You would think so wouldn't you?  But apparently there are some people here who think that what really matters is them telling everyone else their oppinions about why you shouldn't be on cell phones. 

Look people her and I both know she made a mistake, and what truly matters is that no one was hurt and we have already purchased a hands free headset for her.  I'm not in here looking for you to verify she was innocent.  I was expecting her to get cited as was she since she was the one who hit the other car.

Now on the other hand if your just going to post about the cell phone or paying attention while she drives, all I'm going to say is this:

Oppinions are like assholes, everyone has one, and you my friend are one.

Thanks and keep on trolling through!

Nick

airbags go off?

What kind of response did you expect from a motorcycle board?

Being "high and mighty" has nothing to do with it.  Collectively, we get merged into, cut off, tailgated, left-turned and otherwise have our right-of-way violated every day by inattentive people on cell phones.  We pay the highest cost for traffic crashes.  Therefore, we tend to be the most sensitive to the mishandling of vehicles.

The fact of the matter is, if she had not been talking on her phone and had not been tailgating, there would have been no crash.  Being pre-occupied with other tasks not related to driving while not keeping adequate following distance is NOT an excuse to rear-end another vehicle.  That's not an opinion, but a pure fact, and it is the important lesson to take away from the situation. 

In aviation, there is no such thing as an "accident".  They are all "crashes" and they are all investigated by the NTSB and FAA.  Blame is always assigned as a matter of principle, ensuring future safety of the air transportation system and public acceptance of it as a safe method of travel.  We do not explain away any error as a mere "accident".  To do so is to undermine the continued safety of the system.  To explain it away is to provide the groundwork for it to happen again.

Ohgood and I have nothing against you and your fiance.  What we take issue with is the casual "oh well, nobody was hurt" attitude you're displaying.  That attitude is not conducive to safety.

Quote from: cafeboy on March 02, 2009, 11:12:33 AM
Sorry bro, but glad to hear she's ok 

Well then...................I would like to show my post, so            ummmmmmmmmmm
High and mighty 

No the airbags did not go off, and that post was not directed at you cafeboy so no worries!

Why is everybody so quick to get upset about an accident like this?  Just ask yourself this question...would your girlfriend be as forgiving and understanding if you were killed on your bike by a tailgating, cell phone using, (admittedly) inattentive driver...Or would she get all 'high and mighty'?

It happens! I guess I'd better chime in and get my chiding as well! In '07 I was driving my neon in pooring down rain at 35 mph in front of me was an F-350 that slammed on his brakes at a green light " to make sure my brakes were working". I thought I was at a pretty safe distance but I did not have anti-lock brakes and when I slammed them I hydroplaned right into the back (and no I wasn't on a  cell phone). Did nothing to his massive truck. Killed my car and bought me a trip to the hospital with an overnight stay to make sure a lead in my defibrillator was not fractured by the seat belt since the airbag also failed to activate. While sitting ur uhm laying c-spined to a back board already been an hour state trooper waltzes in throws the ticket on my chest and walks out. So, no car, stuck in the hospital, $200 ticket for reckless driving, later found out had two herniated discs in my back. Is it punisment enough or do guys require more. Uhm, people make mistakes! My car insurance is 133 a month for a 2000 dollar car. Yet my moto is 33 a month! Esurance sucks Progressive is great though. But, yeah I want to be treated with dignity when having an accident weather it's my fault or not that is what I pay them for!

I'm sorry about your wife. I kick my self in the butt constantlly cause I really liked my old car. But it's life. She is lucky she didn't get a ticket

Mary

Well ut i wish her the best. whatever caused it is irrelevant. minimum it looks liek a hood bumper cover rad support maybe some other things. idk if it will total it. prolly not. looks liek a newer car soooo. i wish yall best of luck 

Some times no ones hurt but people get SCREWED!!!! BIG TIME

What if the guy she rear ened has poor credit, owes about 6K more than his car is worth... Insurance totals his car and he has to still pay 6K over what they give hom for it Now he and has no way to get his kids to school or go to work for months cause your girl really needed to talk on the phone?...

