Hello again.  Well I have the same problem after replacing everything I can think of to fix the problem.  My bike only wants to charge around 12.2.  New Battery, New Regulator/Rectifier, New Stator.  New fuse near the solenoid.  I have done the following tests. 

Stator
Continuity- The three yellow wires coming from the stator with engine off all read 0.6 ohms in any configuration
Isolation-Running from all three yellow wires to the case of the motorcyle I got readings of 0.0 in all possible configurations. 
AC output- All three configurations 75 Volts

Regulatior Rectifier
Positive Swing Diode Check- Red Lead to red RR output.  All 3 OL
Forward Bias Check- Black Lead to Red RR Output. All 3 tests read .476
Negative Swing Diode Check- Black lead to black/white RR output.  All 3 tests read OL
Forward Bias Check- Red Lead to black/white RR output.  All 3 tests read .493

According to my Electrex Usa gs500e charging circuit test this states that all my new parts are working as they should.  http://www.bbburma.net/Documents/JohnBates_ChargingCircuitTests3.pdf I also have followed every positive connection on the bike and cleaned it.  I am looking for direct suggestions.  PLEASE DO NOT tell me to search the forum or get the manual.  I know this, the manual is ordered and I search the forum all the time. 

Quote from: Bmarc on February 13, 2012, 01:36:12 PM
Hello again.  Well I have the same problem after replacing everything I can think of to fix the problem.  My bike only wants to charge around 12.2.  New Battery, New Regulator/Rectifier, New Stator.  New fuse near the solenoid.  I have done the following tests. 

Stator
Continuity- The three yellow wires coming from the stator with engine off all read 0.6 ohms in any configuration
Isolation-Running from all three yellow wires to the case of the motorcyle I got readings of 0.0 in all possible configurations. 
AC output- All three configurations 75 Volts

Regulatior Rectifier
Positive Swing Diode Check- Red Lead to red RR output.  All 3 OL
Forward Bias Check- Black Lead to Red RR Output. All 3 tests read .476
Negative Swing Diode Check- Black lead to black/white RR output.  All 3 tests read OL
Forward Bias Check- Red Lead to black/white RR output.  All 3 tests read .493

According to my Electrex Usa gs500e charging circuit test this states that all my new parts are working as they should.  http://www.bbburma.net/Documents/JohnBates_ChargingCircuitTests3.pdf I also have followed every positive connection on the bike and cleaned it.  I am looking for direct suggestions.  PLEASE DO NOT tell me to search the forum or get the manual.  I know this, the manual is ordered and I search the forum all the time.

How old is the battery and how does your electrolyte level look?
What RPM are you checking output voltage? It is 13.5-15.5 at 5000 rpm and this only occurs when the battery if fully charged.
Do you have a battery charger/maintainer? If so throw it on for a few hours til it is topped off then check the output voltage at 5000 rpm

Don't check continuity to the case (not sure what you mean case but i am going to assume frame)... Check it to a direct ground point.
Where did you check the generator at.. Did you check it at the disconnects behind the left fairing or at the connections to the regulator behind the right fairing? IF you checked at the disconnects at the left fairing i would go back and do it at the regulator connection. It turns out that on my old GS500E it burnt the disconnects badly enough that it caused intermittent conductivity issues. I did continuity checks over the wires to look for any burned out/breaks from the generator to the regulator and then replaced all the disconnects and never had another conductivity issue.


As for the regulator/rectifier check.. You may want to reference them to the proper labels... B/W, R, Y1, Y2, Y3. Your values are strongly off anyway if you are checking them at 1 ohm.

They should read around 6 ohms on Positive R to Negative Everything except positive R to negative B/W... that is around 40 ohms according to the manual... positive B/W to negative everything should be Infinite and all Y to Y should be infinite along with Negative R to everything should be infinite.


Edit:
OK who wrote that document that you linked to?!?!?!?!? I wouldn't use the stuff in there... Why would you ever use voltage to check the regulator/rectifier? It is a basically a giant Diode with capacitors and transistors... I guess if you are running the stator on the yellow and checking the output then you would use voltage, but that isn't a smart idea... You want to make sure the resistance inside the regulator is proper which is why you do a no-load resistance check on it.

