the correction.

News:

OUCH!! HIGHSIDE

vegbiker