Or should I say, im not against the phone. there are some who can pay attention and talk w. no problems... others can barely stay on the road just changing the radio or turning the wipers on...


All in all, in an accident. More often than not the person who was not at fault gets WAY more screwed than the person that was at fault. esp. if you have less $$$$

I have been there, got hit by someone who said oooo my bad, i thought my nail apointment as more importaint than driving....

Menwhile, My car gets totaled... I get almost 4K less tan what it was worth and it wasnt even my fault !!!!!



Someone always gets hurt when you F up someones day.. 


And aonther rant...  FUC K hands free.. you still will dial, text, hit the voicemail button... I bet people look at their phone more that the road 20+% of the time.

Ahhh rant rant.. nothing against your wife, I just see it all day I drive alot being an IT tech and I see people do things and wonder WHY THE F$$K DO YOU THINK THATS OK ?


Ok.. keep drivin like ya own it

Is the use of mobiles while driving not illegal over there?.......get caught and its an on the spot fine and a few points here........do something really dangerous and you will end up doing time.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7153070.stm

oh, i know, let's ban all things that are deemed "distractions"! lets make laws for everything! no more radio's or gps systems allowed for cars or bikes. no more smoking allowing on cars or bikes. people walking in the street need to be entirely clothed, showing no skin, and no tight clothing, as this may be a distraction as well. no more eating or drinking ANYTHING whilst riding or driving. oh, and while we're at it, mandatory breath analysis systems in EVERY car/bike, since drunk driving is killing lots of folks. hmm..what else can we do...oh, i know...mandatory helment/seatbelt laws, regardless of age or discretion. must be full faced, no matter what type of riding you do. ohh..and, madatory, full race leathers, for all types of bikes, cuz you know, it protects better.  get my point yet? 

Quote from: sledge on March 03, 2009, 12:30:35 AM
Is the use of mobiles while driving not illegal over there?.......get caught and its an on the spot fine and a few points here........do something really dangerous and you will end up doing time.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7153070.stm

in some places yes. in most,,, no

Quote from: oramac on March 02, 2009, 08:02:24 PM
1) Why is everybody so quick to get upset about an accident like this?  Just ask yourself this question...2) would your girlfriend be as forgiving and understanding if you were killed on your bike by a tailgating, cell phone using, (admittedly) inattentive driver...Or 3) would she get all 'high and mighty'?

1 because it's very simple to prevent. how ? don't follow to closely, and hang up the f%$king phone !
2 no, my wife and family would bring suit to satisfy their needs for the next 10-20 years. (this will start a whole new flamewar, i know)
3 high and mighty, or just plain taking responsibility for actions ?

Quote from: scottpA_GS on March 02, 2009, 09:58:59 PM

Some times no ones hurt but people get SCREWED!!!! BIG TIME

What if the guy she rear ened has poor credit, owes about 6K more than his car is worth... Insurance totals his car and he has to still pay 6K over what they give hom for it Now he and has no way to get his kids to school or go to work for months cause your girl really needed to talk on the phone?...

Or should I say, im not against the phone. there are some who can pay attention and talk w. no problems... others can barely stay on the road just changing the radio or turning the wipers on...


All in all, in an accident. More often than not the person who was not at fault gets WAY more screwed than the person that was at fault. esp. if you have less $$$$

I have been there, got hit by someone who said oooo my bad, i thought my nail apointment as more importaint than driving....

Menwhile, My car gets totaled... I get almost 4K less tan what it was worth and it wasnt even my fault !!!!!



Someone always gets hurt when you F up someones day.. 


And aonther rant...  FUC K hands free.. you still will dial, text, hit the voicemail button... I bet people look at their phone more that the road 20+% of the time.

Ahhh rant rant.. nothing against your wife, I just see it all day I drive alot being an IT tech and I see people do things and wonder WHY THE F$$K DO YOU THINK THATS OK ?


