jets vs washers a couple questions

[cbcanada]

my bike is 1999e
i am running 40/125 with one washer and 3.75 turns out

previously i was running 2 washers with the same set up

i am pretty clear on what and how the jets work and how they richen up the bike.

but why do we add washers? why not go to a bigger jet? what do the washers do?

[The Buddha]

You richen 1/2 throttle to 3/4 with washers under the needle. The effect of that washer under the needle stops @ 3/4 cos the needle taper flattens out @ 3/4 lift of the slide. Mains will richen that range, heck they richen all the way across, but 3/4 and up will also be affected.
In fact the effect of mains is like a straight line up slope starting @ idle. Needle taper starts @ idle and rises till 1/2 where it becomes flatter and @ 3/4 it drops off.
The needle is an obstruction in the emulsion tube. It is tapered so as you pull it out, its less of an obstruction.
The mains are the inlet orifice into the emulsion tube.
Cool.
Buddha.

[cbcanada]

okay what about zero to 1/4 and then 1/2 throttle is that just the idle jet and mothing else?
no washers no main jet involved?

[Big Rich]

Take a look at the 7th picture down (read the entire post if you want):
www.dotheton.com/forum/index.php?topic=16745.0

Basically, everything in a carb affects everything else. Even though that pic doesn't show the main jet affecting anything until 1/2 throttle, it does. If you were to remove your mains, the bike would die as soon as you touched the throttle (if it would even idle).

[cbcanada]

okay thanks i read that article... very informative. my problem is in the idle to 1/8-1/4 throttle.. i get hesitation and bogging. its not "crisp" accelaretion

once the rpm clears 3000-4000 and the throttle is at 1/4 bike opens up nicely and pulls

after reading the article i realize the washers have nothing to do with idle - 1/4 thottle. my problem lies in the mixture screw and thr pilot jet

so first question is since washers have nothing to do with it, should i go back to two washers?

second question is the original idle to 1/4 throttle hesitation problem .

i have a k&n filter with the restrictor and my pilot jet is 40 and i have tried 3 to 3.75 turns out everything between but the bogging is there.. my jets are clean so thats not the issue

any ideas?

[Soloratov]

Your setup sounds just like mine. I am running 40/125/2 washers/3 turns, K&N Drop in. So. I had a similar issue when I was first rebuilding my bike, and I will start by asking, have you taken the carbs off and looked inside them? Is the bike running overly rich? My plugs looked like coal after a few minutes and the exhaust was awful.

[cbcanada]

Your setup sounds just like mine. I am running 40/125/2 washers/3 turns, K&N Drop in. So. I had a similar issue when I was first rebuilding my bike, and I will start by asking, have you taken the carbs off and looked inside them? Is the bike running overly rich? My plugs looked like coal after a few minutes and the exhaust was awful.

yes i have taken the carbs out and looked at them.. they look fine.

should i be checking my plugs after idle to 1/4 throttle? since thats where the problem lies. i have not yet done but i will.

so is yours running the same or did you figure anything out?

[Big Rich]

Did you try taking the restriction off the K&N? Or maybe turning the mixture screws out 2.5 turns?

[Soloratov]

well my bike needed new rubber on both sides of the carbs, but I also had a cracked slide guide, (the piece the emulsion tube connects to), on both sides so I was getting fuel sucked through uncontrollably. Try a spray test. Start the bike, and spray wd-40 on the joints of the carbs. This at least tests for air leaks. Sounds like you get too much fuel but I had both issues at the same time so I recommend it.

For the plugs, pull em. Clean them really good. Then start the bike, let it idle for 5 minutes or so, then give it that little throttle and then shut it off and check them. Black is bad. There is a plug chart reference both here in the forums and on the main site I believe.

How long to do leave the choke on?

[cbcanada]

Did you try taking the restriction off the K&N? Or maybe turning the mixture screws out 2.5 turns?

i think i am to lean at 2.5 out i start getting a little back firing and the exhaust sounds poppy.

i will try restrictor off

[cbcanada]

well my bike needed new rubber on both sides of the carbs, but I also had a cracked slide guide, (the piece the emulsion tube connects to), on both sides so I was getting fuel sucked through uncontrollably. Try a spray test. Start the bike, and spray wd-40 on the joints of the carbs. This at least tests for air leaks. Sounds like you get too much fuel but I had both issues at the same time so I recommend it.

For the plugs, pull em. Clean them really good. Then start the bike, let it idle for 5 minutes or so, then give it that little throttle and then shut it off and check them. Black is bad. There is a plug chart reference both here in the forums and on the main site I believe.

How long to do leave the choke on?

i will check plugs...
today was very hot and i live the choke on for a minute and then drive off and turn it off after about one mile

another reason i am thinking that i am too rich is my idle keeps changing from 1000 to 1500 constantly and infind myself adjusting idle several times during a ride

[Soloratov]

usually an idle issue like that is a lean problem not rich. I had that too after I fixed my leaking emulsion tube problem. Thats why I suggest the spray test. It's easy, and tells you right where the problem is.

[cbcanada]

usually an idle issue like that is a lean problem not rich. I had that too after I fixed my leaking emulsion tube problem. Thats why I suggest the spray test. It's easy, and tells you right where the problem is.

okay let me richen up the screw more and see what happens

[cbcanada]

just thought of something.. could this be a lean surge when jumping from pilot to needle? if so i would either remove the washer or richen up the mixture more right?

[Soloratov]

I would have to know what the plugs look like, and what the results of the spray test were first to tell ya which way to go. Don't change anything until you do those 2 things, if you do we will just be guessing each time.

[cbcanada]

ok here is the plugs

[cbcanada]

wd40 test is okay no leaks

[cbcanada]

ok so here is the update. the plug pictures above are from after my adjustment. i am hoping they look okay?

at first they were pitch black... ritch?
so i screwed in and came up 3 turns
now the bike is running fine no sluggish 1/8 throttle.

i think the problem was ( rookie mistake) i was not screwing all the way down before i screwed back up. i was afraid to break somethinf so in essence i was probably 5 turns out

okay now i am k&n drop in with restrictor, 40/125, 3 turns out and one washer.

should i go back to two washers?
what difference would i see?

[bombsquad83]

You are right around the "recommend" jetting now.  2 washers, 1 washer, or no washers?  Try it any way you please and see how it goes!  Those plugs just look like they ran rich at idle for a long time, which makes sense considering you were 5 turns out.  Clean them up or replace them if you want to get a clear sense of how your jetting is now.

[cbcanada]

You are right around the "recommend" jetting now.  2 washers, 1 washer, or no washers?  Try it any way you please and see how it goes!  Those plugs just look like they ran rich at idle for a long time, which makes sense considering you were 5 turns out.  Clean them up or replace them if you want to get a clear sense of how your jetting is now.

well thats how they look after the cleaning. before i cleaned them they were like charcoal...  so you are saying they still look bad? here is what they looked before cleaning