Note: Those resistance numbers may be off dependent on the calibration and model ohm meter you are using... Suzuki wrote it to their testers...

Checking a variety of stators in my parts box, resistance between any 2 wires is around 0.6 ohms. In 1989, they probably wrote the specs for analog meters. Not easy to measure 0.6 ohms on an analog meter, so zero is a good compromise.

Resistance inside a voltage regulator (more than a diode and capacitors) I would not put any faith in. As semiconductor technology changes, I'm sure the internals of it now are not exactly the same as in 1989.

If the voltage goes up when bike is running, then you are trying to charge. What happens to the voltage after going for a ride for 5 or 10 minutes? Did it go any higher?

What is the voltage on the battery with bike off? What is the voltage if you check it an hour later?

My first guess is a defective battery. Maybe it is the wrong type - say with drain on the left and it drains acid out when on the side stand? I've seen that on a bike I bought for parts.

My first bet is a bad battery.

Do you have your old battery and regulator? You can swap them back in one at a time and see what happens.

What prompted yu to change out everything? Rarely does a stator go bad unless the magnets are flying off the rotor and then you have really bad problems.


PS: I remember that in your older posts, you were going to have your buddy rewind a stator rather than buy a new one or good used one for $25-$50. Did he do that? It was never really determined if you had a bad stator.

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 03:31:58 PM
Checking a variety of stators in my parts box, resistance between any 2 wires is around 0.6 ohms. In 1989, they probably wrote the specs for analog meters. Not easy to measure 0.6 ohms on an analog meter, so zero is a good compromise.

Resistance inside a voltage regulator (more than a diode and capacitors) I would not put any faith in. As semiconductor technology changes, I'm sure the internals of it now are not exactly the same as in 1989.

If the voltage goes up when bike is running, then you are trying to charge. What happens to the voltage after going for a ride for 5 or 10 minutes? Did it go any higher?

What is the voltage on the battery with bike off? What is the voltage if you check it an hour later?

My first guess is a defective battery. Maybe it is the wrong type - say with drain on the left and it drains acid out when on the side stand? I've seen that on a bike I bought for parts.

My first bet is a bad battery.

Do you have your old battery and regulator? You can swap them back in one at a time and see what happens.

What prompted yu to change out everything? Rarely does a stator go bad unless the magnets are flying off the rotor and then you have really bad problems.

The reason you want to use resistance and not voltage is because one of the primary jobs of the regulator/rectifier is a diode bridge. You are converting AC into DC. Resistance will let you know if the diode bridge is working properly or not... Voltage wont tell you this.

You can use an ohm meter for the stator but in reality all you really want/need is conductivity.
Loss of electrolyte is very possible and easy to check. But if the battery had a dead cell you would see the opposite (voltage in the battery would be very high since the damaged cell increases the resistance. What this does is lower total capacity and the voltage will drop sharply under the smallest load)...

Quote from: numus on February 13, 2012, 03:36:40 PM

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 03:31:58 PM
Checking a variety of stators in my parts box, resistance between any 2 wires is around 0.6 ohms. In 1989, they probably wrote the specs for analog meters. Not easy to measure 0.6 ohms on an analog meter, so zero is a good compromise.

Resistance inside a voltage regulator (more than a diode and capacitors) I would not put any faith in. As semiconductor technology changes, I'm sure the internals of it now are not exactly the same as in 1989.

If the voltage goes up when bike is running, then you are trying to charge. What happens to the voltage after going for a ride for 5 or 10 minutes? Did it go any higher?

What is the voltage on the battery with bike off? What is the voltage if you check it an hour later?

My first guess is a defective battery. Maybe it is the wrong type - say with drain on the left and it drains acid out when on the side stand? I've seen that on a bike I bought for parts.

My first bet is a bad battery.

Do you have your old battery and regulator? You can swap them back in one at a time and see what happens.

What prompted yu to change out everything? Rarely does a stator go bad unless the magnets are flying off the rotor and then you have really bad problems.

The reason you want to use resistance and not voltage is because one of the primary jobs of the regulator/rectifier is a diode bridge. You are converting AC into DC. Resistance will let you know if the diode bridge is working properly or not... Voltage wont tell you this.

You can use an ohm meter for the stator but in reality all you really want/need is conductivity.

I have no idea what you're talking about or what you're reading into what I posted.

