has anyone used one of these dry cell batteries
http://www.odysseybatteries.com/applications/motorcycles.htm

Quote from: manoj on January 13, 2011, 05:48:16 PM
has anyone used one of these dry cell batteries
http://www.odysseybatteries.com/applications/motorcycles.htm

Technically not a "dry cell" as we normally think...like the normal Eveready carbon type dry cell we used in toys as kids.  Or even alkeline batteries of today, which are "dry Cells".

The odyssey battery has glass mats in it....the electrolite is soaked into these mats.....this is nothing more than a fancy SLA battery....(sealed lead acid)..........

At about 2x the cost of a "normal" motorcycle battery, I am sceptical as to wheter it is worth it.   Is it a 2x better battery?

I've never has a problem with the batterys in my bikes, in my cars, or in my airplanes......sure they need replacement, but they function wonderfully. and last as expected.......I am not sure this fancy thechnology actually offers anything above the "regular" lead acid, and sealed lead acid batteries.

I call this a "solution without a problem"


Cookie

Quote from: Paulcet on January 13, 2011, 07:30:00 AM
Is there a wiring diagram for recent US models available? I believe the one in the wiki shows no such relay.

I've got wiring diagrams for 99 thru 09..........usa....they all show the headlight and tail light wired through the main starter relay....BUT this does not mean they are wired for the light to shut off during starting, just that the light wires go through the relay.

It also looks like this relay is different in about 04 or 05 onward ..........wired slightly differently..........

I have to look and see just how they diagramed this relay to figure out if it actually cuts the light or not......also will try my bike when I get to the shop today.......Maybe I just "thought" the headlight goes off during starting......It does on my tow hondas for sure, but now I am not sure about the GS 500.

Cookie

Quote from: twocool on January 14, 2011, 07:00:05 AM

Quote from: Paulcet on January 13, 2011, 07:30:00 AM
Is there a wiring diagram for recent US models available? I believe the one in the wiki shows no such relay.

I've got wiring diagrams for 99 thru 09..........usa....they all show the headlight and tail light wired through the main starter relay....BUT this does not mean they are wired for the light to shut off during starting, just that the light wires go through the relay.

It also looks like this relay is different in about 04 or 05 onward ..........wired slightly differently..........

I have to look and see just how they diagrammed this relay to figure out if it actually cuts the light or not......also will try my bike when I get to the shop today.......Maybe I just "thought" the headlight goes off during starting......It does on my two Hondas for sure, but now I am not sure about the GS 500.

Cookie

OK   Just checked out my GS 500 at the shop.....headlight goes out when starter button is pushed!   This is a 2009......

My 04 seems to do it too. But i just always thought it was from the current draw.

Quote from: GI_JO_NATHAN on January 14, 2011, 10:28:00 AM
My 04 seems to do it too. But i just always thought it was from the current draw.

Hmmmmm.......well on my GS the headlight goes off ......so if that was due to current draw.....it would be one heck of a lot of current.

For comparison, I just started my car with the headlights on.....they dim slightly when the starter is engaged, due to the draw of the starter, but not much...certainly they don't go out!


Cookie

Twocool:  You think you can scan the diagram and upload to the wiki?

Quote from: Paulcet on January 14, 2011, 06:11:57 PM
Twocool:  You think you can scan the diagram and upload to the wiki?

Well maybe...but a couple of problems....first, I am just about computer illiterate.......second, I think they are sort of touchy about uploading "copyrighted material".

They got pissed at me when I suggested a place on the internet where you can download the sevrice manual.

Finally, if you take the wiring diagram literally, the symbol for the starter solenoid only shows ONE magnet switch, the switch to the starter.  Bu tthen again, they only call it a "schematic".   Maybe I am interpreting it incorrectly.

Funny, I wire airplane avionics for a living......but our wiring diagrams are much more literal, and less schematic!!

Cookie

Ok.....had some time to sit down and study the wiring diagrams.........

So here's my story and I'm sticking with it.


It's not a solenoid, it's not a relay!!!!!

It's in the starter button!!!!!!!!!

For the '05 and earlier model....the start button is just that.....push the button and the starter engages (by way of one solenoid and one relay.  NOTHING to do with headlights..........headlights stay on during starting....


For the '06 and later models..........Different starter switch..........

They ran the headlight circuit THROUGH THE STARTER BUTTON!!!

So... the starter button has two positions......

1) starter button "not pushed"...the headlight circuit is closed....headlight is on when ignition key is "on"

2) starter button "pushed".....opens the headlight circuit.....and activates the solenoid and the starter relay and the starter..........headlight is now "off"


Once the engine starts, you release the button, and the headlight circuit is again closed...headlight "on"........

