*Dislaimer*
I don't intend to take advantage of this, as that'd just be wrong. If my conscience would allow it, though, it'd be a super sweet deal.

I bought my 2007* GS from a [rather sketchy] dealer here in town back in February. I checked it all out and figured that even though the shop was shady, the bike was sound. I got it for right at $2,800 OTD.  I was financing it through my credit union, so I gave him the check from them, and he filled out all the tag/title paperwork to send in to the state.

Saturday I get an envelope in the mail from the FL DHSMV. I open it up...and find the title to my bike.   Under "Registered Owner"...my name.   Under "Lien Holder"..."None".  

So at church yesterday, I asked a buddy who works in collections for another credit union. I told him what happened, and asked "So, does that mean I can tell Pen-Air to pound sand and there's nothing they can do to me?"  He said that yeah, he's seen it happen before.  It's a mistake...but it's legal.

This happened a couple of days after making my first payment...so I'm only $100 into this bike...and I fully and legally own it outright.  



*Dude at the shop didn't even know what it was.  He thought is was an '03...right up until he couldn't find registration info for it.  I had to explain to him that there's no such thing as an '03 F-model...and that I damn sure wouldn't have agreed to this price for an '03 anyway.  I guess, with being such an idiot up front, I shouldn't have been surprised that he effed-up the title paperwork. 

You're in florida aren't you ... OK not too far for me to make a drive down there to thump you ... if you dont tell them to take a hike.

Of course if it was a bank I'd thump you a lot harder. Credit union can be a relatively good organisation or a mom and pop shop, but OTOH it can be a front for a bank.

So, find out, and get ready for the thumping. Either way you need to walk away with the gs. They charge people 1000's to do "paperwork". Essentially they have charged people 1000's if not millions just this year alone to write up stuff just like your purchase agreement.

Cool.
Buddha.

So the shady dealership got a check for the bike from your credit union? I assume you had to take out a loan from the credit union to get the check right? Even though the bike has a free and clear title, are you not still on the hook for the loan you took out in the first place? Am I missing something?

As sweet as it sounds, you might be pissing off the wrong kinda people (financiers) since we are talking more than a couple bucks. Even if the title says "none" under lien holder, you know and they know you owe on it. In a way (morally atleast) it is stealing and wrongful possession if you keep the bike without paying off the correct amount.

Is it worth getting beat up or having someone mess up your home/possessions ? They can also do it without "proof".. don't forget.. they know where you live. 

The thing that would complicate it is that all my accounts are there. So, if I did that (I didn't go to the trouble of changing institutions), they may be able to just take the money from my accounts. I don't know the legalities there, though. Since the bike is the security on the loan, I don't know if they can go after other funds.

Like I said, I intend to keep making my payment (it's only about $85/month anyway)...right up until they do anything to piss me off. 

They dont have any right to touch you other $. At this point they dont have a right to repo it either.
The only thing they can do is to report your missed payments to credit, ironically they likely closed off the loan account. That was why you have the title with none as leinholder.
If you are hell bent on making payments and want to avoid a thumping then atleast wait till they send you a late payment notice or something like a reminder. That way atleast you know it will be applied to your loan's outstanding balance.

Cool.
Buddha.

I believe they could put a lien on it at any time. So someone at your credit union may be going though paperwork next month and say, "Hmm, we haven't gotten the title on that bike we paid for. I think I'll call DHSMV."

Quote from: Paulcet on March 28, 2011, 07:22:22 AM
I believe they could put a lien on it at any time. So someone at your credit union may be going though paperwork next month and say, "Hmm, we haven't gotten the title on that bike we paid for. I think I'll call DHSMV."

I dont think so. Atleast not without a court order. At this point its his free and clear. They may be able to ding his credit for missed payments on the bike, which I am nearly sure he can get a court to reverse that.
Calling the DMV wont do squat, I've called them many times and got nothing but dumb looks ...
Cool.
Buddha.

Change your address, phone number, accounts, keep an eye over your shoulder and start packing heat! 

Strange situation. Not like you got away with a 10k bike so who knows how everything will go down.

Quote from: Twism86 on March 28, 2011, 07:58:50 AM
Not like you got away with a 10k bike so who knows how everything will go down.

Hell, had I known this would happen, I'd have bought one of the supersports on the floor. 

You sure the credit union even holds titles? They might've given it to you as a personal loan for that amount of money. When I bought my last bike I got a loan through my credit union, they just gave me a check and I bought the bike with the cash. I still own the bike and have the title, but I owe the credit union money for a few more months. I'd say there's a good chance everything was done right, and the credit union just gave you a different kind of loan than you thought, and wrote the check to the dealership instead of to you. I think they usually only like to do vehicle loans and go through that hassle for things over $5k or so. Not paying would probably just destroy your credit(I know you said you were still gonna pay though).

This is the third bike I've financed through them, and they held the title on both of the previous ones (both of which were under $5k). 

Quote from: murf425 on March 28, 2011, 06:04:07 AM
*Dislaimer*
I don't intend to take advantage of this, as that'd just be wrong. If my conscience would allow it, though, it'd be a super sweet deal.

I bought my 2007* GS from a [rather sketchy] dealer here in town back in February. I checked it all out and figured that even though the shop was shady, the bike was sound. I got it for right at $2,800 OTD.  I was financing it through my credit union, so I gave him the check from them, and he filled out all the tag/title paperwork to send in to the state.

