Hi all!

I've been riding my GS for about a year and the information from this community is very valuable.  Reading the board almost everyday becomes my habit and it solved many of my beginner questions. Thanks everyone! Since the board members values safety as a high priority, I think this is the right place to ask this question.

After I got my GS last year, I began to ride it in my local blocks to practice.  At that time, I was living an hour away from campus, so I took my car to school and rode GS at night just for fun.  A couple of months ago, I moved much closer to campus.  Now I ride to campus almost everyday (about 15 miles one way).  Since I wear my riding gear (helmet, leather jacket, boots, gloves...) every time I ride, there are quite a few people ask me about motorcycle stuff. 

But there is a particular guy that are really interested in getting the license and a bike to commute.  So I recommend him to go to MSF to get his license and then get a 250 or 500 to start on, but he insists that a 250 or 500 is too slow for him and plan to get a liter bike for his first one.   I think this is a really bad idea, especially he hasn't been on any bike before.  I already mentioned to him that I ride my GS almost everyday now and it's more than enough for traffic even if it's "only" a 500.  I even suggest him to get an SV650 if he wants more power, but he seems to be locked on a liter supersport.  Hope he'll change his mind after attending MSF.

Do you have a similar experience?  How do you convince your friends to get a less aggressive bike as their first?

Simon

show him crash pictures that are on the board here!!!!!!!

Ask him what he wants on his tombstone.
Be serious about it.

If he does get a liter bike, force him to get a helmet, gloves, and a jacket (Minimum) and to wear it everytime he rides.

Some people can't be talked out of it, and because of that, you just let them waste their good hard earned money.
There isn't much more you can do about it.

If it's a friend:
tell him you don't want him to look like a poser with a nice-ass bike who will have no skills and get laughed at by people with slower bikes that know how to ride better.
if he's really that good to need a liter bike, why isn't he a professional racer?
Also remind him that you don't want him to die.
(this worked on my friend)

if it's not a friend:
(like this moron I met at the mall: who said he's always wanted one, and he only plans to buy one, so he's going to get a cbr600rr as his first bike)
tell him "hope you have life insurance for your family when you kill yourself" and walk away.

these types of people aren't really asking for suggestions, they're bragging that they plan to buy a literbike as they've alreayd made up their minds.

I once read a guide for buying your first bike that said:

"Buying a 600cc bike as your first motorcycle is like sending a two-year-old out to play on the freeway--often with the same results."

Chilly

If he wants a liter-bike, you probably won't be able to help him.  Sway him towards the gentler end of the liters like the SV1000 and VTR1000(which may sound like my usual plug for twins, but they've got a bigger learning curve than a K6 GSXR).  The best thing you can do for him, as a friend, is to be as best a teacher as possible to him.  Take him to the dealer and show him the new bikes and tell him their specs and what they can do.  Try and tell him that he'll be a better rider if he starts out propperly, and that the learning curve for the bigger bikes is far too sharp to allow for many mistakes.

Don't tell him he'll hurt himself...using that as a deterant is as effective at saving noobs as using ketchup to clean carpet stains.

You already told him to start on something small, not too much else that you can do. People are stubborn and stupid.

One tact might be to tell him that he'll probally drop his first bike a few times and if he has a brand new $10,000+ sportbike, he'll just be wasting his money. Remind him that a cheaper, already been dropped 500-650 will be cheaper and won't depreciate as much as a brand new bike. Then once he drops it a few times hopefully he'll realize that a tom more power isn't needed. Or at least he'll have learned a little first.

Good point Nolan,

That was the reason why I bought a cheaper, already-crashed GS500 as opposed to a new cruiser style bike.  In a way, having a "junker" has been pretty liberating.  I'm not afraid of tearing into it (especially since there's no new bike warrentee to invalidate) and trying to fix things myself.  On a newer, more expensive bike, I probably would be too nervous to try much at all.  Plus, I've already dropped my GS--not a heartbreaker.  If I dropped a brand new bike, I'd be much more bummed out.

Chilly

Tell him to come ride in the mountains with me. When I smoke him on my GS in the twisties, he'll realize that it's not the bike, it's the rider.

I feel like a lot of beginners get this idea that they have to have a bigger bike from magazines/reveiws etc.  They say things like "this bike certainly doesn't overdo it in the power department, with only 63 horsepower at the rear wheel!"  Or "A person with more weight or that wishes to ride two up should opt for the larger liter variant"
When I was looking for a beginner bike, I was seriously worried that a 500 would not haul my 230 lbs around, that it would be seriously slow, etc.  Because that is the image you get from reading cycle magazines.  I found a good deal on a GS, and bought it, thinking that I would outgrow it quickly and upgrade.  And then I rode it.  Come to find out, it is really fast.  Seriously.  Sure, it isn't a  liter bike, but it is not slow!  I know he will find this hard to accept, as I did, since the GS's specs especially in the HP department look puny compared to other bikes the mags are calling "slow" and "gutless".  But on the GS, you can crank the throttle, it GOES.  If you do that with a liter bike, chances are the bike will go, and you will be sitting on your ass watching it go.

