Polls and surveys are at times very misleading (I think purposely sometimes by the questions asked and the people giving them) and very selective. For the last 4 elections (this one included) the major media/networks and Hollywood are pulling out all stops to elect their pick long before time to vote. And you can blatantly see who they are for. Don't forget that our Congress's ratings are even lower than Bush's.

Quote from: jserio on October 15, 2008, 05:44:33 PM
i agree with most of the things you said...except the "side economics" and "trickle down therory". sure sounds great. except that i don't see that it has worked. if it worked so well, why are major employers such as ford, gm etc closing plants? why did honda move their motorcycle plant back to japan? why are the oil companies still raking in huge profits and not hireing people or improving their processes? i want as many jobs to stay in america as possible, same as you. but think about the other side of the equation for amoment. lets say we end these tax cuts and said company says, "hey, i can do this cheaper in mexico so i will." that's fine. when it comes time for them to import said product, double their tax on it. hit them in the pocket book. sure this needs to be done with tact but i think it would work better than the way things have gone recently. let's discuss age. mccain is old, fairly old. obama is a younger guy. i'm getting the impression that mccain is still thinking of how things should be run in terms of how they were 30 years ago when he first got into politics. obama is a younger guy, should be more "in tune" to how things should go in this "new age". things are different. times are changing, so our policies and how we handle things need to change as well. you mention religion. i won't ask yours, it's not any of my business. obama's parents registered him as muslim, this is fact. but if your parents had baptized you as catholic, could you not grow up and make your own choice as to your religion? of course you could, so can obama. you mention that his church believes Christ was black. and how this is wrong etc. how do you know? were you alive during Christ's time? i can say this, from my perspective of history, Christ was not the meek looking, fair skinned man with long hair that is portrayed of Him. He was a carpenter, a Jew. he escaped several times those hunting him because he blended in with the crowd. if He was so light skinned and long hair and frail looking he would have stood out like an albino at the apollo. my point is, nobody really knows. a mans relationship with God is his own PERSONAL relationship, nobody elses. what goes on between you and the Man upstairs is your business. you stated yourself all that matters is acceptance that Christ came and died for our sins. everything else, is meaningless i think.

Places like Ford, as you mention, are struggling, just as so many other businesses are struggling right now, because of the price of gas.  No one is buying cars much right now, and for sure not gas guzzling things.  They're going for super small cars...but even then, people are buying because of the recession.

I agree that a younger opinion may be needed, but Obama's, and his advisors opinions are not the right ones.  There are so many advisors that the president has, that it's not entirely bases on their knowledge alone.  This elderly man thinking is coming straight from the propaganda of Obama.  He's been trying to make him look old and frail since the beginning of the campaigns.  Then making him the young dashing man that's going to come save the day.  It's not age that will help or hurt, it's their policies.

The other thing about your import tax theory, is that if it's more expensive to import things, that's going to be passed onto the consumer, and also hurt the company, so they will have layoffs and less pay for the employees.

Yes, I said that he very well could believe something else now.  It's just that he has sympathysed with Muslims on multiple occassions.  And the big part of this, is that his campaign is claiming that he NEVER WAS.  That is where I find it the worst (besides the fact that Muslims want me dead).  He was Muslim growing up.  He was raise Muslim.  He went to school as a Muslim.  He worshiped as a Muslim.  Now they are saying he never was, and wasn't raise Muslim.  THEY'RE LYING TO US.

I have been very open with my religion.  I'm a Christian, a true Christian.  I know because history proves that Christ did exist.  He was a Jew.  I agree, he wasn't fair skin like Catholics make him out to be.  He was a jew, with jewish color skin.  He did blend in...with the jews.

I agree that a man's relationship with God is his own personal relationship, but when he is misconstruing what Christianity really is, then it becomes my, along with every other Christians' business.  If you would take the time to research the church that he attended, then you would know that it's not Christian.  I'm really tired of this argument.  Non Christians keep bringing up, "why do you say his church isn't Christian? you have no right."  I've proven that it's not, there is so much out there that proves that it's not, and if you took two seconds to look at the church's teachings, then you'd know that it's not.

