So, to the best of my knowledge, motorcycle chains don't stretch. So I'm wondering if the following scenario is possible, or I'm going insane.

Before my recent 1200 mile tour, I adjusted my chain to about 1" free play. It must have been really loose before this, since I noticed the difference immediately. Also, the centerstand holder had been all bent up in a fall (before I got the GS), so I bent that in, and the centerstand stopped nicking the chain.

Now that I'm back, I've noticed my chain is too loose again. It has probably 2ish inches play. That's .8" too much. So I loosen the axle, try and tighten it, ... no luck. I notice the axle nut is gunked up, so I take it off to clean it. Also remove washer and wheel alignment guide. I realize the axle is as far back as it can physically go. However, before my trip, I could tighten the chain to have no play. 

What happened? Am I going mad? Do I need a new chain. (I think my current chain is stock, and I'm running stock sprockets. It's not badly rusted or worn, but I do know that some O-Rings have dropped off). 

I would say your sprockets and chain are worn.Maybe the previous owner put a chain on with to many links.If the front sprocket has less than 16 teeth that could also explain why the axle is so far back.Your sprockets should be 16/39 if they're stock,and the chain should be a 520 o ring with 110 links.

Sounds worn out alright. How many miles are on the chain?

Considering it's lost some O-rings, I'd look into a replacement.

You're correct chains don't stretch, but they do wear out. Replace your chain and if the front sprocket is worn replace that too.

  Thanks guys. Guess I'll chalk up "new chain and sprockets" on the list of things to do. I'd like to jump to a 17T front anyway (I don't really need off-the-line acceleration. In fact, I seldom use even a quarter of my throttle). I'm not sure how many miles the chain has on it, but I'm guessing at least 5k (and no more than 15k). Neither sprocket is really worn tho.

Any recommended chains? Should I go for a stock one with O rings, or use one with a master link?

Chains "stretch", but it isn't due to the side plates lengthening.  What happens is the pins and bushings begin to wear, causing the chain to increase in length.  As the chain gets older the wear will increase exponentially. 

When is it time to replace?  I figure it is time to replace the chain when I can't go 600 miles without an adjustment.  If you keep your chain lubed and clean it should last 15,000 to 20,000 miles.  More if you use an automatic oiler.

also check to see if your chain adjusr plates on the rear are bent in to , if they are take them off and straighten them

Quote from: surf.seppo on May 11, 2008, 11:22:40 PM
Any recommended chains? Should I go for a stock one with O rings, or use one with a master link?

I've used this DID o-ring chain with clip type master link  for over 130k GS miles getting 15-20k miles from chains:

http://www.chaparral-racing.com/Chaparral/productr.asp?pf%5Fid=312%2D1910&gift=False&HSLB=False&mscssid=04B851FA54AA0467D9B8DC6ACF91CCAF

New front sprocket every other chain and I've have never replaced a rear sprocket putting up to 80-90k miles on my bikes.

http://www.chaparral-racing.com/Chaparral/product_family.asp?family_id=16780&mscssid=D47D97C9B1C7478488B341185A8030E1&Gift=False&GiftID=

Chain stretch = yes

If you think about it, the gs chain has 110 links (ok, more or less depending on your cogs) if each link were to stretch just .001", that's  110 thousandths of stretch, basicly 1/8" of an inch.

Add some time, lots of heat cycles, lots of dirt, some neglect (hey, we all do it) and you could expect .005" of stretch (or wear) of the chain and/or cogs easily. Multiply by 110 links... you see where I'm going.

I'm also at the end of my adjusters now. I only have 24,000 miles on the original chain, and the previous owner let it rust. I've taken pretty good care of it, so your milage may vary.

Quote from: gsJack on May 12, 2008, 06:39:27 AM

Quote from: surf.seppo on May 11, 2008, 11:22:40 PM
Any recommended chains? Should I go for a stock one with O rings, or use one with a master link?

I've used this DID o-ring chain with clip type master link  for over 130k GS miles getting 15-20k miles from chains:

http://www.chaparral-racing.com/Chaparral/productr.asp?pf%5Fid=312%2D1910&gift=False&HSLB=False&mscssid=04B851FA54AA0467D9B8DC6ACF91CCAF

New front sprocket every other chain and I've have never replaced a rear sprocket putting up to 80-90k miles on my bikes.

http://www.chaparral-racing.com/Chaparral/product_family.asp?family_id=16780&mscssid=D47D97C9B1C7478488B341185A8030E1&Gift=False&GiftID=

Hello again, all. I'm researching chains and sprockets since it's about that time. Anywho, I was looking in my haynes manual and it specifically says in big bold letters to "NEVER install a drive chain which uses a clip-type master (split) link," as in the one quoted above. I know you guys are gurus on here so I was wondering what the deal is?