Ok.. keep drivin like ya own it

agreed. hang up the f%$king phones, drive like you and your kids' lives depend on it. simple.

Quote from: jserio on March 03, 2009, 12:52:08 AM
oh, i know, let's ban all things that are deemed "distractions"! lets make laws for everything! no more radio's or gps systems allowed for cars or bikes. no more smoking allowing on cars or bikes. people walking in the street need to be entirely clothed, showing no skin, and no tight clothing, as this may be a distraction as well. no more eating or drinking ANYTHING whilst riding or driving. oh, and while we're at it, mandatory breath analysis systems in EVERY car/bike, since drunk driving is killing lots of folks. hmm..what else can we do...oh, i know...mandatory helment/seatbelt laws, regardless of age or discretion. must be full faced, no matter what type of riding you do. ohh..and, madatory, full race leathers, for all types of bikes, cuz you know, it protects better.  get my point yet? 

what's wrong with that ? there are laws in -some- states against driving distracted, but they have no teeth. there are no fines, and the cops patrolling don't enforce them. i've personally seen people slam into others, and never stop the call they're taking. even after the police arrive, they're still taking taht same call. dumb.

Quote from: sledge on March 03, 2009, 12:30:35 AM
Is the use of mobiles while driving not illegal over there?.......get caught and its an on the spot fine and a few points here........do something really dangerous and you will end up doing time.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7153070.stm

sledge - no, sorry. we have so much to learn over here. our ignorance is astounding, incompetence 'excused' away, and arrogance unrelenting. sledge, if/when people finally learn to take responsibility for their actions, i'll be personally coloring myself amazed. there are soooo many typical collisions typical of this scenario, you really would be amazed. and no personal accountability. none.

Quote from: GeeP on March 02, 2009, 05:27:59 PM
What kind of response did you expect from a motorcycle board?

Being "high and mighty" has nothing to do with it.  Collectively, we get merged into, cut off, tailgated, left-turned and otherwise have our right-of-way violated every day by inattentive people on cell phones.  We pay the highest cost for traffic crashes.  Therefore, we tend to be the most sensitive to the mishandling of vehicles.

The fact of the matter is, if she had not been talking on her phone and had not been tailgating, there would have been no crash.  Being pre-occupied with other tasks not related to driving while not keeping adequate following distance is NOT an excuse to rear-end another vehicle.  That's not an opinion, but a pure fact, and it is the important lesson to take away from the situation. 

In aviation, there is no such thing as an "accident".  They are all "crashes" and they are all investigated by the NTSB and FAA.  Blame is always assigned as a matter of principle, ensuring future safety of the air transportation system and public acceptance of it as a safe method of travel.  We do not explain away any error as a mere "accident".  To do so is to undermine the continued safety of the system.  To explain it away is to provide the groundwork for it to happen again.

Ohgood and I have nothing against you and your fiance.  What we take issue with is the casual "oh well, nobody was hurt" attitude you're displaying.  That attitude is not conducive to safety.

well said. didn't come off as a rant, as i usually fall into.

listen, i'm very glad your fiance is safe and sound. very much so, i'd not wish any harm on her, you, or anyone from a collision. that's just not right. sure, i'd like to vaporize the typical suv driver munching on hot-steaming-fries while texting on his/her cellular, but no, i'm not wishing any harm.

accountability, fines, and real understanding that there are no accidents. there are failures to pay attention, failures to care, and failures to yield. motorcyclists pay the highest price (along with cyclists, pedestrians, and people sitting on park benches) when people in cars don't pay attention.

we have an understanding in my household that no one covered under our insurance is to jabber on a cellphone while -attempting- to drive one of our cars. at first it was considered "you're just a jerk! get with the 00's already !" but then there were enough instances of near misses involving cell phones that people agreed. i still have yet to get extended family members to agree, but they've suffered the effects of rear-ending other drivers, and STILL not admitted fault. yes, they've hit other cars simple becausee of dialing a cellular phone, and refused to let go of the phone. it's a real shame.

driving is such a simple process. we have clear, clean roads, nice reflective painted lines, and TWO traffic lights for each single lane at intersections, but people still crash at them. insurance rates are rediculous, agreed. part of the reason why is because of un needed claims. a tiny bump in a parking lot can cost thousands to fix. a collision on a roadway can total both parties cars, and put an un needed hardship on a family. so much senseless waste.

ok, now i'm getting into a typical rant, so i'll stop. if you can't see the point, i'm sorry, i've failed. please watch out for motorcyclists.