Your last line, saying that the only thing that matters is believing that Christ died for our sins.  This is true, however, you must believe that the correct Christ died for your sins.  Believing in a black Christ because it suits your Social Seminar of a Black Power church, is not believing in the son of God dying for your sins.

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him."
-John 3:16-17

'You shall have no other gods before me.
You shall not make for yourself a graven image,
or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above,
or that is in the earth beneath,
or that is in the water under the earth;
you shall not bow down to them or serve them;
for I the Lord your God am a jealous God,
visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children
to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me,
but showing steadfast love to thousands of those
who love me and keep my commandments'
-Exodus 20:3-6 (RSV)

Creating a Black God to worship is creating a false idol.  A false god.  God himself has no skin color, he has no human flesh.  He is the light.  Jesus has skin, sent to Earth through Mary as a Jew, as the way to God, as God.

Quote from: Cal76 on October 16, 2008, 12:07:59 AM
Bush's policies sure do seem to have failed, but maybe I am playing up his mistakes.  Except that, his approval rating is about 20% and the majority of the country believes that the economic crisis is mostly due to the republicans.  I am sure a few americans can get things wrong, but 80%??  It is unrealistic to believe that 80% of the country is wrong and the last desperate 20% are hanging on hoping everything will be ok.  Or maybe they are waiting on a disaster to happen so, attention will be taken away from the obvious incompetence.

What about Hitler?  He has such a high approval rating.  Over 80% of the country thought he was doing the right things.  They were all brainwashed.  Now that they look back at it, they realize it, but he used the very tactics that Obama is using now.  Hopefully soon, everyone will realize that they were all brainwashed by propaganda, and smooth rhetoric that appealed to emotion rather than the truth.

Quote
And, why does it matter if someone portrays jesus as black??  To me it seems kind of smart, in that, it could make both adults and children relate better.  If the message is the same, why would anyone, whose goal is to "spread the word", care what race that jesus is seen.  To me, it seems a whole lot smarter than the typical hell, fire, and damnation method.  I may have a completely different view if the baptist churches I went to as a child would have tried as hard to relate to me as opposed to using fear to get me to believe.  How is it possible that he sees jesus as black be a reasonable reason to exclude him?  Unfortunately, we will never know a politican's real beliefs because to believe in anything outside of christianity is certain political suicide.  I wish our leaders could express their true feelings as they once did.

I answered this in my last post.  Cause he was Jewish, that's why.  It's in history books, no one denies that he was Jewish.
The problem with teaching something like this, is because it's not true.  The church teaches what is in the bible, not things that are made up to scare people into believing.  I'm not saying that people have never been scared into believing, cause that happens all the time.  But you can't take parts out of the bible that you want to take out, just cause it will get people to believe better.

Quote
By the way, none of this matters because McCain has done such a crap job at nearly every aspect of his campaign, a miracle is about the only thing that would keep Obama out of the white house.  The cool and collected Obama would have to do something pretty bad to not win so, looks like you are gonna have to deal with it.

What does it matter about how well someone does campaigning?  Campaigning nowadays is just a way to deceive people.  And yes, Obama has done a great job of this.  He will probably be the next president.  And like I've said before in this post, I just hope everyone realizes it before he destroys this country.

It's actually going to be really funny when people start to realize he was the wrong choice.  People are going to get taxed (shh, he doesn't want you to know this).  And small businesses are going to go out of business.  People are going to be layed off left and right, and pay cuts, or at least a pay freeze.  You know what?  You guys are probably still not going to see what's really going on.

Everyone knows how bad of a president Jimmy Carter was.  I expect Obama's to be worse.  He's further to the left on all issues than Carter, so we are going to be in for a world of hurt.

Quote from: Revere2 on October 16, 2008, 04:05:52 AM
Polls and surveys are at times very misleading (I think purposely sometimes by the questions asked and the people giving them) and very selective. For the last 4 elections (this one included) the major media/networks and Hollywood are pulling out all stops to elect their pick long before time to vote. And you can blatantly see who they are for. Don't forget that our Congress's ratings are even lower than Bush's.

