I ride every saturday with a bunch of sportbike riders.  I do a descent enough job of keeping up on my GS but I am concerned with exactly how much I can lean the bike before i start losing traction with the tires.  Can anyone provide some input or better yet, some pictures?

Greater than 47 degrees (this I know).  Probably 50.

Hokierower... hokie! Do you go to Tech?!

Yea, graduated this May.  Missing VT football something terrible.

I've leaned to the pegs hit... startling... felt like it would go more. I hang my toe off a little now to warn me before the peg drags...

Like any bike, a GS will lean over until it falls over.


Its going to depend on your tyres, the road surface, the camber, how much you hang off the seat, your grandma's shoe size.....etc etc.
How long is a piece of string?

^^    +1 to that


I look at it this way the GS will go over as far as your comfortable with, I haven't scrapped the pegs yet on mine but pretty sure I have gotten close (at least going left around one of the curves I take every day ....)  but alot depends on tire and road conditions, there are other factors of course as the mole point out. 

Personally, I don't like going over any further than when my boot scrapes as seen when sitting on the bike normally. Of course, if I have my toes on the pegs then... well... how far over I go is anyone's guess. Not to the new boot position, but further than normal. See. Accurate as.

Just ride to a lean you feel comfortable with. And any Lean Preference for a certain side - left lean or right lean - will diminish over time.

Michael

I guess the reason I ask is that I've gone around corners and my boot/peg has scraped and everything has been solid, but I've gone around others where my front end gets squirrely and the back seems to slide out.

I guess that's more road condition than anything but I'd rather not find out by low-siding the bike.

It will go at least that far.

(Notice: Above motorcycle is not on stock suspension, or tires. Professional rider, closed circuit. Please do not attempt to reproduce.)

Seriously... You are the limitation, not the bike. Most crashes are caused by the rider exceeding their own abilities, rather than riders exceeding the limits of the bike.

It depends on what parts you don't want scratched from dragging. I usually stop when I can smell the oil on the ground.

I didn't get it as far as burning did, but I got her over pretty far. I wasn't hanging off at all and the pegs were scraping...I don't think you have anything to worry about because even after the far over leans there is almost always that little chicken strip.

Theroy is sometimes different than actual practice....

But in THEORY, a motorcycle with "standard" tires on "standard" asphault could take a side load of .7 g.


This works out to only about 35 degrees off vertical.........( 1 g downward, and .7g sideward....inverse TAN (1/.7)

But.....the angle of the centerline of the bike is different than the actual angle of the center of gravity to the edge of the tire......(we ride on the SIDE of the tire during lean in the turn)

This effect will give a few more degrees of lean on the bike, and still keep under .7 g.........

Now it also depends on the tires.........some tires are capable of more than .7 g......

Racing tires are somtimes around 1.0 g and even 1.2 g........so more lean is possible with good tires...

Then there is the road surface coeficeint of friction..........an then there is non-level road........

Cookie

Quote from: the mole on October 07, 2010, 03:09:59 AM

your grandma's shoe size.....etc etc.
How long is a piece of string?

err.. twice its folded length aint it? 

Actually,

Typical street tires should be good for 1G lateral acceleration. Good racing tires are capable of upwards of 1.5G. I wouldn't trust those CoF calculations for anything.

Quote from: burning1 on October 08, 2010, 10:07:45 AM
Actually,

Typical street tires should be good for 1G lateral acceleration. Good racing tires are capable of upwards of 1.5G. I wouldn't trust those CoF calculations for anything.

1 g seems high to me, but I'll take your word for that...................

That would give a lean angle of 45 degrees from the machine's center of gravity to the contact spot of the tire (side wall)

So you figure the same for braking?  1G ?   That would give some pretty short stopping distances...........

I have seen some test results for cars.......for braking.....and the .7 number seems about average....Seems like really good street tires do better, and racing tires go over 1G............



Cookie

I recently put a fresh set of Bridgestone BT090s on stock rims on my GS and they feel like there's no traction limit, wet or dry, for street riding. The front tire chicken strip on the left side is like 1/2" wide, larger on the right side since there are no U turns to the right over here. The rear tire chicken strips are even smaller, 1/4" perhaps. They are way smaller than with the old tires. However I've never scraped the pegs. I recommend these BT090s, despite they (mine) use tubes, but can be found tubeless type. Before these tires I had a front Avon Viper, which seemed to be such a great tire, but the rear was just a Metzeler Z2 that didn't perform accordingly. Since asphalt coefficient of friction may vary from block to block the best bet is a good set of tires, and proper rider's gear.

Happy riding and peg scratching.

Quote from: TR on October 08, 2010, 05:45:54 PM
I recently put a fresh set of Bridgestone BT090s on stock rims on my GS and they feel like there's no traction limit, wet or dry, for street riding. The front tire chicken strip on the left side is like 1/2" wide, larger on the right side since there are no U turns to the right over here. The rear tire chicken strips are even smaller, 1/4" perhaps. They are way smaller than with the old tires. However I've never scraped the pegs. I recommend these BT090s, despite they (mine) use tubes, but can be found tubeless type. Before these tires I had a front Avon Viper, which seemed to be such a great tire, but the rear was just a Metzeler Z2 that didn't perform accordingly. Since asphalt coefficient of friction may vary from block to block the best bet is a good set of tires, and proper rider's gear.

Happy riding and peg scratching.

Tires are everything when it comes to performance!

Cookie

Quote from: twocool on October 08, 2010, 02:49:22 PM1 g seems high to me, but I'll take your word for that...................

That would give a lean angle of 45 degrees from the machine's center of gravity to the contact spot of the tire (side wall)

So you figure the same for braking?  1G ?   That would give some pretty short stopping distances...........

I have seen some test results for cars.......for braking.....and the .7 number seems about average....Seems like really good street tires do better, and racing tires go over 1G............



Cookie

Hi Cookie, yes, exactly... 45 degrees. Most bikes are capable of that, even on sport touring tires. That's with the rider on the centerline of the bike, obviously. The bike may lean more or less than 45 degrees at 1g, depending on the tire profile, CoG height, and the rider's body position.

Cars generate most of their grip from elastec restoration forces, the so-called slip-angle. Motorcycles make cornering force both from elastic restoration forces, and from camber thrust. In fact, camber thrust alone produces so much cornering force that at mild lean angles, many tires are actually running at a negative slip angle. Your typical motorcycle will out corner a car, despite what intuition would tell you about contact patch size.

Braking is limited more by the wheelbase of the bike and the CoG than it is by traction. There are some exceptions though: My GT is limited by tire traction. It'll also stop awfully fast; 1G is attainable.

Also keep in mind, that the traction circle is actually more of an oval than a circle. Moto tires create much more lateral cornering force than straightline force.