I just feel that bike mags present the wrong picture for noobs.  Especially when they say things like "this bike will not be able to keep up with your friends 750" or some dumb thing like that.  What, is your friend doing 140 with his 750?  Don't be stupid.  Even the most humble motorcycle accelerates like a sports car or better.

So my advice:  Tell him to stop reading cycle mags and start reading on this forum.  

Thanks everyone for the great comments!  Maybe I'm just a paranoid, I have no problem telling myself to get a smaller bike in the first place.     I have a feeling that this guy has the mental image that every bikers are going for the speed and racing every red lights.  He probably get the ideas from motorcycle magazines reviews (like Sicarii pointed out) or the ghostrider videos in youtube.  I tried to tell him that there are bikers like the ones in this forum that respects traffic laws and still enjoy the fun of motorcycling.  I told him about the advantage of having a naked and less powerful bike as the first bike, pointed him to this forum, and suggested him to take MSF class.  Not sure if he listens, but I've done what I can do right now. 

We work on research projects together (I'm a graduate student).  But I just don't want to see another bike accidents, no matter if the victims are my friends or someone that I don't know.  All fellow bikers are like my family members.    I will definitely guide him to ride responsibly once he gets a bike (although I'm still a beginner myself, I guess I can share my beginner experience with him).

Anyways, ride safe everyone and thanks for the comments!

Simon

When I started looking for my first streetbike I was originally looking at a CBR600, until my uncle told me about his crash on a sportbike and showed me pictures.  After that I realized that it is extremely important to start out on the right bike.   Try to find someone who has crashed on a 600 supersport and get them to talk to him.

Quote from: simonyau on October 17, 2006, 01:49:41 PM
I tried to tell him that there are bikers like the ones in this forum that respects traffic laws and still enjoy the fun of motorcycling.  I told him about the advantage of having a naked and less powerful bike as the first bike, pointed him to this forum, and suggested him to take MSF class.  Not sure if he listens, but I've done what I can do right now.  Simon

Sounds as though you did the best you could (and a good job of it at that!). Hopefully he listens....if not, you've done what you could.... I hope he listens... 

Sugest that he check out some of the sportbike forums for tips. I'm sure there is one for R1s and all the others, have him ask their advice. I'm sure that most (but not all) of the riders will say the same thing we do, start small and work your way up. It would probally help hearing it from the guys who actually ride the extreme bikes rather than 'a buch of wuses who ride 500s'  seriously though. Once almost everyone who rides tries to talk him out of it, he may listen. If not  whatever people have the right to kill themselves if they want.

He's a grown man, let him do what he wants.  Offer advice to him, but don't try and bully him into getting a smaller bike.  If he wants to waste his money on a bike that will take him a long time to learn to ride, let him do it.  I went through this with a friend of mine.  He is a numbskull that wont listen to reason.  He thinks a 07 R6 would be a great first bike because "It's only a 600!"  Smart folks get into biking the right way.  We keep an open mind, take the MSF, learn about safety gear, shop the bike market for new and used, then pick a bike.  I will offer advice on first bikes, but I won't preach to anybody that doesn't listen.  If my friend, strangers on the interenet, and a salesman at the dealer all told me that an R6 isn't a beginner bike, I would listen, but there are some rock skulled idots out there like my friend that think they know better.  Everytime you thumb that starter your life is in your hands.  People don't have the foggiest clue as to how dangerous and enjoyable riding can be.  I've learned that most folks that think they need a big bad ass first bike have underlying esteem issues and probably need to work on themselves rather than ride a bike.  Let him live and learn, and hopefully he wont end up another statistic.

your friend can die in the tub, on a 50 or a 1k of from the hands of a crack whore.....his money
just make sure he doesn't wear a helmut.....world needs more organ donors


yes the US needs a learner program...size limits/HP limits....but it ain't gunna happen
some senators son will want a busa and will get one

If your friend is only planning on gettting one bike, and is planning on getting a liter bike as that one bike, then the chances are he will be right... dead right! That liter bike will probably turn out to be his first and last bike.

In your place, I'd visit a florists, purchase a wreath and have it delivered to him with the message, "I'm getting this out of the way now because I don't want to waste good riding time by attending your funeral".

He may get the message, but probably won't.

my biggest question is this: what point of reference is he using to say the 500 isnt powerful enough? he's never ridden so how can he possibly know how much is too much?

Let him get the liter bike and come play with me and Pablo on the track.

He will cry.

(Pablo will be doing most of the making cry though, cause he's faster than me (probably, we haven't tested this theory yet, but I think he is) but me lapping him on a "500" will certainly make him go ZOMFG!)

You could also tell your friend to take a look at this thread