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Starting my GS is a painful undertaking..... Opinions ?

Started by birdman561, August 14, 2009, 04:41:07 PM

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birdman561

My bike sits outside in Florida, covered of course, but its very dry and is about 95 in the day
and 77 or so at nite, so cold isnt an issue.
Any Florida or hot weather ppl...How long does it take you to start your bike ?
My bike spins and spin so much I think the starter is going to seize  :icon_sad:
Im trying different ways an so far, blipping the gas once before starting, then rolling
the throttle about 2mm while cranking the starter seems to lessen it a little.
Does it take you about a minute to get started ? My choke seems strange too...
my other suzook had a long throw on the lever, like an inch or so, the GS's is
only ablut 1/4 of and inch. Seems kind of short. I know the previous owner
had a bike shop go over it before it was soled to me and Im wondering if the
cable didnt get goofed up during the go-over ?
This starting stuff just seems too long of a process to me. The longest of any
bike IVe ever had.


1996 GS500e, Black w/Corbin flame seat.

rockyrunner99

I am in Phoenix, ungodly, hellish freaking hot, like a nuke went of 10 feet away I am on fire hot, and my bike starts right up.

NF11624

Well... as far as your starter spinning around and around... I ran into this problem last week.  I could bump start it, but the generator(?) function of the engine was out (battery wasn't charging), and otherwise the starter just spun.  I found that the bolt holding the starter clutch had become loose.  Takes about an hour and $19.00 to fix if this is indeed the problem.  Now my bike starts up straight away - just like it did when it was new.  Of course choke is still necessary for at least 30 seconds (often more if the temp is below 85).

I'll include the fix for posterity, even if it is of no use to you.

  • Buy a gasket (~$9) for the left crank case cover.
  • Buy a gallon of your favorite oil ($10.00 probably).
  • Drain the oil out.
  • Remove the sprocket cover.
  • Remove the left crank cover.
  • Remove the bolt (if loose) and starter (sprag) clutch, and check the springs in the back.  These things are easy to jar loose, but are also fairly easy to fit back into place.
  • Reassemble everything carefully.  Put something in the gears (between the gear on the bolt and the starter gear) to prevent the gears from just spinning around - I used a penny.  Place some loctite on the bolt, and tighten as much as possible.  I tightened until there was a hole in the penny from where the gears meshed (the penny was also bent pretty good).  Remove whatever you put in the gears and replace the gasket.
  • Optional: Epoxy the magnets in the starter to prevent future issues.
  • Reassemble crank case cover and sprocket cover and fill with oil.  At this point you can proceed with a full oil change if you like (add ~$4 for the filter if you replace it).

I believe that all of the bolts for the various covers are 8mm, and the internal bolt (if I recall correctly) is 18mm.  A lot of the info that helped me figure out what to do was from here.

I hope this helps, but if not then best of luck.  I had terrible mechanical skills (still do probably), but this turned out to be a great learning experience and is relatively easy to do, in case you don't have a lot of experience.  If you do this should be cake.
.95 Sonic Springs, Katana 600 rear shock

PachmanP

Check your choke cable before trying NF11624's project!  (start with the easy stuff although NF11624 should toss that little blurb on the wiki or something cause it'd be good to save :) )

The choke should move like 60 degrees around the handle bar.  Maybe 1.5 inches of travel on the top of the lever.  Certainly not 1/4 inch. 

After just looking at the cable for something that might be binding, pull the tank and airbox and see if the cable is sticking or if the thing on the carb is preventing the motion and work from there.
'04 F to an E to a wreck to a Wee Strom?
HEL stainless brake lines
15W fork oil
Kat 600 Rear shock
K&N drop in and Buddha jets
It wants me to go brokedie.

birdman561

Great stuff, you guys !!!
Much thanks !  :thumb:
Im going to get wrenching in the morning......
This bike will be used as my commuter and I cant risk having starting issues
in a parking lot in West Palm at 9:00 at nite  :icon_eek:  :icon_eek:
Im sure the person who sold it to me had it sarted and well warmed up
before I test rode it, cuz it started right up and didnt bog off the line....
IT runs good otherwise, but starting it is a painful process ! :dunno_white:

Again, thank you very much for taking the time to post this great info !!!  :thumb:


1996 GS500e, Black w/Corbin flame seat.

NF11624

No problem - but I would definitely take a look at the choke and cables first, especially if it does start eventually.  My bike was not starting at all unless it was bump/push started, and eventually the battery went completely dead from the complete lack of charging/electrical output from the engine (No gauge lights/headlights etc...).  Luckily this happened at the end of my driveway as I was coming home but it was scary to think about this happening out on the road.  The battery was fine after placing it on the tender for a few hours, and everything runs smoothly now.

Best of luck.
.95 Sonic Springs, Katana 600 rear shock

DoD#i

If it starts right up when warm, but not when cold, the choke not operating correctly is your major suspect.

And 1/4 inch of movement is certainly not nearly correct, so that also says choke.

Take off the seat, take off the tank (remembering to shut off the tank petcock first so you don't spray gas all over) so you can see the top of the carbs where the cable connects, and figure out what's not moving in your choke system. COuld be a bad cable, could simply be badly adjusted. The lever moves a long way around the bar if properly adjusted - I'd say closer to 90 degrees off the top of my head, but 60 degrees might be right. ~2 inches if looking at the end of the lever.
1990 GS500EL - with moderately-ugly paintjob.
1982 XJ650LJ -  off the road for slow repairs
AGATT - All Gear All The Time
"Ride a motorcycle.  Save Gas, Oil, Rubber, Steel, Aluminum, Parking Spaces, The Environment, and Money.  Plus, you get to wear all the leather you want!"
(from DoD#296)

Toogoofy317

Flick takes a bit to start up about 90 seconds to run effectively without dying then I run it with a wee bit of choke on through the apartment complex by the time I get out to the road he is good to go.