You're very correct.  In my statistics classes, we really learned how data can be manipulated.  Statistics depend on so many different factors.  Even double blind tests can have influence.  If you looked at the news for instance about the second presidential debate, the liberal networks' polls said that it was about a tie.  Fox's polls said that McCain won by a landslide.
It depends on your sampling, and what is thrown out of the polling if found unsuitable.

Elections aren't the best way to get the correct person in office.  With all the campaigning, there is too much nonsense that is pushed into our heads.  The best way to do it would, be given a list of each candidates voting records, and of each candidates platform and what they intend to do.  Nothing else.  That way everyone could decide for themselves without age, skin color, religion, sex, or anything other than issues and past record.  The second the news reports on something, the sampling would be off.

If jesus was jewish, shouldn't everyone convert to Judaism??  BTW I agree 100% that manipulating the bible to say what you would like it to say in order to get people to believe is indeed wrong.  My point was alot more along the line of, how does this seemingly insignificant thing totally exclude him from the possibility of being a christian as opposed to changing things to suit an agenda.  The agenda changing was basically a joke.  To me, it just doesn't make sense and Im sure Im not alone.  My history books have nothing about jesus or his race in them.  The main historical reference is in the bible, which is not a history book.  It is a series of books written by men who had visions long after said events happened.  The bible has been interpreted at least four times that I know of and I am sure details have been lost in the translations.  The fact that there is no proof is what the whole faith thing is all about.  If it were fact and if proof existed, then faith would not be necessary.  We do not have a faith in gravity because there is proof of its existance.  The fact is that there is no proof and most likely will never be proof.  The fact is that all you have as far as proof is your own personal faith which, does not make it a definative fact.  I may deny that he is jewish?  And in doing so, I would have just as much proof in saying that he is not as anyone does in saying that he is.  If you look at the bible as words of wisdom like Aesop's fables and not take everything so literally, it would probably be more benificial.

Quote from: Cal76 on October 16, 2008, 10:40:10 AM
If jesus was jewish, shouldn't everyone convert to Judaism??  BTW I agree 100% that manipulating the bible to say what you would like it to say in order to get people to believe is indeed wrong.  My point was alot more along the line of, how does this seemingly insignificant thing totally exclude him from the possibility of being a christian as opposed to changing things to suit an agenda.  The agenda changing was basically a joke.  To me, it just doesn't make sense and Im sure Im not alone.  My history books have nothing about jesus or his race in them.  The main historical reference is in the bible, which is not a history book.  It is a series of books written by men who had visions long after said events happened.  The bible has been interpreted at least four times that I know of and I am sure details have been lost in the translations.  The fact that there is no proof is what the whole faith thing is all about.  If it were fact and if proof existed, then faith would not be necessary.  We do not have a faith in gravity because there is proof of its existance.  The fact is that there is no proof and most likely will never be proof.  The fact is that all you have as far as proof is your own personal faith which, does not make it a definative fact.  I may deny that he is jewish?  And in doing so, I would have just as much proof in saying that he is not as anyone does in saying that he is.  If you look at the bible as words of wisdom like Aesop's fables and not take everything so literally, it would probably be more benificial.

Judaism is Christianity, pre Jesus.  Jewish is also a nationality, as also a religion.  He was Jewish nationality, and the turning point from the Jewish religion to Christianity.
The bible has never been proven wrong historically.  It is very accurate about everything and historians will attest to that.
You are correct that it is my faith which I base my comments on.  There won't be definitive proof until the rapture.  And even then, people won't believe.
Your last line of using the bible as a means of benefiting ourselves in this world is absurd.  The bible is the word of God, that Christians refer to for eternal salvation.  It's not to make this life better.  That's actually what Obama's church has done.  They have taken the bible, manipulated it, and preach things in a certain way so that all their 'Afro people' can benefit in this life, and free themselves from the oppression of the White man.  They don't worship God and Jesus as their Lord and Saviour.  They use their god and their jesus as a means of propelling social hate.

yup ( now awaiting the arrival of the finger-pointers)

<They have taken the bible, manipulated it, and preach things in a certain way so that all their 'Afro people' can benefit in this life, and free themselves from the oppression of the White man.  They don't worship God and Jesus as their Lord and Saviour.  They use their god and their jesus as a means of propelling social hate.>

Are you joking??  This is just silly and possibly racist, dont you think? 

