Yes get a tube on there and route it out of the wind like next to the battery. I have a '93 with 140s in the main and two washers on the needle. I get a slight bog between 6-7k but above that she will rev up to 10k if I wanted to, for the freeway I accelerate from 7k and up, anything below that is too boggy. I tip the scales at 260 and have no problem gettin up to 90-100mph on the speedo. When I did a carb sync it made a big difference on my bike too..

Is there any kind of breather apperatus at the end of the overflow line?  Or is it just an open ended tube?


I also appear to be missing the drain line e on my air box, would that change anything?

Just open for the carb vents, drain for air box actually has a water release valve on it though, I would think not having that would not affect your speeds or performance but would allow dust and stuff to bypass the filter..

Haven't had a chance to run the breather hose yet, I just got home from work.  Needed a drink, needed to get tools, and wanted to post this before I forgot.


I can't run the bike full-throttle at all.  I never really gave the grip a good twist before... 
Half-throttle it'll free-rev up to red-line.  If I go full throttle it bogs, sputters, and won't climb any higher than, like 6k.
Then if I just let go the engine stalls.


On the freeway I top out at 75-80, no matter what gear I happen to be in, but seeing as I have the full throttle issue I have to be in 5th/6th to really even get that fast.


I'll update later today if/when I do some tinkering.

Chicago?  Edens expressway minimum is 90MPH. Ask me how I know this. Been up there twice on the GS. WOT, still getting passed. I was on my way to Antioch, IL on WI border.

I say look at plugs, carb, kinked fuel line, and jets. I had a similar problem on an old gs450 and it was ignition related, but start with fuel.


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Quote from: Soloratov on June 16, 2013, 11:34:18 AM
Really? Where are you riding? I have done some really dumb things...including speeding...20+ over...and never had one even look at me. Granted it wasn't intentionally malicious by any means, just one of those, crap I got caught feelings. I can actually say I don't think anyone I know has ever been stopped by a cop on a bike. That seems odd.

New York City. Cops here hate anything on 2 wheels... not kidding...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newsvideo/7891735/Policeman-pushing-man-off-bike-watched-by-millions-on-YouTube.html

Cops in the city also set up road blocks by bridges and pull over only motorcycles. If anything is amiss, they load your bike up on a truck and impound it at your expense. Of course, if you're all legal, nothing will happen. But why only motorcycles when there are so many illegal drivers also kicking around in the city?

We were riding to New York City back from Rhinebeck from an antique motorcycle show and were on the Taconic. A highway patrolman pulled 4 of us over... we were joking when we asked if we were speeding. (Antique bike riding with us, although he could cruise on that bike if he wanted to). The problem was the antique license plate. Luckily the owner of the bike was very charming and just talked about the history of the bike, so the cop let us go. Thank goodness there weren't any bridge blockades that day.

Updates!

Replaced:
Fuel lines
Fuel filter
Breather hose (routed up and over the air-box, down the battery tray, and out near the swing-arm)
Vacuum plug on the carbs
Flasher (needed one of these while I was at it)

Checked:
Carb needles (stock, no mods)
Carb diaphragms (perfect)

Cleaned:
Carb needles
Jets
Carb uppers
Choke pathway

Adjusted:
mix screws (reset via proper procedure)
idle (set at ~1200)

Added:
Full tank of 93 octane



Verdict?

Well, I can full-throttle it and the bike doesn't complain, sputter, pop, hover at 6k, then die as soon as I let off.  It still doesn't red-line at full throttle, but it gets pretty darn close.
After flicking the throttle the RPMs take their time settling back to idle speed.  That means it's still a touch lean, right?

Around town rideability is better, more instantaneous power, less "all bark and no bite", I can grab and handful and it takes off instead of bogging, high-gear pulls are actually affecting speed rather than just making noise.


I have not gone expressway yet.  I'm tired and it's kind of cold out.
I also have not sprayed around the carbs while the bike is idling to check for intake/vacuum leaks, I used up all my carb spray...