I 100% agree with GeeP and Ohgood.

Tell her to hang it up.  Too many cagers are on their cell phones while driving.  I've been in MANY close calls because of these idiots.

Wow, amazing. Guess my story of rearending someone while not on a cell phone got left out. Christ people accidents happen and I bet if your cell rings in your car and it's important you pick it up. Just drop the high and mighty krap. I doubt any of you can claim you have never ever been distracted. If you say that you always keep your hands at 10 and 2 (which have changed) don't ever listen to the radio, never have important issues on your mind, or see a nice car pull up beside you that takes your mind off the task at hand I will call you a liar. Or maybe you're the one going twenty below the speed limit pissing everybody off in the left lane!  It happens to all of us. And no the person not at fault doesn't always get the raw end of the deal. Nothing happened to his massive truck(he didn't even have a good reason as to why he slammed the brakes on at a green deep down I almost think he did it on purpose cause he laughed at me!) my car was totaled, the insurance didn't cover the ICD part. I'm still paying for it every single month. Even though I took the course I found out after the fact that it would not save me from higher insurance rates because there was an injury! So, I have to double pay for my own injury! Nobody knows both sides of the story.

I get mad at irresponsible drivers but many times I sit back and say hey I've probably been guilty of the same infraction at some point in my life. I've noticed though that since I've become a motorcyclist I've become an even more responsible driver. I'v been in six incidents seven if you count me dropping the bike on my ankle. Only one was my fault I owned up to it. Even though I was following at the recommended distance, going well below speed limit. I just didnt have money for anti-lock brakes and didn't know how bad the effects of hydroplaning on Floridablack Ice. You know what sucks more about that incident I had done a good deed by dropping a person off at their home because it was raining. I guess no good deed goes unpunished.

I just get so tired when something bad happens to someone there is no empathy. First words out drop the F'n phone. As if one has never been distracted while driving. Sorry, 102 fever.

By the way I find GPS owners to be way more distracted then even those on phones. Don't know how many times I've been cut off by owners of such devices. You can tell cause at certain spots around here you can almost tell the voice says turn and they turn who cares if there is someone already in the lane!

Honestly, I think the wheel should be taken away from us and explore technologies where we don't drive. Kinda like in IRobot. That way vehicles can go much faster and you can do whatever you damn well please!

Mary

well said mary, that was the point i was trying to make as well. 



p.s.- get well, fevers suck. especially fever dreams....      

Mary,

Thank you, maybe my cussing at them wasn't the best way to get my point across but I was tired of reading it.  You said it well, and I'm done discussing that portion of this thread.

On a different note, found out that there is only $3,714 worth of damage so no where near as bad as I originally thought.  They said should take about 2 weeks and we should have the car back.  Thank you to all those who expressed their sympathies.

Thanks,

Nick

Quote from: Toogoofy317 on March 03, 2009, 08:35:11 PM
Wow, amazing. Guess my story of rearending someone while not on a cell phone got left out. Christ people accidents happen and I bet if your cell rings in your car and it's important you pick it up. Just drop the high and mighty krap. I doubt any of you can claim you have never ever been distracted. If you say that you always keep your hands at 10 and 2 (which have changed) don't ever listen to the radio, never have important issues on your mind, or see a nice car pull up beside you that takes your mind off the task at hand I will call you a liar. Or maybe you're the one going twenty below the speed limit pissing everybody off in the left lane!  It happens to all of us. And no the person not at fault doesn't always get the raw end of the deal. Nothing happened to his massive truck(he didn't even have a good reason as to why he slammed the brakes on at a green deep down I almost think he did it on purpose cause he laughed at me!) my car was totaled, the insurance didn't cover the ICD part. I'm still paying for it every single month. Even though I took the course I found out after the fact that it would not save me from higher insurance rates because there was an injury! So, I have to double pay for my own injury! Nobody knows both sides of the story.