Quote from: Cal76 on October 17, 2008, 11:43:51 AM
<They have taken the bible, manipulated it, and preach things in a certain way so that all their 'Afro people' can benefit in this life, and free themselves from the oppression of the White man.  They don't worship God and Jesus as their Lord and Saviour.  They use their god and their jesus as a means of propelling social hate.>

Are you joking??  This is just silly and possibly racist, dont you think? 

Have you researched their church?  If not, then go do that and then come back and we can have a discussion.

Baaaahhhhh, woof woof (vote Obama) woof woof, Baaaaahhhhhhhh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyvqhdllXgU

Here's some more info on the Birth Certificate thing...a lot of new information as well, including supposedly being born at two different hospitals in Hawaii, or really being born in Kenya, then registered in Hawaii 4 days after his birth...

watch the video here too - http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/2008/10/12/israelenews-obama-born-in-kenya-his-grandmother-says-yes/#more-426

IsraelENews: Obama Born In Kenya? His Grandmother Says Yes
Posted by admin
October 12, 2008

Someone is lying.  According to Obama's Kenyan (paternal) grandmother, as well as his half-brother and half-sister, Barack Hussein Obama was born in Kenya, not in Hawaii as the Democratic candidate for president claims.  His grandmother bragged that her grandson is about to be President of the United States and is so proud because she was present DURING HIS BIRTH IN KENYA, in the delivery room.  -This, according to several news sites and Pennsylvania attorney Philip J. Berg (see video below) who is, surprisingly, a life long democrat himself.  Berg is the former Deputy Attorney General of Pennsylvania, and he has an impressive background in his activities as a democrat, but his support for the party seemingly stops when it comes to his trust in Barack Hussein Obama.

Many U.S. voters are suspicious of the Democratic candidate's past, and Berg filed a lawsuit to force Barack Hussein Obama to produce a certified copy of his original birth certificate to prove that he can run for the office of President of the United States. However, he is being fought. The DNC On Sept. 24  filed a motion to dismiss the Berg action.  Why?  What is there to hide?  Why not produce the original birth certificate and be done with all the suspicions against Barack Hussein Obama?

A few months back, a birth certificate WAS posted on the internet which shows that Obama was born in Hawaii.  Yet some say this birth certificate is a forgery and again, his grandmother states that she was present at the birth, in Kenya. So what is the truth?

One explanation is that Obama's mother Ann Dunham, flew to Kenya in 1961 with Obama's father to meet his family.  According to some news reports, Ann Dunham, was not accepted well by her husband's family because she was white:

"Obama's family did not take to Stanley Ann Dunham Obama very well, because she was white, according to Sarah Obama. Shortly after she arrived in Kenya Stanley Ann decided to return to Hawaii because she later said, she did not like how Muslim men treated their wives in Kenya. However, because she was near term the airline would not let her fly until after the birth of her baby. Obama's grandmother said the baby—Barack Hussein Obama, Jr.—was born in Kenya and that shortly after he was born, Stanley Ann returned to Hawaii."

However, by the time she wanted to leave Kenya, it was during the late stages of her pregnancy.  She was not able to board a plane because the airlines wouldn't allow women so close to birth to fly. It is instead believed, that Barack Hussein Obama was born in Kenya as his grandmother apparently stated. Then, after he was born, his mother returned with him to Hawaii where his birth was REGISTERED on or about August 8th, 1961, in the public records office in Hawaii.

There is also a discrepancy in what hospital Barack Hussein Obama was born in, even if he was born in Hawaii.  Reports by his own sister in two separate interviews state that he was born at two different hospitals– Kapiolani Hospital and Queens Hospital–in Honolulu.

