Will I regret moving to a smaller engine?
I really like the idea having ABS; am I giving ABS too much credit?

A little history:
-At the ripe old age of 36 I bought my 01 gs500e for 1.5k.  Put in about 600 bucks in maintenance since then including: lowered a bit, new tank and tank lining, petcock and fuel lines, and a bunch of general maintenance.  I'm the exact opposite of a wrench monkey so a fair amount of that cash went to labor.  I'm happy to say it is running like a champ.
-I've been riding exclusively the past year and a half around a college town.  No real twisties or highway riding.  I top out around 60 mph before the wind starts making me uncomfortable.  I ride daily but probably only put about 1,500 miles on her since I got her.
-I've locked my rear wheel a few times in hard braking but no accidents or close calls yet (except that time I dropped her in the parking lot, tipped over 3 other scooters too oops).
-Thruxton or t-100 is my dream bike but no ABS so I can't use that as an excuse to upgrade yet.  696 is an option but they are pretty pricey and not sure I could slap a bag of groceries on the back.

Recent poorly lit pic of my baby...http://i.imgur.com/eOTdw.jpg?1

Thanks!

If I get one more bike I think it will be a CBR250R that I can still blast thru some twisties with.  Maybe an 80th birthday present to myself, that's only a few months away now.  The 02 GS will last that long, maybe it'll even outlast me.  I have no interest in anti-lock brakes, old dog new tricks thing I guess.   

http://www.cycleworld.com/video/video_articles/2011/kawasaki_ninja_250r_vs._honda_cbr250r_-_video

I ride small displacement bikes all the time (200, 225 and 250's), it's all in what you like.  I loved the old Ninja 250's and wouldn't mind having a CBR250.  The ABS is not something that appeals to me but if you can afford that option and it gives you a little piece of mind then why not get it??  I have a Nighthawk 250 with drums front and rear, non-ABS discs would be a step up for me   

-Jessie

It's a 250; why would it even NEED ABS? lol...

My next bike will probably have ABS. I've been in two accidents that would have been avoided with ABS. No matter how much you practice braking, you don't know how you will respond in a panic situation and 9 times out of 10 the ABS can get you to a stop faster than without, assuming you even keep the bike upright with the normal brakes. I've ridden an R1200GS with ABS and had a lot of fun getting up to speed and slamming on the brakes as hard as I could -- its actually fun!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Zv3Sacl7JQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3MfLcJLaCs

Forgive me if this sounds harsh, but you'd likely be better served putting the money you'd spend on a CBR 250 into some rider training. 

If you're locking up the back brake you're using it too much, and you're doing that because you're not using your front brakes enough.

Has someone somewhere along the way told you that if you squeeze the front brake level too hard you'll flip it right over?  I've found over the decades that this comment is one that's contributed greatly towards riders never learning how to brake properly and effectively.

If you regularly ride in the rain, the dirt, or through streets strewn with leaves, ABS can be a great benefit.

If you're locking up your rear in normal around-town driving, even if it's an emergency situation, you're doing it wrong.

That said, the CBR 250 is a pretty slick bike. 

Quote from: dougdoberman on May 03, 2012, 12:18:42 PM
If you're locking up the back brake you're using it too much, and you're doing that because you're not using your front brakes enough.

While quite possible, it isn't the only thing he could be doing wrong.  He may be braking the front hard and a panic stop and not compensating by lessening his pressure on the rear brake to prevent a lock up.

-Jessie

Thanks for the responses so far.

True I'm still pretty inexperienced and I have been trying to practice emergency braking just not sure I'll do it correctly when the shaZam! hits the fan, thus why I like the idea of abs. I'm mostly wondering if the little 250 will still be as much fun to drive around as my 500 is or how much I'll miss the additional horsepower.

wait, so basically youre saying you might be willing to drop from a solid, lightweight 500cc to a 250cc just because the 250cc has ABS? there must be other positives for the 250cc or this seems like the answer is obvious...

If you were buying it purely for a commuter and runabout possibly, but if you head up into the twistes you will immediately regret it. Long term ideally I would love to have a 250 for the commute, and my weekend fun bike.

Quote from: dougdoberman on May 03, 2012, 12:18:42 PM

If you regularly ride in the rain, the dirt, or through streets strewn with leaves, ABS can be a great benefit.

What other kind of riding is there?


Regarding the power of the a 250: If the CBR has similar power to the Ninja, you will be fine on any motorway. Just not as fun as a 500. If you a big guy, remember the CBR has a rather small stature. I know I would look kinda silly on one.

Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 03, 2012, 05:25:55 PM

Quote from: dougdoberman on May 03, 2012, 12:18:42 PM

If you regularly ride in the rain, the dirt, or through streets strewn with leaves, ABS can be a great benefit.

What other kind of riding is there?

I never ride my street bikes in the dirt.  The streets in the part of the world where I live are generally fairly clean.  Are you not in a first world country?  And honestly, since I have other modes of transportation that include roofs, I seldom ride in the rain these days.

All three of these are really out-of-the-norm situations for most riders, I'd think.  Which is sorta my point.  If he's a typical rider in a typical envorinment, ABS will make no real difference unless faced with a very atypical situation. 