Overall, given the relaxed falling RPM and the not perfect full-throttle, the bike is operating much much better.


As long as I take the bike to work tomorrow, I'll have a high-speed update.\



Thanks for all the help so far, guys.

Cold out?  It's summer. You have not lived until you ride in 18* F. .

Glad it's running better.


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Quote from: jestercinti on June 18, 2013, 10:10:42 PM
Cold out?  It's summer. You have not lived until you ride in 18* F. .

Cold for summer 
In the 50s, overcast, and foggy (wet) all day.  Just kind of sucks to be out because it's just damp enough that the wind makes it feel way colder than it actually is and since there's no sun you don't warm up by stopping...  Other than the engine-block...


If it counts for anything, when I bought the bike it was a couple of counties over.  I rode it for a little over an hour and a half straight, mostly expressway (75+ miles), in 31°F weather.
Had sock liners, socks, boots, long underwear, flannel lined jeans, underarmour, Columbia fleece top, riding jacket, latex gloves, polypropylene glove liners, riding gloves, balaclava, scarf, shemagh, and helmet on.  Wasn't too bad.  Initial cold-shock sucked until I stopped getting colder, then I just cozied up to the gas tank, squeezed my shins in as close to the block as I could, and made fists and directed the bike with my palms.
Stopped once 20 minutes in to pee, did the rest in one whole bite.

I've ridden my last bike ('82 Suzuki GS650GL) in similar conditions for not nearly as long, but with improper attire.  I had to stop at a gas station once after about a half hour because I was scared of frost-bite on my hands.  I even had liners and leather riding gloves, but the wind was really cutting through the seams and cloth parts of the gloves.  Did a bare-hand hi-five to the header a few times, played patty-cake with the block, then grabbed hold of the crank-case cover with both hands giving the whole bike a big bear hug.  Held it until it hurt.  Put the liners back on.  Bear hug.  Gloves back on.  Bear hug.  Actually damaged the leather and shrunk a finger on one of the gloves doing that.
Got me home with all my digits intact...  This is when I thought of using latex exam gloves to beat the wind.  Works wonders, try it next time you go out in cold weather!


Would I do it again?  Yeah, as long as the ends justified the means like getting a sweet deal on a GS500 
Would I do it to commute?  My truck would be my first choice, but if I knew I was going to I'd get a 1-piece snow suit and those cold-weather gauntlets for the bar ends so I could slip my hands inside them to work the controls...





I'm glad it's running better, too.  I've got my fingers crossed that the bike will be better on the interstate.  If not we'd be back to the drawing board 

Expressway update!


Top speed increased from ~75 in calm weather to ~85 with a strong head-wind.
Throttle manipulation went from "sweet-spot the middle"  to "twist to go faster".

I can run the throttle at about 95% as opposed to 50%, now, bike seems like it gets in the 9-10k rpm range no problem now, and I should be able to hit 100 with no wind.
6th gear pull from 70mph to max was all twist.  Didn't complain or bog, just started accelerating.

Looks like I can keep up in the fast lane now.

Still a little buggy, might still benefit from going even bigger on the mains (140s?), but it runs great right now!

Just read the entire thread: you said it has a K&N filter, but which one? There are actually 3 different types if I'm not mistaken. And you said the needles were stock? There were no extra shims (washers) under the clip to richen out the midrange?

Quote from: Big Rich on June 21, 2013, 06:19:09 PM
Just read the entire thread: you said it has a K&N filter, but which one? There are actually 3 different types if I'm not mistaken. And you said the needles were stock? There were no extra shims (washers) under the clip to richen out the midrange?

K&N, conical, inside the air-box.  I didn't install it so I can't give you any more information than that...

No, needles were stock.  Midrange is fine, though, it's the top-end that is bad.





Anyway, I have another update.

Went to the dealer and bought 140, 145, and 150 mains to play around with.

Put the muffler in the band-saw at work, cut the cap off, pulled the baffle out, welded the cap back on.  Sounds great!  A little on the loud side but not too bad.  It'll hold me over until I get a V&H.

