Kind of a rant 



So, I got off early a few days ago and decided to visit a Suzuki dealership out of town with a much bigger inventory than my local one.


Get to looking around, see a few things that are interesting, and out of curiosity I ask the salesman what I'd get for my '96 GS500 on trade-in.
He asks me how many miles (23,000), condition of tires (brand-new Michelin Activs), and aesthetic condition (new paint, looks beautiful).

Hops on the computer does some tippy-tapping, and spits me out a figure that knocked my hat off!
$700.


What!?


So he turns the monitor around and shows me Kelly Blue Book's website.  Then he switched it to suggested retail price.  That was $1200, and that was for an "excellent" condition bike.
I had figured that a $1200 figure would be my trade-in value, and the bike would be worth more around $2000.


Now I payed $1700 for mine (abused paint, minor carb issue, new tires, new wheel bearings, new pads/rotors, new bars/grips, new chain, new air filter...) and figured I got a decent deal on it.  I don't see those bikes going for less than $1500 on craigslist unless they won't start or have issues.  In fact, in my area (chicago) right now there is a '92 "E" "parts bike" with no title for sale for $900, a '95 "E" with 5000 miles for $1750, a 2000 "E" with 5400 miles for $2500, and a 2005 "F" with a few upgrades for $2600.


Now granted those prices will come down out the door (who doesn't haggle, right?) but are people just asking way too much for these bikes and getting it because other people are naive, or is KBB full of crap?

If their suggested retail price is $1200, then locally those bikes should be selling for $1000 or even less...

KBB/NADA are only so reliable..

Its a scale thing as well. as the bikes age the KBB has to drop..

Supply and demand and seasonal changes effect it.

Drop yours on CL and get it sold while its hot then shop for another bike. Dealers are always going to undercut you on any item. Always.

Dealer prices are always lower. A good GS will get $1000 more private than dealer.

Quote from: Snake2715 on June 22, 2013, 11:19:26 PM
Drop yours on CL and get it sold while its hot then shop for another bike. Dealers are always going to undercut you on any item. Always.

I got mine not to long ago, I gotta at least keep it for a few months before I sell it 

Besides, the only bikes I'd really upgrade to right now are either a naked SV650 or a Buell, and good luck finding those in a dealership's used section!   


The new SFV650 "Galdius" is pretty neat, but it's also kinda fugly...  If I got one I'd have to at least change the headlight out for a round bucket, and at that point why didn't I just get a SV650 

A dealer has to come out on top on every move they make, weather it's taking in a trade in or making a sale...it's always been that way 

Quote from: Suzuki Stevo on June 22, 2013, 11:46:19 PM
A dealer has to come out on top on every move they make, weather it's taking in a trade in or making a sale...it's always been that way 

Plus the bit added on top of whatever they sell .... 'Just because' 

I'm not so much amazed by the dealer, I understand they are in it to make money so they will offer you less and charge you more when compared to a private sale.

But what I am amazed by is how LOW the KBB price is... The dealer didn't lowball me, KBB is lowballing me!

That's always the way. Unless the bike is a vintage and rare collector's item, it won't be listed for much. Even then, a vintage - owner would still sell it privately and make more money than going to a dealer.

A 1996 bike is a bit on the older side even though nothing changed on them.

But as said before, dealers always try to buy low and sale high.

I used to work in a car dealership...the formula we used to use was book value minus the price of any repairs, either minus 10% or plus 5% for high or low milage, minus 20% (no matter what), which guaranteed us a profit, even if we gave a discount. That's kind of standard practice over here to ensure a profit.

Dealers need to make a profit, and the only way is by ripping off (not afraid to say it) the customer.

The books also NEVER count any improvements, alterations or upgrades to the vehicle (minus an aircon or a security system). So any bodywork, spraywork etc on a 'straight trade counts against you.

This is the norm...sales people sometimes 'pad' trade-ins if they're really desperate for a sale or already have a buyer in mind and on record.

But as a norm, selling privately will always get you more than trading...where you can find a customer that will actually  VALUE the custom paint work, fly screen, improved suspension etc. That you've put on your vehicle.

Over here a good condition standard gs will set you back R16 000 (about 1 500 dollars).

And another thing I might add, if you take a bike to a dealer for trade in with $1,000 worth of mods/accessory's and you think your bike is worth that much more.....you might as well take them off because the dealer doesn't give a rats arse about them   

Its a 17 year old bike with limited appeal !!! Dealers don't want bikes like this clogging up showrooms. They want newer and more desirable models that sell quickly and that they can turn decent margins on.

I am surprised they even quoted you a figure, unless they were trying to scare you off. Did you ask how much discount they would give for no PX?

You paid 1700 for your bike and on your own admission were happy with the deal....... isn't that all that matters?

Or has the realisation of trade values and how much sellers actually make struck home?

Let me say this again.

I am not surprised by the dealer.  At all.  I used to work in retail sales at a small military surplus store, I understand the concepts of "buying to sell" and desirable merchandise.  If the bike is worth $1200, they can't give me $1200 because they need to sell it for $1200.  No big deal.
$1200 - $700 is $500 gained by them.  They need to pay employees, insurance/tax/electric/gas/rent on the facility. That's how it works...



What amazes me is the quote I'm seeing on KBB when compared to local results.

In the past KBB has been usually pretty spot on with their quotes as far as what you can expect to find the item for locally.

Like, if I poke in my 1994 Jeep Cherokee with 17X,XXX miles, 4.0L, 4x4, 5-speed, rust on the body, no mechanical issues, I get a figure of about $1200.
What did I pay for it 3 years ago?  ~$1200.
What will I sell it for now?  ~$1200.
What do I find local Cherokees selling for?  ~$1200.



A bike that I can see averages around $1700-$2000 locally, is actually worth $1200?


And that is what I find astonishing.

That's the other thing that KBB can't take into account....supply and demand.

And, just because you see comparable bikes advertised on CL at those reference prices, unless you confirm the actual sold price afterward with the seller, you really have no idea what price was actually paid. Maybe some are sold close to the asking price, but there's really no way to prove anything.




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Quote from: jdoorn14 on June 23, 2013, 02:31:20 PM
That's the other thing that KBB can't take into account....supply and demand.

And, just because you see comparable bikes advertised on CL at those reference prices, unless you confirm the actual sold price afterward with the seller, you really have no idea what price was actually paid. Maybe some are sold close to the asking price, but there's really no way to prove anything.

Yup.




Either way, it was kind of disheartening to see what my cycle is actually worth 

This is the OZ pricing for my 1990GSE


Valuation Prices
Private Prices   $1,900 - $2,200
Trade In Prices   $1,200 - $1,400
Price Guide(EGC)
$5,149*
Price Guide


But dealer only pays $500 here as well