I get mad at irresponsible drivers but many times I sit back and say hey I've probably been guilty of the same infraction at some point in my life. I've noticed though that since I've become a motorcyclist I've become an even more responsible driver. I'v been in six incidents seven if you count me dropping the bike on my ankle. Only one was my fault I owned up to it. Even though I was following at the recommended distance, going well below speed limit. I just didnt have money for anti-lock brakes and didn't know how bad the effects of hydroplaning on Floridablack Ice. You know what sucks more about that incident I had done a good deed by dropping a person off at their home because it was raining. I guess no good deed goes unpunished.

I just get so tired when something bad happens to someone there is no empathy. First words out drop the F'n phone. As if one has never been distracted while driving. Sorry, 102 fever.

By the way I find GPS owners to be way more distracted then even those on phones. Don't know how many times I've been cut off by owners of such devices. You can tell cause at certain spots around here you can almost tell the voice says turn and they turn who cares if there is someone already in the lane!

Honestly, I think the wheel should be taken away from us and explore technologies where we don't drive. Kinda like in IRobot. That way vehicles can go much faster and you can do whatever you damn well please!

Mary

^ yep mary, i want my flying car, like yesterday.

but since flying cars will never happen, i'd prefer a high speed rail so i can take a 2 hour nap and wake up in New York to spend the afternoon with grandpa. or fall asleep drunk at midnight and wake up in willits, ca for a hot organic breakfast.

remember, it's a motorcycle forum, so empathy for distracted drivers is going to be few and far between. differences in opinion are a good thing. it'd be awefully boring if we all agreed, all the time.

Quote from: Toogoofy317 on March 03, 2009, 08:35:11 PM
...Christ people accidents happen and I bet if your cell rings in your car and it's important you pick it up. Just drop the high and mighty krap. I doubt any of you can claim you have never ever been distracted. If you say that you always keep your hands at 10 and 2 (which have changed) don't ever listen to the radio, never have important issues on your mind, or see a nice car pull up beside you that takes your mind off the task at hand I will call you a liar..

I don't argue the point you make.  However, there's no disputing that if I were to get in an accident in the above situation...I WOULD BE AT FAULT, WRONG, AND THE BAD DRIVER IN THE STORY.  I've been the bad driver in the story.  When I was in high school (many years ago) I wrecked into a guardrail going too fast on wet roads trying to get home to call my girlfriend.  I hit a bridge support watching the car behind me (that was following to closely) in my rearview mirror.  And, I got hit when I failed to yield the right of way to a car because I was distracted by friends in my car.  I could blame the first accident on the roads or antilock brakes...but it was MY FAULT.  I could blame the second on the person behind me tailgating...but it was MY FAULT.   I could blame the last on my friends for distracting me / blocking my view...but it was MY FAULT.  I accept the blame, and I expect no sympathy because I am angry with myself every time I find myself in those types of situations.

The fact is, I was lucky, Mary was lucky, and utgunslinger's gf was lucky.  Lucky that they didn't get hurt, and that it was only sheetmetal that got damaged and money that was lost.  If it was me and my bike that made that rather large dent on the above car, I don't think anyone would feel as fortunate.

Finally, the last three accidents I've had have not been my fault.  I was sideswiped from behind, had a near head-on with a driver that 'didn't see me' when she turned left across my lane and got hit at 35mph (luckily we were in a car, but it still took my wife 6 mos. of physical therapy to recover), and the last time I was rearended by a driver doing all of 40mph that slammed into me while I was stopped at a red light.  My daughter was in the van (thank God for modern child seats/restraints), and the 2001 Town and Country was totalled.  I didn't hit the car in front of me because I left the proper distance between us when I stopped.  I've changed my driving habits because of my experiences:  When in traffic; I don't answer my phone if I have to look at it.  I don't make calls with my phone.  I never text in my car...period.  I don't adjust my stereo if I have to look at it.  I don't look at my daughter when she is saying 'daddy, daddy, daddy!', because I know the consequences of these actions.