Chains stretch a lot, they stretch unevenly and they get kinked.
They also lose rollers and make ffffffrrrrrt ffffrrrrrt sounds if they do. Chains are a POS, we need belt drive.
Cool.
Buddha.

Also if you just got the bike long rides can actually loosen up frozen links so that could also add to chain slack. Another way to check chain wear is to pull on the back section of the chain on the rear sprocket. If you can lift it more than about a half link off the sprocket it's time for a new chain because a chain like that can jump off the sprocket even on a properly adjusted chain.

And I put clip things all the time. It doesn''t come off unless I screwed up at install which I ahve.
Cool.
Buddha.

a simple test to see if your chain is worn out enough to be repalced,
lift the chain as high as you can with your left hand, then take the chain at the rear sprocket in the middle and try to pull it of, if it moved 5 mm or more you need a new chain...

If you are getting excessive chain wear (stretch) its either because the chain needs replacing or you are adjusting it too tight. A loose chain is not good but a too tight chain is much worse as it overloads the bearings in the wheel, gearbox and swingarm pivot.
Note that it is very easy to overtighten the chain if the bike is on the centrestand when you do it. That's because the chain will get tighter when the weight is back on the rear wheel. Ideally adjust it while someone is holding it up for you, while they're sitting on it. Its a bit of a pain to do that while moving the bike to and fro to find the tight spot, but the only way to do it properly.
I've found with my GS500 that after doing it a few times I can do the adjustment with it on the side stand (so there's still weight on the back wheel) and estimate a few mms extra slack, so that its right when I'm riding it.
+1 on the 17 tooth sprocket.

I agree with mole, and when you buy a new chain, get a quality O-ring chain, and don't pay more than $65 for it. cheap non-o-ring chains  I got my chain replaced at my local shop, because I had to go with a longer chain to fit the new 17 tooth front sprocket, and the whole job was slightly over $100.  I didn't have anything to cut the chain with, so I let him do it.  He also installed a clip-type master link once he cut the chain.  I've had them forever, and see nothing wrong with them.  You will LOVE the 17-tooth front sprocket, especially on the highway! 

As far as chains not stretching, that depends.  A quality O-ring chain slowly wears, and stretches very little.  A POS $35 non O-ring chain stretches AND wears, very quickly, and unevenly,even if you oil it every week, which I did.  My bike came with it, new chain and sprockets at the time.  I had to adjust it 3 times in 4,000 miles and after the third time I couldn't find a happy medium between having a little slack at the tightest point without having too much slack at the loosest.  If I were king it wouldn't be legal to sell them for motorcycle use.

Oh, and you are definitely insane, that's why you ride a motorcycle! 

Yup, everyone has said it. They do stretch. I have almost 17,000 on my original chain and I have to adjust it every 1500 miles or so. I'm sure I'll put a new one on before 19,000.

Sorry, I don't think people realized that this is an old thread. I bumped it with my reply regarding the use of a chain with a master link since the haynes specifically says not to.

If I am getting a new chain and the chain comes with a master link, it isn't necessary to remove the swingarm correct? I assume since I can just break the chain off it wouldn't be necessary.

Thanks
-Steven

Quote from: SNsSuzuki on March 23, 2009, 06:05:01 PM
Sorry, I don't think people realized that this is an old thread. I bumped it with my reply regarding the use of a chain with a master link since the haynes specifically says not to.

If I am getting a new chain and the chain comes with a master link, it isn't necessary to remove the swingarm correct? I assume since I can just break the chain off it wouldn't be necessary.

Thanks
-Steven

Yeah, master link chains are cool, you can put them on pretty easily. Don't worry about destroying the old chain when you're getting it off, you won't need it anymore. Just grab the nearest saw, grinder, bolt cutters, or whatever else you've got lying around to get it off...

Steven:

The Haynes manual has a lot of good info to help you fix your bike, but if you take all their advice you'll always be working on your bike, or having a shop do it.  Their recommended service intervals are insanely short, and they probably don't want us using master links so we have all our chains replaced at the shop.  But my local shop uses master links too!  I'll bet there are more master link chains on bikes than not.  When it comes to certain things, Haynes is full of dung.