And because I wanted to see what it would get me, I put the 150s in the carbs.  Pretty sure it's running too fat now.  I got a lot more low end power, midrange is about the same, but the top end is spotty now.  Not like before where it would bog down, but it kinda just breaks up at 8-9k and it pops a little if I let it jake-brake down a bit.

I'll try the 140s next.

Watcher, go back to page 1 and read Twinrat's post about the washers. That's why I asked specifically about them.

I'll check again but I didn't think the needles had grooves in them to change where the clip goes.

I'll post updates when I find out.


Edit:  my needles only have one position where the clip can go, I don't have any secondary grooves.

You'll need small washers - I think #4 washers? You can buy a package of misc washers from Radio Shack for a couple bucks. They go in between the clip and that thicker plastic ring, raising the needle's height.

i think Big Rich is right about the washer size it should have a hole diameter of .125" or 3.2mm .There should be a washer on top of the needle clip that acts as a seat for the spring in the 05 to 09 models take this as a trial and put it below the needle clip this will lift it to richen your mixture .it should be about .040" or about 1 mm thick .Do not bother with the .020"or1/2mm sizes as there is no discernable difference .needles with grooves have there grooves 1mm apart.the washers are stainless steel .

I'll give it a shot.


I spent all day today running different size jets and playing around with mixture screws.  I tried 140s, 145s, and 150s, and ended up putting the 135s that were in originally back in.  Seems like it runs the best with those.
It's weird though, I had my boss help me try to diagnose the problem and he says that it breaking up with full throttle is usually a sign that it's running too rich.  However, I have the white plugs and exhaust valves to prove that it's running lean.

So we checked everything we could check with basic tools and came to the conclusion that the mixture still isn't right.  And if we can keep going fatter on the mains and it always breaks up top side, yet still runs evidently lean, either it's a problem with the low jets or the needles (diaphragms/sliders not working right?).



It just seems weird to me that shimming the needle would solve the problem.  I mean, it's made to lift up when it's pulled up via the diaphragm by vacuum from the engine.  So, the faster the engine turns, the more air it sucks, the more vacuum it makes, the higher it lifts the needles, the more gas it lets in.  Simple.
Lifting the needles via shims to make up for it not lifting high enough by vacuum seems like compensating for and ignoring a bigger problem.  Like putting a poster over a big crack in the drywall.  It might look better (run better) but there's still a big crack in the wall (slider issue?).

Unless the needles were set too deep from the factory in an effort to lean the bike out.  But I'd think needles are needles and they work how they work, fuel issues would be jet related.



But, this is the first time I'm going this deep into carb related problems and plenty of people know more than me.  If you all say shim the needles, then they shall be shimmed 

I'll post updates with what I find.


If that doesn't help I'm going to the dealer and buying bigger low jets.

You're on the right track thinking about engine vacuum lifting the needles. The part that changes with shims is this:

The slides are what move when the engine creates vacuum (we can skip over a lot of details here), and the needles have a set height in the slides. At the bottom of the "fuel column" is the main jet, it is screwed into the emulsion tube, and the needle never actually comes out of the emulsion tube. By shimming the needles, you are allowing more gas into the motor essentially at all times. While shimming the needles affects your midrange mixture, at high rpm WOT they do affect how much gas is being sucked up thru the main jets.

If you look around for it, there is a graph somewhere online that shows the affect of each part of the fuel system (pilot jet, main jet, needle jet, etc.). There isn't any kind of "shut off point" for any one part: they all overlap. I'll see if I can find that, actually......

http://www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=16745.0

Found it! You don't have to read all of it if you don't want to. Some of it even isn't 100% true / relevant.

Okay, first off, im a fan of your paint job.
now for a serious answer, ive heard its a common problem when you have after market filter setups (pods or lunchbox etc.) that the wind at higher speeds will create a kind of "bubble" around there making the airflow drop significantly with the vacuum created if i remember right, the over-flow gets back-pressure as well. If anything else comes to mind (probably after waking up) i'll update this