I guess it can be summed up in this cliche:  A wise man learns from his mistakes, but a wiser man learns from the mistakes of others. 

I am only a wise man trying to encourage others to be wiser than me.

Quote from: ohgood on March 04, 2009, 05:24:30 AM
^ yep mary, i want my flying car, like yesterday.

but since flying cars will never happen, i'd prefer a high speed rail so i can take a 2 hour nap and wake up in New York to spend the afternoon with grandpa. or fall asleep drunk at midnight and wake up in willits, ca for a hot organic breakfast.

remember, it's a motorcycle forum, so empathy for distracted drivers is going to be few and far between. differences in opinion are a good thing. it'd be awefully boring if we all agreed, all the time.

+1

Quote from: oramac on March 04, 2009, 06:29:46 AM
I don't argue the point you make.  However, there's no disputing that if I were to get in an accident in the above situation...I WOULD BE AT FAULT, WRONG, AND THE BAD DRIVER IN THE STORY.  I've been the bad driver in the story.  When I was in high school (many years ago) I wrecked into a guardrail going too fast on wet roads trying to get home to call my girlfriend.  I hit a bridge support watching the car behind me (that was following to closely) in my rearview mirror.  And, I got hit when I failed to yield the right of way to a car because I was distracted by friends in my car.  I could blame the first accident on the roads or antilock brakes...but it was MY FAULT.  I could blame the second on the person behind me tailgating...but it was MY FAULT.   I could blame the last on my friends for distracting me / blocking my view...but it was MY FAULT.  I accept the blame, and I expect no sympathy because I am angry with myself every time I find myself in those types of situations.

The fact is, I was lucky, Mary was lucky, and utgunslinger's gf was lucky.  Lucky that they didn't get hurt, and that it was only sheetmetal that got damaged and money that was lost.  If it was me and my bike that made that rather large dent on the above car, I don't think anyone would feel as fortunate.

Finally, the last three accidents I've had have not been my fault.  I was sideswiped from behind, had a near head-on with a driver that 'didn't see me' when she turned left across my lane and got hit at 35mph (luckily we were in a car, but it still took my wife 6 mos. of physical therapy to recover), and the last time I was rearended by a driver doing all of 40mph that slammed into me while I was stopped at a red light.  My daughter was in the van (thank God for modern child seats/restraints), and the 2001 Town and Country was totalled.  I didn't hit the car in front of me because I left the proper distance between us when I stopped.  I've changed my driving habits because of my experiences:  When in traffic; I don't answer my phone if I have to look at it.  I don't make calls with my phone.  I never text in my car...period.  I don't adjust my stereo if I have to look at it.  I don't look at my daughter when she is saying 'daddy, daddy, daddy!', because I know the consequences of these actions.

I guess it can be summed up in this cliche:  A wise man learns from his mistakes, but a wiser man learns from the mistakes of others. 

I am only a wise man trying to encourage others to be wiser than me.

+1 to EVERYTHING! Utgun's gf may not have been the INITIAL cause of the entire accident, but she also didn't contribute to the PREVENTION of the accident.

I've been rear ended before...  the kid was trying to beat the red light WHILE I was still in front.  So you COULD say that the traffic light was a distraction.  The argument that cell phones aren't a bigger distraction than the radio or other passengers is total BS.

I've gotta get ready for work, so I'm cutting this post short.  I've got SOOOO much on my mind about this topic.

PS.  I was rear-ended while on a BIKE.  NOT FUN.

PSS.  Mary - not to start an e-argument, but you accuse some of us as acting all "high and mighty"...  What about you?  You're sitting at your keyboard typing a lecture to us.  I think you are just as guilty as 'us' for acting "high and mighty".