The Times Herald even reports: "the senator's grandmother, brother and sister, who live in Kenya, believe they were present during Obama's birth in the African country."  Here, the Times Herald uses the word that his family 'believe' he was born in Kenya (perhaps to avoid possible law suits by Obama's Truth Squad?).

I myself, not wanting to believe what I see, did some searching around, and this is what I came up with:

Obama was born on August 4, 1961, at the Kapiolani Medical Center.

and here it says:

Barack Obama was born at the Queen's Medical Centeron 4 August 1961.

So which hospital was it, or was he really born in Kenya?  And why is this simple matter so confusing and disturbing? Do the search your self and plug in these key words:

Obama born Queen's Medical Center and then Obama born Kapiolani Medical Center in a Google search. You will see he is reported to be born in two diferent hospitals.  A miracle!  Maybe he IS the Messiah (grin).

What's so hard about knowing something so simple as which hospital or country someone was born in? And if it is simple, then why doesn't Barack Hussein Obama just present the court with his original birth certificate to be analysed and proven?  The onus of proof is on him, not the American public of which he wants their trust in him to be their leader.

So, who is lying? Barack? His grandmother? His sister? Someone is.

p.s.  Dr. Jerome Corsi will be on my show today (Sunday) where I will be interviewing him about his recent trip to Kenya to promote his new book, The Obama Nation, and to see if he can find Obama's birth certificate.  Instead, he was arrested, held at gunpoint and deported from Kenya.  He's back in the States now and wants to talk.

Another issue that was brought to light by that video, is the fact that Obama must have become an Indonesian Citizen to attend school there when he did.  In doing so, he would have had to denounce any citizenship of the US.  This means that if he did come back and go through the proper means to become a citizen again, even if he were born in Hawaii, he would be a Naturalized US citizen, not a Natural Born US citizen, and therefor, not eligible.

There is a lawsuit which will force Obama to bring forth actual documents (not ones posted on the internet), but currently he is refusing.  The DNC is backing Obama in this, but the people have a right to know if the person they are supporting, donating to, and voting for is even eligible.

Once this lawsuit goes through, I wounder how this is going to pan out...cause if it gets dismissed, then it's going to be appealed with the supreme court.

If anyone thinks that Obama's Economy would be better, watch this....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oz_rdCMXVOg

He was part of the Feddie Mac and Fannie Mae downfall, even receiving political donations from them.

i'm placing my vote based on running mates. 

Quote from: jserio on October 17, 2008, 02:52:08 PM
i'm placing my vote based on running mates. 

May I ask why?

because i can.    seriously. i think i just flipped a coin and said, ok that's who i'm voting for. we're f%&ked either way. mccain will die in office, (leaving us with mrs. palin) and obama will be assassinated (leaving us with mr. biden)  f%$k, i can't wait for this election to be over with.

Quote from: frankieG on October 15, 2008, 11:47:20 AM
religion and politics...two things that people get very emotional about...please do not take offence.

its hard to get me emotional over those things seeign as to how I have no religion, and no politics.  Im an ass hole that only lives by a few rules.

Quote from: Cal76 on October 17, 2008, 11:43:51 AM
<They have taken the bible, manipulated it, and preach things in a certain way so that all their 'Afro people' can benefit in this life, and free themselves from the oppression of the White man.  They don't worship God and Jesus as their Lord and Saviour.  They use their god and their jesus as a means of propelling social hate.>

Are you joking??  This is just silly and possibly racist, dont you think? 

Look up the definition of racism. per that definition youll see it is not 

there is more evidence that jesus DID NOT exist than that he did.  please read and see below, personally i don't believe in fairly tales.   give the movie a few minutes to get up to speed.

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Academy/2850/JesusHist.html


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-594683847743189197

Listen,
Jesus sure as hell wasn't white.

Ehhh Middle East? give me a break

Only took 18 years of catholic school,  catholic university, catholic graduate school, and a jesuit medical school to figure that one out.