If he, or you from the sound of it, is a rider who needs ABS in order to regularly avoid accidents, I'll say again that more rider training is in order.  Or, perhaps, four wheels.  If you can't panic brake without locking up the rear, stop using the rear when you panic brake.  It provides a neglidgeable amount of stopping power in a panic stop anyways.  And if it's providing more than a tiny amount, learn to brake better.  That'll save your life LONG before ABS will.   Hell, that's not even training that you need to pay for.  Just find a deserted stretch of road or parking lot and brake as hard as you can.  Do it repeatedly until you're comfortable.  Then do it a little harder.


Not saying that he wouldn't enjoy a CBR250, but to consider trading a bike solely because of atypical road conditions just seems foolish, unless one regularly rides on roads where those conditions are actually not atypical. 

Quote from: slipperymongoose on May 03, 2012, 01:38:38 PM
If you were buying it purely for a commuter and runabout possibly, but if you head up into the twistes you will immediately regret it. Long term ideally I would love to have a 250 for the commute, and my weekend fun bike.

If you think that a 250 CBR wouldn't be as fun as a GS500 in the twisties, you've either never ridden a 250 CBR (or Ninja) or you've never ridden anything that really qualifies as "twisties." 

I think you need to find a Honda demo ride and try it out. It's the only way you'll know for sure.

Quote from: Bluesmudge on May 03, 2012, 05:25:55 PM

Regarding the power of the a 250: If the CBR has similar power to the Ninja, you will be fine on any motorway.

I have not had the opportunity to ride a CBR250 but all the reviews I have read say it is equal (or superior) to the current Ninja 250.  Rider mag had a good write up but I can't find it online.  Here's another one:  http://www.cycleworld.com/2011/03/04/kawasaki-ninja-250r-vs-honda-cbr250r-comparison-test/

-Jessie

Quote from: dougdoberman on May 03, 2012, 06:42:48 PM

Quote from: slipperymongoose on May 03, 2012, 01:38:38 PM
If you were buying it purely for a commuter and runabout possibly, but if you head up into the twistes you will immediately regret it. Long term ideally I would love to have a 250 for the commute, and my weekend fun bike.

If you think that a 250 CBR wouldn't be as fun as a GS500 in the twisties, you've either never ridden a 250 CBR (or Ninja) or you've never ridden anything that really qualifies as "twisties." 

You couldn't be further from right if you had gps. Before buying my GS I rode nothing but 250's lots n lots of test rides, on motorways and a few twists. Essentially 250 is 250 it's not a powerhouse. Then I blindly bought my GS with no test ride my logic at the time being 500 is more than 250 and therefore I won't be disappointed in twistes like I had been constantly advised by everyone who rode bikes that I talked to. But to the OP if your buying purely for abs it's not worth it, but if your running round town and such then maybe, depends on what you wanna do. If your concerned about locking your wheels I would suggest going to a quiet carpark an practicing your technique.

Quote from: dougdoberman on May 03, 2012, 06:42:48 PM

Quote from: slipperymongoose on May 03, 2012, 01:38:38 PM
If you were buying it purely for a commuter and runabout possibly, but if you head up into the twistes you will immediately regret it. Long term ideally I would love to have a 250 for the commute, and my weekend fun bike.

If you think that a 250 CBR wouldn't be as fun as a GS500 in the twisties, you've either never ridden a 250 CBR (or Ninja) or you've never ridden anything that really qualifies as "twisties." 

I grew up riding 250s and can tell you that YOU are joking if you think a 250 would be as much fun as the 500? There is no comaparison between the 2?
What you can do with the 500 in the twisties is not achieveable on the 250. Speed out of corners on the 500 is sweet for example. Same cannot be said for the 250? Just too slow for my liking.

Quote from: dougdoberman on May 03, 2012, 12:18:42 PM
Has someone somewhere along the way told you that if you squeeze the front brake level too hard you'll flip it right over?  I've found over the decades that this comment is one that's contributed greatly towards riders never learning how to brake properly and effectively.

If you regularly ride in the rain, the dirt, or through streets strewn with leaves, ABS can be a great benefit.

If you're locking up your rear in normal around-town driving, even if it's an emergency situation, you're doing it wrong.

I wholeheartedly agree with this. First emergency bake situation was on a dirt bike, on dirt... too much front brake and went down.... now on the road I need to train myself to use the front brake properly because of the first experience I had.....  I still lock rear and have to adjust my braking in emergencies every now and then*, but I'm getting much better. (just do a little fishy then readjust and stop quickly)

*I'm a fairly new rider

Quote from: Vo0Do0 on May 04, 2012, 01:42:10 AM

Quote from: dougdoberman on May 03, 2012, 12:18:42 PM
Has someone somewhere along the way told you that if you squeeze the front brake level too hard you'll flip it right over?  I've found over the decades that this comment is one that's contributed greatly towards riders never learning how to brake properly and effectively.

If you regularly ride in the rain, the dirt, or through streets strewn with leaves, ABS can be a great benefit.

If you're locking up your rear in normal around-town driving, even if it's an emergency situation, you're doing it wrong.

I wholeheartedly agree with this. First emergency bake situation was on a dirt bike, on dirt... too much front brake and went down.... now on the road I need to train myself to use the front brake properly because of the first experience I had.....  I still lock rear and have to adjust my braking in emergencies every now and then*, but I'm getting much better. (just do a little fishy then readjust and stop quickly)

*I'm a fairly new rider

The beginning rider courses I have seen say that if you lock the rear brake you should just leave it locked until you stop.  Not sure of the logic behind it though.  Maybe they think worrying about the rear will make you unstable     Truth be told, the rear end is so light in a panic stop that the rear brake probably isn't doing much.

-Jessie