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 03:42:36 PM

Quote from: numus on February 13, 2012, 03:36:40 PM

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 03:31:58 PM
Checking a variety of stators in my parts box, resistance between any 2 wires is around 0.6 ohms. In 1989, they probably wrote the specs for analog meters. Not easy to measure 0.6 ohms on an analog meter, so zero is a good compromise.

Resistance inside a voltage regulator (more than a diode and capacitors) I would not put any faith in. As semiconductor technology changes, I'm sure the internals of it now are not exactly the same as in 1989.

If the voltage goes up when bike is running, then you are trying to charge. What happens to the voltage after going for a ride for 5 or 10 minutes? Did it go any higher?

What is the voltage on the battery with bike off? What is the voltage if you check it an hour later?

My first guess is a defective battery. Maybe it is the wrong type - say with drain on the left and it drains acid out when on the side stand? I've seen that on a bike I bought for parts.

My first bet is a bad battery.

Do you have your old battery and regulator? You can swap them back in one at a time and see what happens.

What prompted yu to change out everything? Rarely does a stator go bad unless the magnets are flying off the rotor and then you have really bad problems.

The reason you want to use resistance and not voltage is because one of the primary jobs of the regulator/rectifier is a diode bridge. You are converting AC into DC. Resistance will let you know if the diode bridge is working properly or not... Voltage wont tell you this.

You can use an ohm meter for the stator but in reality all you really want/need is conductivity.

I have no idea what you're talking about or what you're reading into what I posted.

QuoteResistance inside a voltage regulator (more than a diode and capacitors) I would not put any faith in. As semiconductor technology changes, I'm sure the internals of it now are not exactly the same as in 1989.

That the opposite of what I said. In the regulator/rectifier resistance is more important than voltage. As I stated the purpose of the regulator/rectifier is to convert the generator input (AC) into a DC output. To do this it utilizes a diode bridge (you can call it a full wave rectifier if you want.. they are almost the same thing with minor differences). The only way to tell if a diode bridge is properly working is to check resistance around it.
For a basic example here is a drawing I found online

I believe this diagram only really show half-wave.. but when you add the 3rd wire you get full wave...

The battery is brand new.  Currently holding a charge of 12.6.  It is back on the battery tender now and I will check the output again once the tender says its fully charged.   I checked the leads at the RR plugs on the right side of the bike.  John Bates wrote that.  At least his name is in the link. 

New:
Battery
Stator
Regulator/Rectifier

I hate electrical....I really really do.  Please dont get frustrated because I have to re read these tests like 50 times to somewhat understand my results.

Quote from: Bmarc on February 13, 2012, 04:10:18 PM
The battery is brand new.  Currently holding a charge of 12.6.  It is back on the battery tender now and I will check the output again once the tender says its fully charged.   I checked the leads at the RR plugs on the right side of the bike.  John Bates wrote that.  At least his name is in the link. 

New:
Battery
Stator
Regulator/Rectifier

I hate electrical....I really really do.  Please dont get frustrated because I have to re read these tests like 50 times to somewhat understand my results.

Check the primary power harness that is connected to the starter solenoid..... PITA's had completely melted  and corroded which had caused me to just rewire the starter solenoid independent of the primary power system... There is no reason the entire positive power system should have to go through that solenoid terminal.

Note everything I am saying was based around a 1996 GS500E.... .

When you said it only wanted to output 12.2 V where did you take the voltage? Did you take it across the battery terminals or off the regulator/rectifier with the generator spinning at 5000 RPM?
It is always possible you have a continuity issue off the starter solenoid or in the wire from the solenoid to the battery. Is there any corrosion on the terminal wires?

Another Note: Never unplug the DC output to the regulator/rectifier when the bike is running... You run the huge risk of blowing regulator/rectifier and/or hte generator if it gaps while unplugging... The rest of the power system should be protected by the fuse although i have seen worse happen.

Its all new.  No rewinding of anything.

I know a full wave and half wave. Your drawing doesn't show but adding a 2rd wire to a half wave rectified won't make it a full wave. Half = 2 diodes. 1/4 wave = 1 diode. Full wave = 4 diodes.

I don't believe I told him to measure voltage or resistance in the regulator. You're reading something into things I didn't say.
Measure resistance of stator: yes.
Measure output of voltage regulator at battery: asked what it was.