Saturday I get an envelope in the mail from the FL DHSMV. I open it up...and find the title to my bike.   Under "Registered Owner"...my name.   Under "Lien Holder"..."None".  

So at church yesterday, I asked a buddy who works in collections for another credit union. I told him what happened, and asked "So, does that mean I can tell Pen-Air to pound sand and there's nothing they can do to me?"  He said that yeah, he's seen it happen before.  It's a mistake...but it's legal.

This happened a couple of days after making my first payment...so I'm only $100 into this bike...and I fully and legally own it outright.  



*Dude at the shop didn't even know what it was.  He thought is was an '03...right up until he couldn't find registration info for it.  I had to explain to him that there's no such thing as an '03 F-model...and that I damn sure wouldn't have agreed to this price for an '03 anyway.  I guess, with being such an idiot up front, I shouldn't have been surprised that he effed-up the title paperwork. 

Dude....wake up.....read the fine print....I'm sure there is a "typo" clause in there....you're gonna loose this one if you try.  You wouldn't stand for one second in a court....and you'd loss more because you would need to hire a lawyer for $2000.

Cookie

There is a clause called E & OE = Errors and Omissions exempted. That however is limited to the contract they wrote and you signed. And if it is a standard contract they print 1000's of, I should say that E&OE crap will never stand up in court.

That brings up the next point, your title isn't mentioned or covered by that contract. In fact the contract and the payment book you have pretty much bind you to paying that amount month after month, or else they will report to your credit and take the bike for which they hold the title. So the only thing they can do is hit your credit.

Anything else they're going to have to take you to court. You dont need a lawyer, they do. The worst thing that can happen is that they get a lawyer pay him 5g and get the judge to issue a repo order against your $2500 GS. That is all. You part your GS and leave the frame and engine in your driveway, that's all they get. You put the bike in the garage, they need a search warrant to make you open the garage for them. And judges dont hand out either of those if they went in front of the judge and said "oops we forgot". If that was the case 99% of DUI's will have to be thrown out.

Seriously I'd wait for the first payment overdue/late notice to show before you did anything even if it is to send in the payment. And beyond that, nothing will happen to you or your bike. E&OE clause applies only to the pieces of paper you signed. If you didn't need the credit, I'd call their bluff and not send any more payments. There have been many a bill collector I have bashed into the ground cos I didn't need the credit history including one in Florida from an apartment I used to rent and had to break a lease.

Cool.
Buddha.

This all sounds complicated. I don't want you to get in trouble, so how about I just buy the bike off you and we'll call it a day. Write up a contract saying I'll pay you monthly, you give me the keys and title, and I'll start the payments next month   

Whether the CU made a mistake or not, or whether the dealer made a mistake or not, you, as the borrower, contracted with the CU. Honor your contracts whether you could weasel out of them or not. Integrity.

Just cause everyone does something doesn't mean it's right; just cause noone does something doesn't mean it's wrong.

Michael

Quote from: mister on March 28, 2011, 11:24:31 AM
Whether the CU made a mistake or not, or whether the dealer made a mistake or not, you, as the borrower, contracted with the CU. Honor your contracts whether you could weasel out of them or not. Integrity.

This post should end this thread.

I cannot believe anyone would be recommending he steal it like that! Holy cow!

I'm pretty surprised at the replies to

All in all it sounds like a line of credit loan which does not require any type of legal title or lien on the bike. It's just like opening a credit card and now you owe them the money. The only thing that will hurt is your credit if you stop making payments. They won't come after you for anything if you stop making payments. Just get ready for some smashing of your credit, and facing them whenever you do your banking there 

Quote from: The Buddha on March 28, 2011, 10:06:45 AM
There is a clause called E & OE = Errors and Omissions exempted. That however is limited to the contract they wrote and you signed. And if it is a standard contract they print 1000's of, I should say that E&OE crap will never stand up in court.

That brings up the next point, your title isn't mentioned or covered by that contract. In fact the contract and the payment book you have pretty much bind you to paying that amount month after month, or else they will report to your credit and take the bike for which they hold the title. So the only thing they can do is hit your credit.

Anything else they're going to have to take you to court. You dont need a lawyer, they do. The worst thing that can happen is that they get a lawyer pay him 5g and get the judge to issue a repo order against your $2500 GS. That is all. You part your GS and leave the frame and engine in your driveway, that's all they get. You put the bike in the garage, they need a search warrant to make you open the garage for them. And judges dont hand out either of those if they went in front of the judge and said "oops we forgot". If that was the case 99% of DUI's will have to be thrown out.

Seriously I'd wait for the first payment overdue/late notice to show before you did anything even if it is to send in the payment. And beyond that, nothing will happen to you or your bike. E&OE clause applies only to the pieces of paper you signed. If you didn't need the credit, I'd call their bluff and not send any more payments. There have been many a bill collector I have bashed into the ground cos I didn't need the credit history including one in Florida from an apartment I used to rent and had to break a lease.

Cool.
Buddha.

Blah blah blah.....IT IS DISHONEST!  Now we know what kind of person you are......but even if you are dishonest, you're not getting away with it....let us know what happens...........It will be fun to see you on that "repo" TV show with all the fat dudes, and dudettes!   


Cookie