Now take this into consideration I just had to replace my battery too. See dealership thread for that story!

Mary
2004 F, Fenderectomy, barends, gsxr-pegs, pro grip gel covers, 15th JT sprocket, stock decals gone,custom chain guard,GSXR integrated mirrors, flush mount signals, 150 rear tire,white rims, rebuilt top end, V&H Exhaust, Custom heel and chain guard (Adidasguy)

birdman561

Heres an update.......

Something in the cable is LOCKED up.
I can move the choke assembly on the carb, but the cable is locked
somewhere after the bar/horn/indicator/ choke unit but before the
carb. I got into it by propping up the back of the tank but then the
tops of the gas hoses started to leak....YIKES !!!!! I had to jury-rig
it to get it to stop leaking as it started to rain. So. I'll have to
look into further tomorrow or monday. Very frustrating  >:(


1996 GS500e, Black w/Corbin flame seat.

Toogoofy317

Thought you said it was dry down there! I've never known Florida to be dry except Dec-March :whisper:

Maybe a new choke cable :dunno_white: I've heard they are not that expensive.

Mary
2004 F, Fenderectomy, barends, gsxr-pegs, pro grip gel covers, 15th JT sprocket, stock decals gone,custom chain guard,GSXR integrated mirrors, flush mount signals, 150 rear tire,white rims, rebuilt top end, V&H Exhaust, Custom heel and chain guard (Adidasguy)

birdman561

Thats why its raining Mary, cuz I said it was always dry !

You know how that works !!! :cheers:

I just heard on the new our first biggie might roll through this week  :o


1996 GS500e, Black w/Corbin flame seat.

jeremy_nash

www.ronayers.com has the cable listed for $17.38  plus shipping.  bikebandit is about $5 more.  ronayers part number is  58410-01D10
gsxr shock
katana FE
99 katana front rim swap
vapor gauge cluster
14 tooth sprocket
95 on an 89 frame
lunchbox
V&H ssr2 muffler
jetted carbs
150-70-17 pilot road rear
120-70-17 sportmax front
sv650 rear wheel
sv650 tail swap
gsxr pegs
GP shift

jeremy_nash

gsxr shock
katana FE
99 katana front rim swap
vapor gauge cluster
14 tooth sprocket
95 on an 89 frame
lunchbox
V&H ssr2 muffler
jetted carbs
150-70-17 pilot road rear
120-70-17 sportmax front
sv650 rear wheel
sv650 tail swap
gsxr pegs
GP shift

DoD#i

Likely won't cost anymore (add tax, subtract shipping) at the dealer, and it will be in your hands (and hopefully on your bike) a lot faster.

Use a long screwdriver and shut off the tank petcock so you don't have to frig about with half-measures - it makes getting in there 100 times easier.
1990 GS500EL - with moderately-ugly paintjob.
1982 XJ650LJ -  off the road for slow repairs
AGATT - All Gear All The Time
"Ride a motorcycle.  Save Gas, Oil, Rubber, Steel, Aluminum, Parking Spaces, The Environment, and Money.  Plus, you get to wear all the leather you want!"
(from DoD#296)

birdman561

That might be the part I dont understand....I see  two tubes coming off of the tank that flow to the On/Res/ petcock on the
side of the bike but is there a screw on the backside of  that attached to the bottom of the tank that shuts off the fuel ?
Its sort of hard to make out what it is other than a block with two brass tubes coming off of it. I can see a black zip-tie
which would lead me to believe the tank has been off before. I cant imagine a zip-tie being OEM.

If I get the tank off I want to replace the fuel lines too. The seem a little torn and frayed.


Again, thanks for help !
What a great page ! :icon_mrgreen:


1996 GS500e, Black w/Corbin flame seat.

BaltimoreGS

The part with the 2 hoses coming off on the back of the tank is the tanks petcock.  There is a slotted piece on the back that turns the fuel off.  Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but if the slot is facing down it is on and if it is horizontal it is off (I think...).  Consider adding a small inline fuel filter if you redo the lines to prevent future headaches.  Good luck!

-Jessie

DoD#i

Grab about 5 feet (4 if you are not doing the upper tee vent - 8-9 if you are doing the water drain) of fuel hose - 5/16 thick-wall polyurethane works for me, though I think the water drain may be 1/4. The water drain is the black hose you see in the petcock picture, and leads down to the right footpeg area - takes any rainwater or fuel overfill (but you're not that sloppy filling your tank, are you?) away from the filler neck area.

http://www.gstwin.com/fuel_hose_routing.htm

If you also grab 2 feet of 1/8 inch and own a gas can, you can easily drain all the fuel (that will leave voluntarily) from the carb drains (set frame to PRI) into a gas can if you can't get anything else to work. Certainly helps (I had to do this when I first took my tank off because someone put the tank petcock on backwards, and generally messed up all the hoses.)

Finally found a picture for the tank petcock from one of Kerry's posts:



Turn slot 90 degrees to turn off.

Here's a post on the choke cable replacement (no pics)
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=14280.0

And one with a pic:
http://gstwins.com/gsboard/index.php?topic=8976.0
1990 GS500EL - with moderately-ugly paintjob.
1982 XJ650LJ -  off the road for slow repairs
AGATT - All Gear All The Time
"Ride a motorcycle.  Save Gas, Oil, Rubber, Steel, Aluminum, Parking Spaces, The Environment, and Money.  Plus, you get to wear all the leather you want!"
(from DoD#296)

The Buddha

Amazing shot from kerry and werase and average's jaws hit the floor when I opened that the other day without taking anythign off.
Cool.
Buddha.
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