I was referring to things in in general in the write-up he mentioned. Commenting that whatever you measure in a "black box" can change depending on the parts used in the manufacture. You also said the test in that document was not worth following.

Measuring resistance or passing a voltage through 2 leads of a "black box" can get different results depending on the parts inside the "black box".

Anyway, whatever.

I changed it all because I want to ride this bike a lot.  I want reliability.  Dead batterys dont get me home from the beach.

Quote from: Bmarc on February 13, 2012, 04:28:56 PM
I changed it all because I want to ride this bike a lot.  I want reliability.  Dead batterys dont get me home from the beach.

Sounds like there is a continuity issue somewhere... My money is on the primary power harness if everything else is new... Although there is always the possibility you got a defective product.

Simple test is to go grab a continuity probe (most multimeters have them) and start testing every wire from one end to the other and every crimp point... Look for a 1.0 continuity.... Start wiggling wires while checking them and see if the continuity changes, if it does it means you have a broken wire and you will need to replace it.

I'm not fond of getting into arguments with others about how to do something when trying to help someone else. I'll bow out of this, though I feel a different approach is warranted. WE would just get into a pissing match with each other which is a waste of time. And I was waiting for some voltage readings I had asked for to help diagnose the problem.
Its all yours nemus.
I have had experience on a few bikes' wiring. Only 5 visible in this picture(one in the far left) and a few parts bikes being taken apart.  Not to mention (ok I will) building a digitally sampled organ with over 500 microprocessors, bowling pinsetter electronics, various alarm systems, computers, computer sequenced disco lighting systems and a degree in computer engineering. I do understand a full wave bridge rectifier.

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 04:49:22 PM
I'm not fond of getting into arguments with others about how to do something when trying to help someone else. I'll bow out of this, though I feel a different approach is warranted. WE would just get into a pissing match with each other which is a waste of time. And I was waiting for some voltage readings I had asked for to help diagnose the problem.
Its all yours nemus.
I have had experience on a few bikes' wiring. Only 5 visible in this picture(one in the far left) and a few parts bikes being taken apart.  Not to mention (ok I will) building a digitally sampled organ with over 500 microprocessors, bowling pinsetter electronics, various alarm systems, computers, computer sequenced disco lighting systems and a degree in computer engineering. I do understand a full wave bridge rectifier.

(sarcasm) man you can't even keep your bikes from falling apart, look at that one there, "phenix" - there's barely anything left to it !

(no sarcasm) that's a garage to envy. clean, bright light, love the blue floor. the bikes look happy. i would be happy to work/sleep/eat/whatever in there for sure. props and 'spect ! 

back to the regularly scheduled program. 

At the risk of stepping into a steaming pile.... I'll just say there seems to be no problem with the OP's diagnostic procedure except the "isolation" step.  0.0 ohms is bad. But it ain't makin' 70+ VAC of it really is shorted. Probably a typo.  So, the OP checked all positive connections.... How about negative  (ground) connections? That'll screw you up, too.

The 0.0 reading on the stator wires may be nothing more than accuracy of the meter or what setting it was on. Some meters can be a little off trying to read 0.6 ohms or if set to a high scale, such as 100k ohms, then 0.6ohms would end up as either 0 or 1 ohm depending on the meter. Some meters would not have a low enough scale or the accuracy for things under 1 ohm.
Without steeping on nemus' toes, I'd still like the voltage readings I asked for. My vote is wither bad battery or bad connection from regulator to battery. Bad connection  of either positive or negative from regulator to battery would give the symptoms described - especially of battery and regulator are new.

OK, I'm done.

PS: These bikes. They party when I'm not around and take all their clothes off. That Phenix is a real ornery guy. I like to think that Suzi and Junior got it on. Now there us a fetus bike developing in the womb bike cave. I hope it doesn't turn out all purple and gender confused. Oh, wait, Washington has same sex marriage now so he can be whatever he wants. We like every bike.