(also tail light)


Cookie

I  have 3 bikes in my garage and all three work like Cookie just described.  The other two are Hondas.  On one of the Honda boards, it is often recommended to push the start button BEFORE turning your key to the run position.

Unless there is something really new, AGM batteries are lead acid and can be treated as such.

There is a lot to be said for consistent use of a Battery Tender brand maintainer for lead acid batteries.  They really keep the battery "fresh".

The new LiFe (Lithium Ferrite) batteries are light and energy dense, but are crappy in cool to cold weather.
prs

Quote from: Pigeonroost on January 15, 2011, 09:46:20 AM
I  have 3 bikes in my garage and all three work like Cookie just described.  The other two are Hondas.  On one of the Honda boards, it is often recommended to push the start button BEFORE turning your key to the run position.

Unless there is something really new, AGM batteries are lead acid and can be treated as such.

There is a lot to be said for consistent use of a Battery Tender brand maintainer for lead acid batteries.  They really keep the battery "fresh".

The new LiFe (Lithium Ferrite) batteries are light and energy dense, but are crappy in cool to cold weather.
prs

Yes, my other two bikes also are Hondas, and the same deal with the starter switch.

Good idea to push the switch first, so you're not burning the headlight BEFORE starting.  If you have a good battery it shouldn't matter though.

But on the GS there is a clutch interlock switch.....so you would need three hands.....one to hold clutch....one to push starter button, and one to turn the key!  (my hondas, you only need to be in neutral to start...only have to hold clutch if you try to start in gear)

Yeah AGM is still a lead acid battery....only twice the cost...they do make some claims to some advantages, but I do not see these as advantages to motorcycle.........well they claim they have no gas venting....so no need for vent hose, and less chance for corrosion around battery box.....but an SLA battery would do the same for less cost.  They also claim more cranking power per battery size due to more pure lead in the plates...but my regular battery cranks fine!  They also claim deeper discharge possible (but I have heard conflict on that) but a motorcycle does not deep discharge.......so the advantages are not advantages, and the cost is a disadvantage.

I spent my extra $30 on a battery tender JR........use it on the motorcycle and I have lots of SLA batteries for other purposes....works good on all them too.

Cookie

Quote from: twocool on January 15, 2011, 03:09:56 PM
But on the GS there is a clutch interlock switch.....so you would need three hands.....one to hold clutch....one to push starter button, and one to turn the key! 
Cookie

That's too easy to bypass if you ever wanted to though. I'll never go back to having clutch switch connected.

Quote from: GI_JO_NATHAN on January 15, 2011, 04:39:20 PM

Quote from: twocool on January 15, 2011, 03:09:56 PM
But on the GS there is a clutch interlock switch.....so you would need three hands.....one to hold clutch....one to push starter button, and one to turn the key! 
Cookie

That's too easy to bypass if you ever wanted to though. I'll never go back to having clutch switch connected.

Well, that's a good point........I thought it was a little strange to have the clutch interlock when there is already a neutral interlock.......My hondas don't have both, just neutral interlock....


Then of course there's the side stand interlock.......'84 honda ..no   04 honda...yes


Cookie

Yeah i had to bypass mine when i ran an aftermarket clutch perch. I love it walk up, turn the key, if you see the green light, hit the starter button.

This might be helpful... http://www.12voltdistributors.com/capacitors/soundstream-scell300-300-16v-high-current-power-cell-p-23742.html

300A for 3 seconds is PLENTY to start the bike. I would wire it on a relay run from the starter switch though... to keep it from getting used up by accessories or something other than the starter. Search "capacitor battery" on ebay for more options. This should leave the main battery with its deeper discharge as a 2nd/backup.

http://www.porta-jump.com/
This work even when voltage drops below 12 takes about 3 min to surface charge the battery on my VS800..carry this in my backpack all the time

kml.krk,  hows the battery working out for you?  I haven't started mine for about 6 months.  Went to start it. Prime, choke, and crank.  It fired right up.  The trugel battery didn't seem to loose any kind of charge.

Battery is working fine BUT I had to send the first one to manufacturer.
It got bad after about a month or two of regular usage.
They exchanged it no problem though! I just had to pay one way shipping.

I finally man'ed up and went with a Scorpion AGM battery.$54US and free shipping.They're way better in winter and won't freeze like flooded lead acid batteries.

http://www.batterystuff.com/powersports-batteries/sYT10L-A2.html

my TruGEL battery was much better than stock in winter too, until it died...

it was starting beautifully in below freezing temperature after sitting for 8 hours outside.
then it died (failed load test) making me push start my bike in winter, which is not much fun if you have never done it before.
thanks to youtube videos however I managed to do it fairly easily 
The problem with push starting in winter is that oil gets really thick so it's quite hard to push the bike. I believe I had to push start it in 3rd gear.

I only weight 160lbs so that was a part of pushing issue LOL