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 04:49:22 PM
I'm not fond of getting into arguments with others about how to do something when trying to help someone else. I'll bow out of this, though I feel a different approach is warranted. WE would just get into a pissing match with each other which is a waste of time. And I was waiting for some voltage readings I had asked for to help diagnose the problem.
Its all yours nemus.
I have had experience on a few bikes' wiring. Only 5 visible in this picture(one in the far left) and a few parts bikes being taken apart.  Not to mention (ok I will) building a digitally sampled organ with over 500 microprocessors, bowling pinsetter electronics, various alarm systems, computers, computer sequenced disco lighting systems and a degree in computer engineering. I do understand a full wave bridge rectifier.

Why are you even bringing it up then?
My experience.... Analog and digital towers for coaxial HPGe detectors, digital and analog scaling circuits for beta and alpha gross counting and Photo multiplier tubes for alpha scintillation counting. I also have experience in fixing circuitry for HPLC and GC and some experience in rebuilding a polarimeter.
The point was why would you ever use a static Voltage (variable amperage) meter to determine the proper function of a rectifier in a no-load test?

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 06:30:42 PM
The 0.0 reading on the stator wires may be nothing more than accuracy of the meter or what setting it was on. Some meters can be a little off trying to read 0.6 ohms or if set to a high scale, such as 100k ohms, then 0.6ohms would end up as either 0 or 1 ohm depending on the meter. Some meters would not have a low enough scale or the accuracy for things under 1 ohm.
Without steeping on nemus' toes, I'd still like the voltage readings I asked for. My vote is wither bad battery or bad connection from regulator to battery. Bad connection  of either positive or negative from regulator to battery would give the symptoms described - especially of battery and regulator are new.

OK, I'm done.

PS: These bikes. They party when I'm not around and take all their clothes off. That Phenix is a real ornery guy. I like to think that Suzi and Junior got it on. Now there us a fetus bike developing in the womb bike cave. I hope it doesn't turn out all purple and gender confused. Oh, wait, Washington has same sex marriage now so he can be whatever he wants. We like every bike.

You haven't stepped on my toes, but all I originally did was make the statement that test is not really able to troubleshoot anything. There is a reason the manufacturer did (and still to this day) recommends resistance testing on a rectifier to determine proper functionality.

IDK If Paulcet's post was going to point to this, but there should be 0 conductivity between any wire in the generator and the ground. There should be full conductivity (close to 0 resistance) between any 2 wires in the generator tho....

0 Ohm (or whatever it is ) from generator yellow cable to ground (or case) would mean there is a ground in the generator.

From the manual:

QuoteAC GENERATOR CONTINUITY CHECK
• Using the pocket tester, check the continuity between the
three lead wires.
Check that there is no continuity between the lead wires and
ground.

2nd post I suggested he check to a true ground point (can go directly to negative of battery if he wants)

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 06:30:42 PM
...They party when I'm not around and take all their clothes off. That Phenix is a real ornery guy. I like to think that Suzi and Junior got it on. Now there us a fetus bike developing in the womb bike cave.

Creepy.      

Quote from: adidasguy on February 13, 2012, 04:49:22 PM
I'm not fond of getting into arguments with others about how to do something when trying to help someone else. I'll bow out of this, though I feel a different approach is warranted. WE would just get into a pissing match with each other which is a waste of time. And I was waiting for some voltage readings I had asked for to help diagnose the problem.
Its all yours nemus.
I have had experience on a few bikes' wiring. Only 5 visible in this picture(one in the far left) and a few parts bikes being taken apart.  Not to mention (ok I will) building a digitally sampled organ with over 500 microprocessors, bowling pinsetter electronics, various alarm systems, computers, computer sequenced disco lighting systems and a degree in computer engineering. I do understand a full wave bridge rectifier.

"My name's adidasguy and all my bikes are perfect! neener neener!"

haha! what a nice shop, and nice bikes. I'm officially never posting a pic of my bike on here.

To the OP:
Im not sure if these bikes have a smart voltage regulator or not, but you need to test the battery, highbeams on, at 5k or 6k rpm, as noted. The charge should be around 14v. 
the manual states between 13.5-15.5 over or under that you have to no-load test the generator. Then, if it reads UNDER 75v the gen is bad and must be replaced.

I assume, if your rectifier tests are measured in ohms, it is bad and need to be replaced. Testing the rectifier in voltage is not very meaningful . You should resistance check it the way the manual suggests.

I recommend a no-load test, if its good and if your rectifier test is valid, its the battery.